Polar Bear Suburban

[bilfman]

One day soon planning an 8.1 I'm sure I'll ask for some guidance.

[Average Joe]

Glad to hear ya got her dialed in! That torque curve is a 'beaut.

['63GENIII]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

Cool! Goodies from Carbondale are always fun to unpack! You are not going to believe this, but there was absolutely no change in 5th gear. It is no easier or harder to shift into 5th than it was before…..it’s exactly the same. I am not even joking. I haven’t had the heart to tell Harlan yet….and I not pulling that sumbish out again anytime soon so I’ll just keep living with it for another few years. At least the big pig runs better now albeit still needs some ECM tuning attention. I drove it all over town today. It hauls ASS!

Hey Larry, which shift cover are you running on the PB? Round or square shift tower? I just spoke with a guy who rebuild them. He says the round tower covers are prone to letting the shift forks drag a little.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by '63GENIII

Hey Larry, which shift cover are you running on the PB? Round or square shift tower? I just spoke with a guy who rebuild them. He says the round tower covers are prone to letting the shift forks drag a little.

Both the K10 and Suburban have the second gen NV4500 with the square removable shift towers.

[DirtyLarry]

Got a little annoyance thing address on the Burb last night. Since the NV4500 swap the clutch “feeling” has been a moving target. I find myself adjusting the clutch every few weeks and was getting pretty tired of it. Normally there aren’t any adjustments with a hydraulic clutch but with the Advance Adapters NV4500 bell/slave bracket there is. Anyway, I treated it to a new slave, M/C and hose as well has gone to much larger hydraulic reservoir. What a difference this all made! I’ll be able to put more miles on it later this week but it already feels 100% better. See if I can do some speed shifting now!

Tiny OEM reservoir. I just never felt these little reservoirs were up to the job


Tilton reservoir mounted to a bracket I made that bolts to the bracket master cylinder and hydroboost hose bracket. I actually used a TBI 7.4L MAP bracket for this. Hey, it fit almost perfect! Now I want to do the same to the K10.

[capone550]

Larry I hate to bug you with too many questions, but youre the only guy I know that will probably have the answers. I have a 2002 8.1 that is going in my 88 R30. I do have to pass emission here in Boulder County. I talked to Air Care COlorado about the swap and all they could tell me is I have to have all the emissions equipment the vehicle came with for that year.The vehicle would get a waiver and have to pass for that years standards. Being that I am going to have a stock computer to do emissions with and another with the howell tune, it should pass with flying colors. This engine should have an EGR on it, but the block off plate on it sure looks like a factory unit to me. My question is, how would anyone tell if it was a 2006 or a 2002? I will install cats on it, but not sure if I should do EGR even though it has a factory looking block off plate.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by capone550

Larry I hate to bug you with too many questions, but youre the only guy I know that will probably have the answers. I have a 2002 8.1 that is going in my 88 R30. I do have to pass emission here in Boulder County. I talked to Air Care COlorado about the swap and all they could tell me is I have to have all the emissions equipment the vehicle came with for that year.The vehicle would get a waiver and have to pass for that years standards. Being that I am going to have a stock computer to do emissions with and another with the howell tune, it should pass with flying colors. This engine should have an EGR on it, but the block off plate on it sure looks like a factory unit to me. My question is, how would anyone tell if it was a 2006 or a 2002? I will install cats on it, but not sure if I should do EGR even though it has a factory looking block off plate.

Sounds like a cool project. Well, there really isn’t any way to determine the year of the engine as they are not stamped anywhere on the physical engine that I have found. I’ve heard what some people are doing in CA is providing the CARB coach with the VIN from the donor vehicle. That is mainly in CA, not sure what CO will require. Luckily we don’t have any emissions in Pueblo County. Regarding the EGR block off plate, there is a very good reason it looks “factory”… because it is. Only 2001-2003 L18’s had EGR. 2004-2010 were not equipped with EGR.

Here is an excerpt from the GM Powertrain 2004 Model Year L18 Summary regarding the removal of the EGR:

EXHAUST GAS RECIRCULATION (EGR) ELIMINATED
The EGR control valve and plumbing have been removed from all Vortec 8100s. The EGR system was used to recycle some exhaust gas back into the intake stream to cool combustion and reduce oxides of nitrogen (NOx) emissions. Data from development and durability test vehicles indicates that software refinements in the P59 PCM, and the engine’s overall efficiency, allow the Vortec 8100 to meet all 2004 North American exhaust emissions standards without EGR. Removing EGR reduces cost, complexity and potential warranty claims, improving both assembly efficiency and reliability.

The EGR block off plate is GM part number 12559976 while the gasket is 12580673. Just remove the EGR and add the plate and gasket. The studs and nuts can be retained.

Not sure if you ran across THIS thread but it is a great resource on all things 8.1L related. There is also a very good group on Facebook dedicated to 8.1L swappers. The page is called “8.1L Info Swap Classifieds”. Tell Ed, Larry sent you.

