The Official John Lee Jr Thread

[Sharps40]

Pistons appear to be flat tops. Can't make out a series of 4 valve reliefs but they are definitely not the dished top 250 pistons.

[Sharps40]

Number on the distributer pad is F0504ZG

[Sharps40]

According to the posted info below...this is a 1971 Olds Auto Trans 250 cid engine.

Guess I'll have to get a stick in the bore and mark it to see what the stroke is.....

http://www.mattress-factory.com/mfsp...ne_Decoder.pdf

1971
ENGINE HP CARB. TRANS. COMP. SUFFIX OR CODE

250 L6 145 1-BBL AT 8.50:1 ZG

[Sharps40]

Just gatherin up all the stuff that's needed for a shakedown run to the Low Country of SC. Headin out over the weekend for about 600 miles round trip to the deer camp.

John Lee is ready. Carb and ignition are on what appear to be their final settings. Brakes are pulled up and evened out, bed's in, gun rack is ready to receive a 12g SxS shottie for its first haul. No radio in the dash yet but, we'll get there. Tires are up and even, oil changed and a big fat new radiator ready for blast furnace highway run.

Mostly just enjoyin company and shootin some clays. A stop a wallyworld tomorrow for snacks, beer and clays and pack up the bed - a good nights sleep and I'm predicting a fine AM run. I believe I'll use mostly rural highway. Route 1 South to SC for sure. Perhaps a long stretch on Rt 52 in SC to Andrews....Depends if I can remember to exit at Florence from I95...but then again, I could stretch John Lees legs on I95 for a ways and hang a hard left about anywhere to scoot over to Andrews.

Mmmmmmmmm....crab and shrimp low country boil and beer and guns and card games and relaxing....mmmmmmmmm...crab and shrimp!

[Sharps40]

Is it time to go yet?

[Sharps40]

I'm ready. Time to go yet? I gotta stop lookin at my watch.

[Sharps40]

Havin a lovely time in the low country. John Lee purred along the highways and interstates like a fat cat pullin 17.5 mpg and nary a hiccup. Pretty good fer an old man.

And nearly 2 cases of 12g into Clays the deeply discounted CZ SxS that wouldn't break clays is smashin and smokin em on M and I M chokes. Guess the prior failures to shoot straight were PO personal issues.

We started today fishin Blue Crabs fer tonights Low Country Boil - we had a lovely Crab Shoot this afternoon. The dead crabs - not suitable fer boil were launched thru an impenetratable wall of small shot from 6 shotties. Crabs actually sail great launched on a high angle. Talk bout yer sushi! But we are finishing with low country boil, camp fire and beer!
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[Sharps40]

Home again. Low Country boil is yummy. Crabs, shrimp, sausage, lemons, potatoes, onions, corn all boiled together.

Big fires with beer are wonderful.

Shooting shotguns at clays and crabs is awesome.

Driving long distance in John Lee is perfection!

[T Smith]

Glad the old boy took to the road so well, nothing like setting out in a "vintage" ride!

[Sharps40]

Got some shimmy goin over ruts/bumps at highway speeds. Guessin its that loose ball joint on the PS top side. DS Top is fine but I ain't checked the lowers yet. Got all the new BJs now so just savin up for control arm shafts and bushings and a pair of inner tie rods and 9/16 shackes and I'll yank that front end offa there and replace it all.

Been toyin with redoin the rear suspension too, prolly with urethane bushings and a buttwad of grease on em to keep down the squeekin...course the other option is to just drop off the rear bushings and have em pressed in during the front end realignment. Got a shop local that ain't afraid to align the old ones or work on em neither. New they was the right folks when I pulled in the first time and they was tuning their 348 Fox Body Mustang drag car and tweakin an all original 53 Chevy Stepside....buttugly green but they was still willin to work on it!

Takin John Lee back down to Andrews SC in Sept with Dad for the first rifle hunt of the season. Hope to cart back several deer. After that, another October hunt in SC drivin John Lee and Nov/Dec hunts along the swamps of the Neuse River south of Raleigh and then after the front end rebuild over Christmas break - if all remains well, pack up GoodWife in May and cross country thru the Badlands, Rushmore/Crazy Horse and out to Devils Tower WY.

I just got back from pullin the dipstick...not a drop of oil burned....tail pipe dark grey and dry. I'll pull some plugs tomorrow.

But, the slightly larger idle jet helped power over the enire power range on that Weber 32/36. Its still a bit small, so I'm gonna order one size larger idle jet (since it also feeds the transition to 2500 rpm) and go down one more size on the primary main jet and see how it runs.

Noted just a touch of starter lag on some hot restarts. I'll pull the cables and clean/tighten them first. If it keeps acting a bit cranky on hot restarts I spect I'll yank that greasy old starter and put a spanky new one in there.

[Sharps40]

John Lee arrives at his old home state of SC. This time, further south than Easley, parked here at camp in Andrews SC.

[Sharps40]

Originally Posted by T Smith

Glad the old boy took to the road so well, nothing like setting out in a "vintage" ride!

I get down to Vicksburg once a year to do some inspections for the Reserves. There is a little old school restaurant in a white (I think) house - kinda has a difficult short drive up the driveway to the tight parking lot..... that place serves the best damn red beans and rice and sweet tea I ever et.

Can't remember the name? Any ideas, help a hungry man out for his next trip!

Been to the boat for buffet but it don't hold a candle to this restaurant inna old house.

I gotta get up the road aways next trip and see John Lee Hookers home town in Clarksdale MS.

[T Smith]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

I get down to Vicksburg once a year to do some inspections for the Reserves. There is a little old school restaurant in a white (I think) house - kinda has a difficult short drive up the driveway to the tight parking lot..... that place serves the best damn red beans and rice and sweet tea I ever et.

