MORE lsx wiring questions

[smartass12]

Bear with me, i searched and couldnt find/understand answers.

My set up (to help answer my questions)

2001 5.3 DBW with 4l60e
Stock harness de pinned via lt1swap.com
current performance (sa-1000) harness (relays/fuses) for lsx

Im sure this is simple for most but not for me (no clue about wiring) so be gentle please.

1. crank signal (out of CP harness) looks to me like it should go to the ST position of the ignition? (only live when you turn key to start?)

2. Battery terminal (out of back of ignition) does this just go directly to battery?

3. TCC brake switch (out of de-pinned ls harness) do i need this? and if so just relay it the way shown on lt1swap.com ?

4. (out of de-pinned ls harness) i have a wire that i labeled (did my de-pin a while ago) starter solenoid/crank voltage D11...any idea where that goes?

5. LAST question for now...the wiring that comes off the 1967 steering column.. is any of that needed to run drive this with above setup? (obviously other than DOT stuff..ie...turn signals and such.

Thanks in advance for anyone willing to help

[BR3W CITY]

The ignition should wire through a relay so your not putting starting load through the ignition switch.

TCC switch is needed assuming your running an auto with lockup.

[smartass12]

Originally Posted by BR3W CITY

The ignition should wire through a relay so your not putting starting load through the ignition switch.

TCC switch is needed assuming your running an auto with lockup.

Guess that (above about ignition) confuses me (not surprised )
im just use to the 12v battery input on the back of the ignition switch just being fused to the battery and not running through a relay.


Not sure what lockup is or if i have it but ill just wire it in like it shows on lt1swap.com

[BR3W CITY]

Ignition switches on older vehicles are sometimes run that way, and it can start the truck but you are essentially making the juice for the starter solenoid go all the way from the battery to the fuse then the ignition switch, then down through. This puts all the current (and heat) through small wires. The ign switches on older cars/trucks are heavier and more capable of this, especially when compared to things like push-start switches which are NOT heavy duty at all. The similar principle applies to headlight wiring, using a relay vs hard wiring through the switch.

Modern cars will use the ign switch to carry a signal to the input side of a relay. That relay can then be wired with a heavier wire, and creates a barrier should there be a higher current short at the starter. OR they can use the PCM to send the signal to the relay/starter, depending on the year/type of setup.

Lockup is when the convertor literally locks up at a 1:1 ratio to prevent slip and ideally minimize heat.

[dec010974]

I pmed u my number. I have used that relay box and fuse box twice. I'll tell what I did. It was easier for me to rewire the box as they wire different.

[smartass12]

Originally Posted by dec010974

I pmed u my number. I have used that relay box and fuse box twice. I'll tell what I did. It was easier for me to rewire the box as they wire different.

Oh crap, im it trouble then...i have already hooked up everything on the CP fuse box accorind to there instructions. Do i need to cut all the wires and redo everything after i rewire the CP fuse box or can i get away with it the way it is and add the relay for the 12v battery on ignition and a relay for the TCC ?

[dec010974]

I wont say your in trouble, its just that the directions they send with those boxes doesn't work for my tradition of wiring. they wire the boxes differently. I even called CP for some insight and he blew me off like I was wrong for wiring my relays this way. for instance, when I wire a relay it goes as such:
30- fused Battery power
85- goes to ground (-)
86- signal (fuel pump) (+)
87- to device (power the acc.
the signal (86) can be positive or negative. this is the case when using a lsx pcm. for example, lsx pcm sends a positive signal for the fuel pump but sends a negative signal for the electric fans. so that means that 85 and 86 will require some changes. if the signal (86) is (+) positive then (85) will be negative (-). if the signal is negative, then 85 should be positive. if you pull that box apart you see that its not wired that way. but again, who am I? I rewired the boxes to fit my tradition and they work every time. I cant get my engine to start when I follow their directions. and for my application, I don't use the starter relay. im gonna use that relay for my air bags.

[smartass12]

Originally Posted by BR3W CITY

Ignition switches on older vehicles are sometimes run that way, and it can start the truck but you are essentially making the juice for the starter solenoid go all the way from the battery to the fuse then the ignition switch, then down through. This puts all the current (and heat) through small wires. The ign switches on older cars/trucks are heavier and more capable of this, especially when compared to things like push-start switches which are NOT heavy duty at all. The similar principle applies to headlight wiring, using a relay vs hard wiring through the switch.

