Barn find Nova (sort of)

[mosesburb]

I was doing some digging and came across an old Nova.



It is a 1971 with a TBI 350, 700R4 trans, four wheel disc brakes, aluminum radiator and suspension that is set up for handling turns as opposed to straight line stuff. It is dark metallic green with a black interior. It has been sitting for several years, but I figured I could have some fun with it.



It has suffered a bit from sitting, but it seems to have weathered it fairly well.

This is actually my first car. I bought it twenty-some years ago with a 250 I6 and a powerglide automatic. It had four wheel drum brakes and power steering. I first converted the ignition to HEI, then I converted it to front disc brakes. Those two items were the best bang for the buck I think I ever got on this unit.

Over the next few years, I proceeded to build it in a manner consistent with what is now called "pro-touring". That is, to make old muscle cars handle and stop better. Pro touring did not exist when I built this thing. I had to make, modify and engineer what can simply be bought out of a catalog today. I picked up some mail order catalog recently and was amazed at the products produced for these old cars today. So, yeah, I was the odd man out when I was building this as all of my buddies were building their stuff to go fast in a straight line, and here I am figuring out suspension geometries, spring rates and trying to adapt parts made for other platforms to fit my needs. I guess it worked out fairly well as this thing stopped unbelievably well. It turned well also, but the limiting factor was the tires. Sixteen inch tires were the big performance tire, but I could not afford them at the time so I ran 15 x 7 rally wheels with 235/60/15 BFG radial T/As. These days, 17" GM rally wheels are just a click away. Hmmm.

So, I had started to dig it out a few years ago. I had to go through the entire fuel system to get it running. Two in-tank fuel pumps, all of the steel braided AN fuel line, rebuild the throttle body and replace the fuel filter. I also put a brand new Optima battery in it. I had it running good and swore I would not let it sit again. Yup, you guessed it, life happened again. It slid over to the back burner where it rested quietly for the next few years, until a few weeks ago when I went out and looked at it and pulled the gas cap. It smelled old and a bit stale, but not TOO bad. Hmmm. I bet this stuff will burn. Hmmm. So, my brand new Optima was dead now and would not accept any new electrons so before I bought another battery, I figured I should at least try something. I ran some wires over the fence to my truck and hooked up the fuel pumps. They worked. Or at least one of them worked. I let them run for a bit and eventually they primed and I had pulled the feed line to the motor off and had it running into a funnel that went into the tank. Fuel eventually came out. The first second of fuel was scary looking, but after that it was just a bit yellowish--not bad. It didn't smell putred either. I hooked the feed line up to the motor and ran the pumps to check for leaks. All of the AN line was good except for the line that went up the back of the motor. I changed that out and replaced a fitting that cracked and the fuel system was good. I pulled the oil fill cap and it was still wet in there so I decided to try firing it up. I hit the key and it lit up like it had run yesterday. Smooth and even as can be. Sweet.

[project 67 sub]

sweet, now pull it out wash it up and get some better pics lol.

[1985-GMC]

Very nice! Subscribed to this one as well, whats your plans for it?

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by project 67 sub

sweet, now pull it out wash it up and get some better pics lol.

I'm getting there.

Originally Posted by 1985-GMC

Very nice! Subscribed to this one as well, whats your plans for it?

Nothing too heavy. Right now I am just trying to get it moving under its own power. Probably get some restricted insurance on it and motor it on the weekends. My boy wants to take it to a car show already. We'll see.

I did get it out to start cleaning it:



I jacked it up, pulled the tires/wheels off of it and started washing it. I started at the driveshaft and went up one side and back down the other back to the driveshaft on the other side. Man, there was alot of dust on that thing. Looks pretty good. A few flaws in the paint developed, but I'm going to have a friend of mine take a look at it and let me know what he can do about them.

It was dark by the time I finished, so no pics of the clean(er) body. I actually washed the body twice and I think it could stand to be washed again.

