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#1 |
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Hudson wisconsin
Posts: 149
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Problems starting when engine is warm
When I am trying to start my truck after driving for any period of time and the engine is warm it acts like the battery is dead and the engine barely turns over if at all for the first 5-10 seconds.
If I hold the key to the start position... knock on wood... it always starts but seems like it has a low or dead battery. Got any solutions or ideas? could it by hydro locking when warm and shut off? fresh rebuild, 250 miles on engine rebuild.
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Thanks, Joe 1972 C10 350 Auto |
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#2 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Southeast Missouri
Posts: 2,436
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Could be problem with a heat soaked starter.
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'67 Chevy C-20 short stepper - build complete, 454/SM-465. '75 C-30 Single Cab DRW-350 small block/NP-435. '77 GMC-6500 Dump Truck, 427 Tall Deck. '92 GMC K-3500 Duallie, 454/4L80E. |
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#3 | |
The Older Generation
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Location: Montezuma, Iowa
Posts: 25,491
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Quote:
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=570127 LockDoc
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Leon Locksmith, Specializing In Antique Trucks, Automobiles, & Motorcycles (My Dually Pickup Project Thread) http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=829820 - |
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#4 |
Registered User
![]() Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Okanagan Valley, BC, Canada
Posts: 1,237
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
If its not turning over at all like you said, then its the starter getting too hot from the heat off the exhaust. Try rigging up a shield and wrap the exhaust near the starter with some of that header tape. I bet that fix it.
Posted via Mobile Device
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#teamlongbed "I refuse to go disc brakes. I actually love drum brakes. It makes for an adventure." - 50bomb 1978 Chevy shop truck - static 6/8" 1970 GMC 1500 - Accuair eLevel Resto-mod http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=537497 |
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#5 |
The Older Generation
![]() ![]() ![]() Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montezuma, Iowa
Posts: 25,491
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
-
Another solution for heat soak is to buy a smaller gear drive starter. That solved the problem on my White '67 with a 454. LockDoc
__________________
Leon Locksmith, Specializing In Antique Trucks, Automobiles, & Motorcycles (My Dually Pickup Project Thread) http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=829820 - |
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#6 |
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Knoxville TN
Posts: 1,170
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
I would verify starter, wires and terminals in good condition before heat shield mods unless exhaust is too close.
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#7 |
Cluster King
![]() Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Junction City, OR
Posts: 5,263
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
If all of the above fails to help, try and take a couple of degrees of timing out of it and see what happens. Too much timing will also cause this problem, especially when hot.
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#8 |
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Bowser
Posts: 13,620
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Then after everything else doesn't work, do this.
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=475748 |
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#9 |
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Hudson wisconsin
Posts: 149
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
hopefully will get a chance to look at it later today.
here is what I do know though if it helps you give me ideas on what to check. same exhaust used that was there prior to rebuild and never had problem before. new intake, new carb, block bored out to 30 over, new lower end, new vortec heads. the starter has a Mr Gasket starter shield installed on it that was there prior. let me know if you got any other ideas.
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Thanks, Joe 1972 C10 350 Auto |
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#10 | |
Active Member
![]() Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Centrally located between Houston, Austin and Waco. BCS area.
Posts: 7,947
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Quote:
The battery may have enough juice when cold to start the engine but after heating up may be breaking down. Swap batteries first and then swap starter/solenoid as a complete asm.
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68 GMC 250/3 speed Saginaw p/b p/s 69 Chevy 350/350 currently in pieces still lookin for a cab 06 Trailblazer I just want a vehicle that I can work on, that won't talk to me, leave error msgs or keep track of how I drive... |
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#11 |
Active Member
![]() Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Centrally located between Houston, Austin and Waco. BCS area.
Posts: 7,947
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
While I was mowing, I remembered an engine my brother had rebuilt years ago. It was very tight. New everything and we suspected the ring gaps were on minimum side since he had the same problem after running for about 10-15 minutes or more. He overcame this by installing a new battery with higher cranking amperage but still tended to hesitate some so he retarded the timing some (someone mentioned that above). After several hundred miles it loosened up enough to crank properly.
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68 GMC 250/3 speed Saginaw p/b p/s 69 Chevy 350/350 currently in pieces still lookin for a cab 06 Trailblazer I just want a vehicle that I can work on, that won't talk to me, leave error msgs or keep track of how I drive... |
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#12 | |
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Knoxville TN
Posts: 1,170
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Quote:
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#13 |
Registered User
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Salisbury, NC
Posts: 52
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
I had the same problem on my 72. Even if I drove a mile, shut it off, then tried to start it, it'd act like the battery was very low and you could hear the motor turning over VERY slowly. I replaced the starter, solenoid and installed a heat sheild, turns out it was just a bad ground wire though!! It didn't bother me though because now I have a new starter
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1972 C10, used to be daily driven and hoping to be that way again at some point. |
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#14 |
Registered User
![]() Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Okanagan Valley, BC, Canada
Posts: 1,237
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Yes you guys are 100% correct. Check all your connections and ground first. Get a battery terminal cleaner brush and make sure everything is nice and clean. Just seems odd that it acts like the batter is dead when it's hot. That wouldn't be a fuel or timing issue. It's not even cranking over. Could also be a worn out battery as stated above. My money would be on the starter getting too hot though. I've seen it happen before. Check the voltage on the battery while cranking when it's cold and compare that to when it's hot.