Modern cars will use the ign switch to carry a signal to the input side of a relay. That relay can then be wired with a heavier wire, and creates a barrier should there be a higher current short at the starter. OR they can use the PCM to send the signal to the relay/starter, depending on the year/type of setup.

Lockup is when the convertor literally locks up at a 1:1 ratio to prevent slip and ideally minimize heat.

Thanks, I see what your saying

[smartass12]

Originally Posted by dec010974

I wont say your in trouble, its just that the directions they send with those boxes doesn't work for my tradition of wiring. they wire the boxes differently. I even called CP for some insight and he blew me off like I was wrong for wiring my relays this way. for instance, when I wire a relay it goes as such:
30- fused Battery power
85- goes to ground (-)
86- signal (fuel pump) (+)
87- to device (power the acc.
the signal (86) can be positive or negative. this is the case when using a lsx pcm. for example, lsx pcm sends a positive signal for the fuel pump but sends a negative signal for the electric fans. so that means that 85 and 86 will require some changes. if the signal (86) is (+) positive then (85) will be negative (-). if the signal is negative, then 85 should be positive. if you pull that box apart you see that its not wired that way. but again, who am I? I rewired the boxes to fit my tradition and they work every time. I cant get my engine to start when I follow their directions. and for my application, I don't use the starter relay. im gonna use that relay for my air bags.

Got it.. Think im gonna need to pay someone to do this for me. Im completely regretting doing the LS swap cuz of the wiring.

[truckdude239]

Originally Posted by smartass12

Got it.. Think im gonna need to pay someone to do this for me. Im completely regretting doing the LS swap cuz of the wiring.

thats why i paided to have mine done 225 plus 80 for a hd relay/fuse box i only had to hook up 5 wires! and it start on the second turn of the key

[LS-K]

Don't know where the subscribe button is for this thread, but Im staying tuned. Lots of very useful info on this thread.

[BR3W CITY]

thread tools --> subscribe

[LS-K]

You DA man brew city!

[dec010974]

I guess the verdict is in. this is officially a lsx swap build help thread. I have completed a few cheap lsx swaps (im no guru). Who has a wiring question? I'll help as much as i can. Trucksters, please dont be afraid to attemp these swaps. Everyone has to start somewhere. How do you know you can't do something if you never attempt to do something? i gotta give a shot out to LS1NOVA71. If you read some of his build threads, you will learn alot. we all can't what he does, but we will never know until we try.

[smartass12]

Originally Posted by smartass12

Bear with me, i searched and couldnt find/understand answers.

My set up (to help answer my questions)

2001 5.3 DBW with 4l60e
Stock harness de pinned via lt1swap.com
current performance (sa-1000) harness (relays/fuses) for lsx

Im sure this is simple for most but not for me (no clue about wiring) so be gentle please.

1. crank signal (out of CP harness) looks to me like it should go to the ST position of the ignition? (only live when you turn key to start?)

2. Battery terminal (out of back of ignition) does this just go directly to battery?

3. TCC brake switch (out of de-pinned ls harness) do i need this? and if so just relay it the way shown on lt1swap.com ?

4. (out of de-pinned ls harness) i have a wire that i labeled (did my de-pin a while ago) starter solenoid/crank voltage D11...any idea where that goes?

5. LAST question for now...the wiring that comes off the 1967 steering column.. is any of that needed to run drive this with above setup? (obviously other than DOT stuff..ie...turn signals and such.

Thanks in advance for anyone willing to help

I think i might be able to turn the key after this weekend but was wondering if anyone had an answer to numbers 4 and 5 for me.

[dec010974]

Can we see a pic of that? To run the LSx harness per lt1swap.com, you shouldn't have to run that wire you labelled starter. I wired my using the same directions as you and have my starter is wired straight, without the starter being connected to the harness. The answer to # 5 is no. You don't need the wires from your column to wire to LSx harness. The wire from your column is for light, signals and flashers. Call me. I pmed you my number. I'm doing the same thing your doing, as we speak. I'm using the lq4/th400 setup. I ordered a PCM and wired my harness from lt1swap.com. Brendan is very cool at helping us out with this LSx stuff.