[63chevyll]

Nice, when did you do the conversion
Posted via Mobile Device

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by 63chevyll

Nice, when did you do the conversion
Posted via Mobile Device

I did the fuel injection in or around 1992. It was a pretty new setup back then. A bunch of parts were not readily available for it that are just a click away today. I used a Howell harness that is pretty rudimentary compared to their harnesses today. Very basic. Back when I was running this as regular transportation I was considering building my own harness, but that is about as far as I got.

Most of the other mods were done by 1995. After that it was just driven and maintained. My mom put a boat-load of miles on this car. I actually de-tuned it a bit because she would beat on it pretty good. How many people have to de-tune vehicles for their mom??

[63chevyll]

thats cool,

not many people do TBI Conversions anymore. I still like themm but seem to just stay in trucks.

looks good from the pictures you posted. Ive always liked the 68-72 body styles also

[hgs_notes]

That optima battery might be salvagable. There are articles on line on how to get them to take a charge. Basically, you hook the battery to another battery with jumper cables, then hook the charger to it. The charger will see a partial load from the good battery and start charging. Hot Rod did this last year I think.

Heres the article:
http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/g...ery/index.html

I like the idea of the 17" rallyes. The car already has a sleeper look to it.

[Average Joe]

Nice car! I love rallys on this body syle.

[FRENCHBLUE72]

I love this body style of nove keep us posted..

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by 63chevyll

thats cool,

not many people do TBI Conversions anymore. I still like themm but seem to just stay in trucks.

looks good from the pictures you posted. Ive always liked the 68-72 body styles also

Thanks!! When I did this conversion I had a choice of TBI or TPI. I sold alot of parts for the TPI but sold very few for the TBI systems. I have always been a fan of simplicity (mechanical diesel in my Sub), so I opted for the TBI. Yeah, TBI has kind of fallen by the wayside especially in cars. Trucks still get them occasionally.

Originally Posted by hgs_notes

That optima battery might be salvagable. There are articles on line on how to get them to take a charge. Basically, you hook the battery to another battery with jumper cables, then hook the charger to it. The charger will see a partial load from the good battery and start charging. Hot Rod did this last year I think.

Heres the article:
http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/g...ery/index.html

I like the idea of the 17" rallyes. The car already has a sleeper look to it.

I tried that and it didn't work. No biggie as I am done with Optimas. I bought a relabeled Deka AGM from Batteries Plus for less money than an Optima and it is a far superior battery. I have had a few Optimas die early deaths recently and in doing some reading on different sites, I am not alone. The Dekas have rave reviews and are less expensive and MADE IN THE USA!!! That is the best part. It may not be relative, butit sure seems like Optimas quality went south when they moved produtcion to Mexico.

It looks like no 17" rallys. I just coughed up a bunch of money to replace my dry rotted 15" tires so the 15" rallys stay--for awhile.

Originally Posted by Average Joe

Nice car! I love rallys on this body syle.

Me too!!

Originally Posted by FRENCHBLUE72

I love this body style of nove keep us posted..

Thanks. Yeah, it is my favorite body style for Novas.

[brn agn]

Gotta love the 68-72 Novas! It looks like you have a great platform to work with.

[884x4Sub]

Nice car!.....cool that you are resurrecting it.

Im sorry I have to do this but... www.pro-touring.com

its another site I hang on

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by brn agn

Gotta love the 68-72 Novas! It looks like you have a great platform to work with.

I hope so. This thing survived some healthy usage (and occasional abuse) back in the day.

Originally Posted by 884x4Sub

Nice car!.....cool that you are resurrecting it.

Im sorry I have to do this but... www.pro-touring.com

its another site I hang on

Yeah, I figured it had sat long enough. Time to do something with it. I have actually perused that site a couple times. I haven't really spent much time looking around though. Probably safest not to at this point......

[mosesburb]

I got it cleaned up a bit and put the new tires on it. I pulled it over by the shop and put the grille, trim, filler panel and bumper on it. It is a new filler panel and bumper. In the past I always painted the filler panel black, but this time I decided to paint it the silver that it was stock. I am regretting that move. I don't really like it. It is too bright for an otherwise dark grille area. The bumper is also new but I re-used the original brackets as reproduction brackets were not available when I bought the bumper. Well that did not work out so well. It adjusted up somewhat ok, but I really don't like it either so I ordered a set of new brackets for it. Hopefully that will allow it to adjust to where it should be.

