Western Chassis Flip Bracket/U-bolt options

[chevymotocross]

I know this is suspension, but it is 73-87 specific so I posted here. I want to tackle the rear, adding the Western Chassis flip kit and shackles. I was already aware, from fellow members here, that the u-bolts will be wrong. Sure enough, they are. I have no idea why they are still producing them wrong, o well.

I've included some photos of what I'm dealing with. As you can see, the u-bolts are wider than factory.... no good. I included a photo of how stock width ubolts are on the extreme edges of the Western plate slots.

What are my options here? Do I get all new longer factory size u-bolts made at the local suspension shop and enlarge the plate slots?

Also, I know in the picture with the Western plate, that is not where it goes, I just wanted to show how the ubolts are on the edges of the slots.

[scooterskoolkustoms]

new u bolts autozone $19.99 or www.speedwaymotors.com $ 3.99 each plus shipping.

[slamd83c10]

i dont see what could be wrong, i have used them before and yea they were wider than the factory but when used with their plate they worked fine due to their plate being slotted...but if you need to change ubolts, then autozone carries universal 3" wide ubolts that work fine, they just have to be cut off after getting torqued up...too long..

[baclay9]

What the F!!! I just ordered a flip kit from them and this is the first time I have heard of this issue. I am very interested in the solution as well

Edit: looks like you got some answers while I was typing. So the ubolts are wider but do fit the new plates? Cool

[slamd83c10]

they did on the 2 trucks ive used them on before. they are wider than factory but the slots on the new plates help with this issue,..

[bigblock73]

Sure the wider ones will fit, but they are technically the wrong size...and I wouldn't run them...they wont "hug" the axle like the correct sized 3" ones will.

I bought new ones locally.

Don't ever re-use your old u-bolts either...especially since new ones are cheap and you already ave them out.

[slamd83c10]

yea but they arent much wider and by the time i torqued everything up it was really snug. once they started tightening up they snugged closer to the axle... its not the whole entire ubolts that were wider, the ones i had were just wider at the end, like they were spread a little during manufacturing, even the ones from auto zone are a little spread until you tighten everything up...

[slamd83c10]

bigblock73, i do inderstand that and yea if the whole u bolt was wider then no way should they be used, but if they are just spread then everything should be ok...

[chevymotocross]

Yes, I know never to run original 23 year old u-bolts. Still not sure which way to go with this. I understand completely what bigblock is saying. Even my father agrees.

Then again, like slamd83c10 says, if they aren't as wide when tightened, maybe they are just fine. I know one thing, if this were a hot rod truck with a BUILT motor, I would not run the WC bolts.

bigblock, when you installed the factory sized bolts, did you have to enlarge the WC slots? It appears you would have to. The bolt rubs badly on the ends of the slots and would probably tear up the threads when tightening and interfere with torquing.

I'd like to see how many on this board, besides slamd83c10, have successfully been using the WC bolts, especially with more built engines.

[westofb]

I went to the local farm store and bought a set of trailer axle mounts for 5200 lb axle (they are for a 3" tube), they cost me less than $20, welded them to the bottom of the axle tube, reused my old u bolts and woa la....flip kit was done. I dont see the issue with re using the old u bolts unless they are rusted badly (pitted threads missing, etc). I did have to invest in a set of shock extenders, and once together, I was unhappy with the rake of the truck so I bought and installed a set of 1" lowering blocks, the stock u bolts were still long enough to re use them again even with the lowering blocks.

[slamd83c10]

if u reuse your stock ubolts then yes you would need to open the slots a little to keep from ripping the threads.. most flip kits come with 1/2" ubolts and the stock ones are 9/16,..didnt mean to answer for someone else but i figured this was something that could be agreed upon..

[bigblock73]

Nope, didn't have to modify anything running the correct size 3" U bolts...they fit in there like a glove.

[slamd83c10]

i had to on my cousins truck, he ordered just the flip no u bolts, he used the stock ones and they were tight, so we had to widen the slot...like we always see in the aftermarket world, one persons vehicle might work differently than the next, not everyones is gonna work out the same, it happens....youll never know what u got until you get in there and tear apart and see what works and what doesnt, i know im a noob on the forums but i have personally been around these trucks for 20 years, worked on 50+, i have a shop in donaldson,ar and i mainly do some custom work and suspension on chevys and around here these are the most popular... but i mainly deal in mcgaughys kits...

[bigblock73]

If you are reusing the stock u-bolts and doing a flip kit, I can see why they would be tight...just like others have said, once you tighten them, they "suck in"...so your old u-bolts have this memory and will indeed require slotting the holes.

Someone should measure the flip kit brackets and see what the dimension is between the slots...just for ****s and grins.

To me, it is simpler, safer, and better looking to use new U-bolts when putting on brand new parts.

You wouldn't put a dirty worn out floor mats in your cab after you just installed new carpet would you? ;D

[westofb]

Originally Posted by bigblock73

You wouldn't put a dirty worn out floor mats in your cab after you just installed new carpet would you? ;D

No probably not...but if they were in good shape I might clean them and re use them again. I built my truck to drive, not for being towed around in a trailer...and if you want to climb under it and diss my surface rusted re used factory parts, that is up to you. Why not re use parts if they are servicable? I have to work hard for what little I got, why spend money on stuff that does not need replaced! I rarely climb under my truck and wax the u bolts, I could care less what they look like, just that they do the job they were intended to do.