[Andy4639]

None of my gauges are hooked to the computer what so ever they all still are motor senor hook ups this is why I bought the scan gauge 2 so I can compare the 2. Gauges vs computer readings. Nothing has to be hooked up to the LS motor computer unless you bought gauges to hook up that read off the computer. The computer just wants 12 volts when you crank the motor so everything come alive at that moment.
I know enough just to get me in trouble here but I know about the gauges.

[ivorton74]

Originally Posted by dec010974

Can we see a pic of that? To run the LSx harness per lt1swap.com, you shouldn't have to run that wire you labelled starter. I wired my using the same directions as you and have my starter is wired straight, without the starter being connected to the harness. The answer to # 5 is no. You don't need the wires from your column to wire to LSx harness. The wire from your column is for light, signals and flashers. Call me. I pmed you my number. I'm doing the same thing your doing, as we speak. I'm using the lq4/th400 setup. I ordered a PCM and wired my harness from lt1swap.com. Brendan is very cool at helping us out with this LSx stuff.

I'm sending my pcm to the lt1 guy too. How much did he charge for ur harness?

[BR3W CITY]

Originally Posted by Andy4639

None of my gauges are hooked to the computer what so ever they all still are motor senor hook ups this is why I bought the scan gauge 2 so I can compare the 2. Gauges vs computer readings. Nothing has to be hooked up to the LS motor computer unless you bought gauges to hook up that read off the computer. The computer just wants 12 volts when you crank the motor so everything come alive at that moment.
I know enough just to get me in trouble here but I know about the gauges.

Do you not use the tach signal off the Pcm?

[Andy4639]

Originally Posted by BR3W CITY

Do you not use the tach signal off the Pcm?

BR3W City,
They have it hooked up some place but it's reading about a 1000 RPM's off what the scan gauges say's. I think he put it to a coil pack but not sure. I will find out Friday I guess. It's one of my punch list to do things.

[dec010974]

If I'm not mistaken, the rpm signal from the pcm is red- # 10 per lt1swap directions. In some cases for the tachometer to read your gauges properly automter sell a box to install to make the tachometer read correctly. The tachometer signal that reads from the scan gauge is correct because that info comes from the pcm itself. And that is the crankshaft sensor. Also, I read somewhere that the tuner for the pcm may need to program the something in the pcm so tachomeyer gauge can read correctly.

[BR3W CITY]

Some tachs allow you to change the # of cylinders on the signal (4/8), and the output mode can also be changed.

Take a look at the LS2 w/ conventional tach thread, about using a step up resistor for the tach signal. (usually tho, there would be an erratic signal or no reading on the standard tach).

[dec010974]

Yeah br3w city, thanks for clearing that up. It sounds better the way you say it. Lol. You got that tech talk thing down packed.

[smartass12]

Originally Posted by dec010974

Can we see a pic of that? To run the LSx harness per lt1swap.com, you shouldn't have to run that wire you labelled starter. I wired my using the same directions as you and have my starter is wired straight, without the starter being connected to the harness. The answer to # 5 is no. You don't need the wires from your column to wire to LSx harness. The wire from your column is for light, signals and flashers. Call me. I pmed you my number. I'm doing the same thing your doing, as we speak. I'm using the lq4/th400 setup. I ordered a PCM and wired my harness from lt1swap.com. Brendan is very cool at helping us out with this LSx stuff.

here is where i found it http://lt1swap.com/vortec_truck_pinouts/2002.htm listed as d11. So as far as wiring your starter direct you just ran the purple off your ignition to starter only? No other wires hook on to the starter? Thanks for your number, if i were to call on the weekend what time is best for you?

[dec010974]

please dont call me when im sleep. that is how i stay energized to be able to work on lsx swap. California, i think is 3 hours behind Miami, Florida. I am mainly free during the evenings. Question, are you using the stock under hood fuse block? if you not using the stock fuse block, i wouldnt worry about that. if you rewiring your harness for stand alone opration, just follow Brendan's instruction. just make sure your lsx starter/solenoid is wired in the normal fashion.