Good luck with your project.

[capone550]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

Sounds like a cool project. Well, there really isn’t any way to determine the year of the engine as they are not stamped anywhere on the physical engine that I have found. I’ve heard what some people are doing in CA is providing the CARB coach with the VIN from the donor vehicle. That is mainly in CA, not sure what CO will require. Luckily we don’t have any emissions in Pueblo County. Regarding the EGR block off plate, there is a very good reason it looks “factory”… because it is. Only 2001-2003 L18’s had EGR. 2004-2010 were not equipped with EGR.

Here is an excerpt from the GM Powertrain 2004 Model Year L18 Summary regarding the removal of the EGR:

EXHAUST GAS RECIRCULATION (EGR) ELIMINATED
The EGR control valve and plumbing have been removed from all Vortec 8100s. The EGR system was used to recycle some exhaust gas back into the intake stream to cool combustion and reduce oxides of nitrogen (NOx) emissions. Data from development and durability test vehicles indicates that software refinements in the P59 PCM, and the engine’s overall efficiency, allow the Vortec 8100 to meet all 2004 North American exhaust emissions standards without EGR. Removing EGR reduces cost, complexity and potential warranty claims, improving both assembly efficiency and reliability.

The EGR block off plate is GM part number 12559976 while the gasket is 12580673. Just remove the EGR and add the plate and gasket. The studs and nuts can be retained.

Not sure if you ran across THIS thread but it is a great resource on all things 8.1L related. There is also a very good group on Facebook dedicated to 8.1L swappers. The page is called “8.1L Info Swap Classifieds”. Tell Ed, Larry sent you.

Good luck with your project.

Larry that is where my confusion starts. My 8.1 is a 2002. But this block off plate looks factory. I saw the truck it came out of. Did the 3500 dually have different factory emissions equipment than say a 2500 truck/suburban? I have read and read that thread word for word. That's what stuck me on the 8.1. I have a complete L29 I was planning on using until I read that thread and the one where the guy argued the dart block and merlin head 10k motor would run better than a stock L18.
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[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by capone550

Larry that is where my confusion starts. My 8.1 is a 2002. But this block off plate looks factory. I saw the truck it came out of. Did the 3500 dually have different factory emissions equipment than say a 2500 truck/suburban? I have read and read that thread word for word. That's what stuck me on the 8.1. I have a complete L29 I was planning on using until I read that thread and the one where the guy argued the dart block and merlin head 10k motor would run better than a stock L18.
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I’m sorry, I thought you wanted to remove the EGR and install the plate. My bad. They all had EGR up until 2004 that I know of. I work for Workhorse/Navistar where we used couple hundred thousand 8.1L’s in our chassis from 2001 to 2010, which were of the heavier GVWR range of engines. Ours had EGR from 2001-2003. I suspect someone either did an engine swap on the donor truck or just removed it all together. What color are the valve covers? 2002 should have black textured valve covers. 2004 and later were bare aluminum. What about the exhaust manifold? Is the EGR port in the exhaust manifold cast over or does it look like someone plugged it?

I personally wouldn’t worry about it as you would need the EGR exhaust manifold which won’t fit your square body frame anyway.

[capone550]

My valve covers are black. I am hoping the main air car facility employs people of the same mind set as the one here in longmont. They look for the basics and throw it on the dyno. Just finished up our 86 K10 after a fire rebuild and I just ran some vacuum lines around the intake and not one of them were connected to anything. Hoping thats the outcome when this truck is running. Thanks for the help Larry.

[capone550]

Larry do you have to run a spacer between the throttle body and manifold when you use the L29 throttle body?

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by capone550

Larry do you have to run a spacer between the throttle body and manifold when you use the L29 throttle body?

Yep, otherwise the geometry of the cable won't pull the throttle plate all the way open.

[capone550]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

Yep, otherwise the geometry of the cable won't pull the throttle plate all the way open.

Awesome. Thanks a ton Larry. When I get it done I will take a cruise to pueblo so you can critique it!
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[DirtyLarry]

Sounds good!

[capone550]

Larry can you tell me if these are the correct part numbers for mounting bolts for the G-van/workhorse brackets? I have searched and I can't seem to find the length of these part numbers. I am shocked at the difference in size compared to the truck brackets.
Here is what I came up with

5X 11516367
4X 11516360
2X 11517115 (bolts for alternator)

Blake just sent me his parts list and he has the same numbers. Just double checking now.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by capone550

Larry can you tell me if these are the correct part numbers for mounting bolts for the G-van/workhorse brackets? I have searched and I can't seem to find the length of these part numbers. I am shocked at the difference in size compared to the truck brackets.
Here is what I came up with

5X 11516367
4X 11516360
2X 11517115 (bolts for alternator)

Blake just sent me his parts list and he has the same numbers. Just double checking now.