Cool reflection of a bishin' Suburban in the fender.

[383Ram]

Originally Posted by 884x4Sub

Nice car!.....cool that you are resurrecting it.

Im sorry I have to do this but... www.pro-touring.com

its another site I hang on

Awwwhh, man, now you got me going to that site. My wife is going to be PIS$ED when the boxes start showing up full of parts, LOL. Just kidding. But i'll have to look deeper into there when I get my truck back.

Anyways, cool Nova, i love the 68-72 body style. It cleaned up really good. Nothing wrong with the 15" wheels, and being your running 60 series, it will have a little sidewall give which will help in ride quality. I ran some 225/50r15 on a Dart i had and between that and the following stiffening of the suspension, it was a little rough riding. I should have gone to a 60 Series tire. But it was a HUGE improvement from the little 215/70r15 that were on it---but it was like driving a Caddy that way.

I also agree, the silver filler panel doesn't cut it. Either a dark graphite grey or black would have done the trick. Hard to see if the dark part of the grill is dark gray or black--but i would have matched as closely as i could to that.

Anymore details on the rest of the suspension? Is the motor more or less bone stock TBI?

[mosesburb]

Yeah, the grille is black, so that is why I had painted this black in the past, but something possessed me to try argent silver this go-round. Oh well. Live and learn I guess.

The suspension. Ooof. Well, I have probably forgotten most of the good info, but I'll give it a go. All of this is in a time frame of pre-internet, pre-ebay when information about suspension had to be gleaned from any available source, but not the couch that I am sitting on writing this. That being said, I tried to read anything I could and talk to people knowledgable in the arena to learn about how suspension works and what I could do to improve something that was not designed to do what I was doing with it.

One of the best sources of information I had was a book about early Z28s. It had a bunch of information about what they were doing to these suspensions back in the day for the SCCA Trans Am series with the Penske team and driver Mark Donohue. One problem I was having and could not seem to shake was cooking out front wheel bearings. They are too small for what I was using them for. The Penske team was having the same problems too. GM produced some HD spindles for them by Tufftriding spindles and using some other components that are long since discontinued/obsolete. I was able to pick up a set of new GM disc brake spindles and had them nitrided because it goes deeper into the material than Tufftriding does. So I had my HD spindles, but the bearings are still small. I was not able to overcome this situation, but I had a rep for a product we sold at the store tell me he had a grease that would take care of my problem. Well, it did. I could not believe that after a road trip with at least 100 miles traveled at well over 100mph the bearings were still like new. In fact, I did not have to change the bearings again after that.

The front springs are 310lb/in which ar a bit light, but it plants the outside tire hard and hooks up well. I wanted to go a bit heavier, but did not get to it. It has a Herb Adams front sway bar. I was lucky to get this as I think this is the only part that is not available any more. I know Moroso bought the VSE line of Herb Adams, but I think it went away several years ago. It is a bar with heim joints on the ends instead of rubber or polyurethane end links.

I was trying to figure out why the car was so skittish at high speed. I found in some racecar book how to measure suspension points and figure out roll center etc. I figured out that one of the biggest problems that I had was I needed a taller spindle. Well, there was no money in the budget for taller spindles (also I have no idea what taller spindle I could use in this rear steer application). So I started looking for another means to the same end. I figured if I could lower the inboard side of the upper control arm that I would net approximately the same result. I dropped the inboard mounting 13/16". What a difference. Like a completely different vechicle. It went from being a handful at 80 to let go of the wheel at 120. Amazing. I have recently learned that this is a common modification now and is know as the Guldstrand Modification. Damn, just a bit ahead of the game. I wanted to do solid control arm bushings, but never got to it. I replaced the body mounts with aluminum body mounts. I put a steering box out of an '80 Turbo Trans Am in it. It has a quicker ratio and a heavier road feel to it. That is about all I can recall on the front.