Posted via Mobile Device
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#teamlongbed "I refuse to go disc brakes. I actually love drum brakes. It makes for an adventure." - 50bomb 1978 Chevy shop truck - static 6/8" 1970 GMC 1500 - Accuair eLevel Resto-mod http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=537497 |
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#15 |
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Henderson Nevada
Posts: 804
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
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#16 |
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Hudson wisconsin
Posts: 149
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
I am timed right on 0 timing mark on the original mark. Is that correct?
I also will tell you I bought this truck a year ago and have the original battery it started with and it is a small battery. 550CCA it doesn't even come close to fitting the battery tray. I was thinking about starting with a battery first and then going from there. Not original exhaust. I do have headers that were on truck when I bought it. Thanks for all the heads up and ideas where to look.
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Thanks, Joe 1972 C10 350 Auto |
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#17 |
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Knoxville TN
Posts: 1,170
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
0 degrees advance is not correct. Not bad idea to do some timing googling.
0 degrees won't be your hard start issue though. |
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#18 |
Grandpa in the rustmobile...
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Spokane WA/Viola TN
Posts: 11,422
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Timing and checking cleaness of connections is where I would start
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John Goose-1968 C10 355,9.32-1CR, Vortec Heads ,262 voodoo, 3.73:1 3OTT (HS ride/beater/farm truck) http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=317684 Grams 53-1953 Chevrolet Belair http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=1#post4327784 1969 Chevy C10 Shortbed 4.5/6?" Frame off resto http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=548136 1999 Toyota Tacoma 4x4 |
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#19 |
Grandpa in the rustmobile...
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Spokane WA/Viola TN
Posts: 11,422
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Disconnect the vac adv from the dizzy and plug it (so no vac leak) Set the timing to around 12*btdc (pass side of tab i think).
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John Goose-1968 C10 355,9.32-1CR, Vortec Heads ,262 voodoo, 3.73:1 3OTT (HS ride/beater/farm truck) http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=317684 Grams 53-1953 Chevrolet Belair http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=1#post4327784 1969 Chevy C10 Shortbed 4.5/6?" Frame off resto http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=548136 1999 Toyota Tacoma 4x4 |
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#20 |
Registered User
![]() Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Chattanooga TN
Posts: 6,208
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
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Chad 1967 C10 SWB - Project Savannah - 6.0/4L80 *Currently underway* 1968 C10 SWB - TOTY 2018, 50th Anniversary Tribute Project * Sold * Pride and Joy 1986 Silverado Short Fleet - Scarlet *Sold* 1985 Silverado Short Fleet *Sold* 2022 Jeep Gladiator Mojave 2001 Jeep Cherokee XJ 4x4 - Lifted, Built 1992 Jeep Cherokee XJ 4x4 - Lifted 2013 Honda Accord EX-L v6 Coupe 6spd (wife's ride) |
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#21 | |
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Hudson wisconsin
Posts: 149
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Quote:
reading spec sheet for Lunati Voodoo cam 10120701. Says the above center line (108) will make this cam "4" advanced. Lift on this cam is .454 in and .468 ex. does this mean 4degrees advanced? or use an advance timing light and set it at 4 before setting it? or like blue said 12 degrees btdc sorry still learning, I appreciate all your advice.
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Thanks, Joe 1972 C10 350 Auto |
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#22 |
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Knoxville TN
Posts: 1,170
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Many street engines run well at 32 to 38 degrees all in advance.
You can normally measure all in advance with timing light when rev engine to approx 3000 rpm. |
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#23 | |
Cluster King
![]() Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Junction City, OR
Posts: 5,263
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Quote:
"A little side note for you gear heads. If you install a stock small block Chevy crank gear on backwards, this will advance your valve timing 2 degrees." I am not sure if this is common knowledge so I thought I would share. As you stated, with a timing light you have "0" degrees of ignition timing. That seems on the retarded side. You should have around 6 to 8 degrees with the vacuum advance disconnected. You will have to play around with the ignition timing to get it the way you like it as far as performance. Not all engines like the same timing. My 72 shows my timing is to be set at 8 degrees but it runs better set at 10 and does not give me hard start issues when hot. If you are at "0", it sounds like you may have a problem with heat soak on your starter like mentioned in prior post. I would still consider trying a different timing setting if nothing else works. You can always put it back to zero. Last edited by TBONE1964; 06-09-2013 at 04:20 PM. |
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#24 |
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Knoxville TN
Posts: 1,170
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
Warm engine.
Disconnect vacuum tube from vac advance. Plug vac tube during test. Make a note of idle timing (I think yours is 0 degrees now). Watch timing change as rev engine. Somewhere around 2000 to around 3000rpm you can observe engine reach max mechanical advance; many streeet V8 engines like 32 to 38. Many engines are a ping risk above roughly 36. |
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#25 |
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Hudson wisconsin
Posts: 149
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Re: Problems starting when engine is warm
ok guys I am irritated and I know how I get when I am irritated. I miss things.
****ty ground for sure for the battery. hopefully this gets rid of slow crank. Bigger problem now. I set the timing to 10degrees BTDC. idle was great and sounded a lot better. I took it out and drove it. ran well. pulled in drive way started backing into garage. filled the garage with white smoke and driveway with green fluid. Now I have an engine that seems to be over heating. Cant find a specific leak but it looks like the radiator is shooting it out the over flow from the radiator which I don't have a hose hooked up to right now. Hit the exhaust and hot engine. Got any ideas why once its timed where it should be it would run hot and over heat? Sounded like fluid boiling in the drivers side of the engine. could have been in upper hose also.
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Thanks, Joe 1972 C10 350 Auto |
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