Sorry, but I won't be near my personal computer until late in the week. If you go to the CK5 link above I beleive I posted a vin for a GMT400 truck with an L18. Those brackets are the same. Any GM dealer can look up the part numbers by that vin. The alternator bolts are very long.....like 6 to 8 inches

[capone550]

Thanks Larry. I went ahead and ordered them today. Those part numbers also matched what Blake used so I figured they must be right.

[argonaut]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

Got a little annoyance thing address on the Burb last night. Since the NV4500 swap the clutch “feeling” has been a moving target. I find myself adjusting the clutch every few weeks and was getting pretty tired of it. Normally there aren’t any adjustments with a hydraulic clutch but with the Advance Adapters NV4500 bell/slave bracket there is. Anyway, I treated it to a new slave, M/C and hose as well has gone to much larger hydraulic reservoir. What a difference this all made! I’ll be able to put more miles on it later this week but it already feels 100% better. See if I can do some speed shifting now!

Tiny OEM reservoir. I just never felt these little reservoirs were up to the job

Tilton reservoir mounted to a bracket I made that bolts to the bracket master cylinder and hydroboost hose bracket. I actually used a TBI 7.4L MAP bracket for this. Hey, it fit almost perfect! Now I want to do the same to the K10.

Larry,
How is it that you were adjusting your hydraulic clutch? I've never known one to be adjustable. I'm curious as I'm not 100% happy with mine.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by argonaut

Larry,
How is it that you were adjusting your hydraulic clutch? I've never known one to be adjustable. I'm curious as I'm not 100% happy with mine.

The pushrod between the slave and clutch fork is threaded rod and adjustable on the Advance Adapters bell/slave bracket kit. They have pictures in the instructions on their website.

[DirtyLarry]

Finally got around to pumping up the A/C pumped this afternoon. She works great and that Delphi HT6 compressor is so quiet you don’t even hear it run. It’s in the upper 90’s here today and she was blowing 54 degrees out of the vents cruising down the highway. 54 really feels cold when it is almost a 100 ambient. It will freeze you out after a while. Next 2 projects is to get it back to the tuner so they can straighten up their tune to take out the parking lot idling hop and the piss poor cold start open loop operation. After that it goes back to the exhaust shop to have some rework done on the exhaust as I cannot stand the way it sounds. Going to have a dual inlet dual outlet Magnaflow x-muffler installed and move to true dual exhaust instead of the huge restriction it has now where it is squeezed down to a single pipe for 3 feet.

['63GENIII]

I'd love to see some pics of the exhaust before and after Larry. I'm going through major anxiety trying to figure out a routing since the spring swap and install of the Blazer tank in the back. Alot of guys around here are running turndowns. I can't bring myself to do it though. I liked them turned out under the rear of the rear fender. Can't wait to see what you do there.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by '63GENIII

I'd love to see some pics of the exhaust before and after Larry. I'm going through major anxiety trying to figure out a routing since the spring swap and install of the Blazer tank in the back. Alot of guys around here are running turndowns. I can't bring myself to do it though. I liked them turned out under the rear of the rear fender. Can't wait to see what you do there.

Below is how it is now. It has duals from the headers then into single “test pipe” that fills the void where the original cat once lived. At the other end of the single pipe is a tiny single inlet/dual outlet Flowmaster. I was way over budget after the engine swap which is why I didn’t the exhaust done the way I wanted it the first time. I mainly just needed the exhaust shop to hook up the exhaust temporarily so I could hear myself think enough to work out the bugs after the swap. Working on an uncorked big block is a bit loud Now the bugs are getting whittled down it is time to revisit the exhaust. I’ll get some pics after….it will be a while as I haven’t even ordered the muffler yet.



The tail pipes will remain in the same location. I like the stock behind the wheel exit look. This is about the best picture of the tailpipes. It is basically the same as my K10 as far as exhaust exit. Turn downs are cool on a street truck but not for a real world 4x4.

['63GENIII]

Thats exactly how I'd like mine to exit. I just wonder about getting around the new springs now. The darn things take up nearly the whole length of the frame after the bed. I'm sure my exhaust guy will be able to figure something out. That truck of yours sure is clean though. Thanks for the exhaust pics!

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by '63GENIII

Thats exactly how I'd like mine to exit. I just wonder about getting around the new springs now. The darn things take up nearly the whole length of the frame after the bed. I'm sure my exhaust guy will be able to figure something out. That truck of yours sure is clean though. Thanks for the exhaust pics!

Thanks! I hear you on the exit to clear the springs. Mine dump way behind the shackle to avoid any contact with the spring or shackle due to the rear ORD shackle flip. This picture is a few years old when I was installing the lift, 14FF and shackle flip. Same tail pipes that are currently on it though.


The exhaust on the K10 is routed behind the shackles as well for flex clearance



Oh, I forgot to post up the official decal to consummate the 8.1L install






And a few shameless glamour shots

[jbclassix]

Did you ever get the oily brakes ok K10 dilemma sorted out? If you did I missed it
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