The rear suspension is nothing too special. I put some multi-leaf springs in it with some KYB shocks. I did buy a Herb Adams sway bar for a Camaro to put in the back (remember--nobody builds Novas--especially twenty years ago). I did not end up putting it in because the front bar kept the roll under control and I liked the rear roll as it planted the outside tire and kept it hooked. I relocated the battery to the right rear corner of the trunk and also kept a 25' chunk of log chain in the right side of the trunk well for added ballast back there. Sounds strange, but hey, it worked well.

The motor is nothing too special. The top is basic TBI motor, but the bottom is 1970 Nova SS. I put rings and bearings in it (neither of which were actually needed). The heads are 2193 TBI units. Unfortunately when I did this motor I did not know how bad the flow on these heads are at higher rpm. I have the heads off of the 1970 motor ready to go, but I have to convince myself I want to put them on. It has a healthy computer friendly cam in it. I don't recall which one though. The TBI unit has a few mods done to it. Double stacked injector pod gaskets. This is available as a manufactured spacer now, but not then. The fuel system is rather unique, but I will take a few pics rather than try to explain what happens.

So, I think that hits the high points of what goes on underneath. Nothing too special by today's standards, but I think it was pretty cool back in the day.

[project 67 sub]

looking good man keep it up

[Sillyoldman]

I tried that and it didn't work. No biggie as I am done with Optimas. I bought a relabeled Deka AGM from Batteries Plus for less money than an Optima and it is a far superior battery. I have had a few Optimas die early deaths recently and in doing some reading on different sites, I am not alone. The Dekas have rave reviews and are less expensive and MADE IN THE USA!!! That is the best part. It may not be relative, butit sure seems like Optimas quality went south when they moved produtcion to Mexico.

You're absolutely right. Optimas have gone way down in quality. They make a lousy battery now. The Intimidator battery is a good one. I work for Deka. We have that very same battery in fire dept and Ambulance company rigs.

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by project 67 sub

looking good man keep it up

Thanks!!

Originally Posted by Sillyoldman

You're absolutely right. Optimas have gone way down in quality. They make a lousy battery now. The Intimidator battery is a good one. I work for Deka. We have that very same battery in fire dept and Ambulance company rigs.

Yeah, I've been burned on Optimas too many times recently. I used to get an average of six years out of them, but I am very lucky if I get three now. I can get that with a flooded battery. Tell me again why I am paying a premium for the Optimas?? Yeah, I'm not anymore.

I'm glad to hear so many good things about the Dekas. For a long time Optima was the only show in town, but now AGM batteries are much more common and obviously there are companies who want to produce a quality part--IN THE UNITED STATES no less!!

[motornut]

nice work,i love these kinda cars......my first car was 72 ventura basiclly the same thing

[Palf70Step]

I likey!!

[msgross]

nice, I can''t believe that you let it sit for so long... glad you broke it out again though...

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by motornut

nice work,i love these kinda cars......my first car was 72 ventura basiclly the same thing

Thanks!! I was told by an old GM part guy that Nova was used as an acronym to decide what to name the other X-body cars.

N-Nova (Chevrolet)
O-Omega (Oldsmobile)
V-Ventura (Pontiac)
A-Apollo (Buick)

I don't know whether it is true or not, but it is a neat story nonetheless.

Originally Posted by Palf70Step

I likey!!

Thanks, me too!!

Originally Posted by msgross

nice, I can''t believe that you let it sit for so long... glad you broke it out again though...

Yeah, I wish I could have kept it in service, but as they say, life happens. It was my Mom's driver for several years, but then i found an '88 Olds 98 Regency Brougham a few years ago with 68k original miles and she started driving that and this sat. Hopefully this will respond well to its newfound attention.

[ERASER5]

Originally Posted by mosesburb

Thanks!! I was told by an old GM part guy that Nova was used as an acronym to decide what to name the other X-body cars.

N-Nova (Chevrolet)
O-Omega (Oldsmobile)
V-Ventura (Pontiac)
A-Apollo (Buick)

I don't know whether it is true or not, but it is a neat story nonetheless.

I have a '74 Omega. It was a great car. I really need to get it back on the road.