[Rogue_Sentinel]

you can just order new u bolts from lmc
http://www.lmctruck.com/icatalog/cc/full.aspx?Page=145
and call it a day . they will fit
and they are grade 8 bolts

[bigblock73]

Originally Posted by westofb

No probably not...but if they were in good shape I might clean them and re use them again. I built my truck to drive, not for being towed around in a trailer...and if you want to climb under it and diss my surface rusted re used factory parts, that is up to you. Why not re use parts if they are servicable? I have to work hard for what little I got, why spend money on stuff that does not need replaced! I rarely climb under my truck and wax the u bolts, I could care less what they look like, just that they do the job they were intended to do.

Whoaa, calm down there. Don't take my personal preferences personal...geez. Step away from the computer

I don't wax my u-bolts, diss others trucks, or tow my trucks on trailers...for the record.

It is more than the looks of the u-bolts, these things are stretched when installed, stressed and worn from everyday use, don't like to come off easily, and get stretched more when re-installed.

To me, the convienience and safety of new ones far out-weighs the few bucks I'll save re-using old ones that may, or may not be safe.

[chevymotocross]

Absolutely! Especially in my truck's condition. You see the pictures, look at that New England rust/rot. I spent close to $700 for all this suspension equipment. I'm making darn sure I don't skimp out on bolts.

Thanks for the info so far guys

[Fastest32]

Originally Posted by westofb

No probably not...but if they were in good shape I might clean them and re use them again. I built my truck to drive, not for being towed around in a trailer...and if you want to climb under it and diss my surface rusted re used factory parts, that is up to you. Why not re use parts if they are servicable? I have to work hard for what little I got, why spend money on stuff that does not need replaced! I rarely climb under my truck and wax the u bolts, I could care less what they look like, just that they do the job they were intended to do.

I like that!

[bigblock73]

FWIW fellas, spend 15 minutes surfing the web for U-bolt specs and information, EVERY page I have found has said to replace the U-bolts when removing them for suspension work. These things stretch, threads weaken due to everyday use, and due to the mfr'ing process for the bolts and nuts, the nuts actually damage the threads when installed, and removing and reinstalling cross-threading occurs and will prevent proper retorquing when reinstalled. Just because they look fine to our naked and un-trained eye, doesn't mean they really are.

But hey, if you want to skimp and save $40, go ahead...but the consequences could be much wor$e if even one of them fails.

[bigblock73]

Originally Posted by westofb

No probably not...but if they were in good shape I might clean them and re use them again. I built my truck to drive, not for being towed around in a trailer...and if you want to climb under it and diss my surface rusted re used factory parts, that is up to you. Why not re use parts if they are servicable? I have to work hard for what little I got, why spend money on stuff that does not need replaced! I rarely climb under my truck and wax the u bolts, I could care less what they look like, just that they do the job they were intended to do.

So those custom wheels, custom paint, and c20 to c10 conversion were all "needed"?

Not sure why you had to quote me, as if I were directing my post to you (which obviously I wasn't), but I will return the favor and quote you and try to understand your logic as you were trying to understand mine.

[westofb]

Originally Posted by Fastest32

I like that!

Thanks, it seems that alot of folk on here think the best advise is to dump money into your truck. If I was concerned about the u bolts being to rusty, or threads were missing, sure I'd change them, but why spend money if you don't need to.

[westofb]

Originally Posted by bigblock73

So those custom wheels, custom paint, and c20 to c10 conversion were all "needed"?

Not sure why you had to quote me, as if I were directing my post to you (which obviously I wasn't), but I will return the favor and quote you and try to understand your logic as you were trying to understand mine.

Your advice was to always replace the u bolts earlier in the thread. My advise was to re use parts if you can, why burn $20 on u bolts if the originals are servicable. No none of the stuff you mentioned were needed, they were wanted additions. But since I was able to re use good original parts, I had more jack to toss at the wanted items. I have yet to learn the art of crapping out saw bucks yet, so I try to make my money go as far as possible.

Back to the original post, since your kit came with u bolts, use them, does it really matter if they are a little lose on the axle tube? I am sure WC doesn't want to wind up in court because they sold you something dangerous.

[bigblock73]

Originally Posted by westofb

Your advice was to always replace the u bolts earlier in the thread. My advise was to re use parts if you can, why burn $20 on u bolts if the originals are servicable. No none of the stuff you mentioned were needed, they were wanted additions. But since I was able to re use good original parts, I had more jack to toss at the wanted items. I have yet to learn the art of crapping out saw bucks yet, so I try to make my money go as far as possible.

Back to the original post, since your kit came with u bolts, use them, does it really matter if they are a little lose on the axle tube? I am sure WC doesn't want to wind up in court because they sold you something dangerous.

My point exactly, how do you know they are still usable and safe? Just by looking at them? There is a reason just about every suspension kit, lift or lower, comes with new hardware...because the old stuff can be fatigued and be potentionally unsafe. There are people and mfr's who study this for a living, we don't.

Again, do some research on the subject, and don't just go by what you have always or already done.

And as far as the incorrect sized u-bolts. Why put 3.25" u-bolts on a 3" axle tube? Seems to me GM had 3" ers on there for a reason...I'd trust that over an aftermarket mfr's interpertation any day.

I guess if you want to buy pants one size bigger and take the risk of having them fall down on ya in public, I'll buy the pants that fit me best and not worry about it.

[bigblock73]

Originally Posted by westofb

Thanks, it seems that alot of folk on here think the best advise is to dump money into your truck. If I was concerned about the u bolts being to rusty, or threads were missing, sure I'd change them, but why spend money if you don't need to.

It isn't about "dumping money", its about being safe as possible.