Can't remember the name? Any ideas, help a hungry man out for his next trip!

Been to the boat for buffet but it don't hold a candle to this restaurant inna old house.

I gotta get up the road aways next trip and see John Lee Hookers home town in Clarksdale MS.

Walnut Hills?

Let me know next time you come down, we can definitely get together!

[Sharps40]

That might be it. Lil old house, wouldn't expect it to be a restaurant. I should be down either fall or spring. I usually stay at the Fairfield Inn next to the Taco Place and the Grocery Store near the interstate. Thanks for the invite. Would love to meet ya and get a look at yer truck!

[T Smith]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

That might be it. Lil old house, wouldn't expect it to be a restaurant. I should be down either fall or spring. I usually stay at the Fairfield Inn next to the Taco Place and the Grocery Store near the interstate. Thanks for the invite. Would love to meet ya and get a look at yer truck!

http://walnuthillsms.com/

Fairfield Inn is off the Halls Ferry Road exit, you can throw a rock to my place from there! We'll definitely get together, just let me know when you get your dates lined up!

[Sharps40]

By golly, that's the Place! Now I can't get to fall or spring fast enough! You bet, I'll Holler yer way when the next trip comes up. Ususally Dec or Mar/April time frame. I'm thinkin it'll be more like Mar/April for the next trip with the fiscal irresponsibility of our duely elected Washington DC Incompetents.

[T Smith]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

By golly, that's the Place! Now I can't get to fall or spring fast enough! You bet, I'll Holler yer way when the next trip comes up. Ususally Dec or Mar/April time frame. I'm thinkin it'll be more like Mar/April for the next trip with the fiscal irresponsibility of our duely elected Washington DC Incompetents.

Walnut Hills, they've changed the place up a bit in the last year or two, they have added on and they did away with the "round table" but the food is still good.

Looking forward to it!

[Sharps40]

I was able to confirm the exact engine size/type this morning. John Lee Jr definitely has a 71 Olds 250 I6.

In addition to the block casting marks/dates and dizzy pad numbers I was able to view and "feel" the tops of the pistons this morning.

Rotating the engine to just before TDC, I pulled the number one spark plug.....its pretty spanky toast brown by the way (along with a similar check of the plug on #4 so all good in the fuel/ignition departments). With #1 about a half inch below TDC I inserted a soft brass rod with a smooth tip into the spark plug hole.

Touching the manifold side of the #1 cylinder wall, I pressed down on the wire and gently pulled it out of the spark plug hole....after less than 1/2" of outward movement, the wire dropped down off the upper rim of the piston into the recessed section of the piston with a gentle snap. Repeating this several times and then putting a 30 degree bend in the wire I touched the forward wall of the cylinder repeating the snap into the depression of the piston top.

Viewing the piston thru the spark plug hole shows a flat surface with no valve reliefs in the center.

This indicates the installed pistons are of the dished top form used on the 250 I6 (the 230 pistons being the flat tops with 4 valve reliefs cut in the center.)

So, problem solved, and a nice upgrade to this truck from the stocker 230 motor it came from the factory with. 20 more cu in and a bit more HP and torque.

[jayoldschool]

Another bonus is that engine was built to run regular unleaded, as all GMs were beginning in 71.

[Sharps40]

Awesome news. Now I don't have to sweat valves and heads down the road from accelerated decrepitude!

[Sharps40]

Its been quite a journey so far in the way of tuning, learning to trust an expert and set the initial timing on an HEI almost 5 times higher than a stock points dizzy and ignoring my desire to always call the carb rich on the secondary and jet it leaner and leaner on the main and richer and richer on the secondary till its running strong, clean and perfect.

Looking back over my notes, I now have 15 sets of numbers where I've been tracking the adjustments and fine tweaks I've made to that Weber DGEV 32/36 and with improvements in mileage and performance each and every time.

I made what I am pretty sure will be the final tweaks to the jetting today...I also finally lost the little wee tiny e-clip that holds the choke lever together. Fortunately, the hair pin clips from the Rochester Model B are a perfect fit for replacement and much easier to snap on and off with needle nose plyers than the lil wee tiny hard as heck to manipulate Weber e-clip. So, a bit of the old and the new on this carb now.

As you know, I'd been richening the secondary circuit for greater highway speed acceleration and higher power at WOT. I settled on a 165 secondary main jet (factory was a 140 jet). It provides plenty of instant and smooth acceleration from 45 mph up to 80+ without smoke, pinging, fouled plugs or lag.

On the primary circuit, where 90+% of the driving occurs I had started with the factory 140 main jet and leaned it progressively downward to a 130 size. Each time going back to baseline mix and idle settings and tweaking the settings for best performance. In each instance, fuel mileage increased with either an increase in performance from idle to 2500 rpm or at least no drivability problems. This last trip, to the low country and back saw John Lee pulling 17.5 and 18 mpg highway at 60 mph average on country highways with plenty of power for short runs on the right lane of the interstate at 65 mph. To say I'm tickled is an understatement.

I pulled plugs this morning to check the tops of the pistons and confirmed this is a 71 Olds 250 Cu In engine. In addition, my center plugs were toast brown even all over with the electrode color change right in the middle. The forward plugs were slightly less toast brown but not so much I was concerned about the end cylinders being too lean. Again, this plugs electrode showed color change at the middle near the bend indicating good heat range and proper timing. So, just to see if any more lean on the primary was indicated, I pulled the 130 main jet and replaced it with one size smaller, a 125 main jet.

So, what to do, since I still had a somewhat annoying buzz transitioning from idle to run. Just an instant of hesitation as air rushes in and the system buzzes momentarily lean then catches up. I'd previously richened the primary idle jet from 60 to 65 size and while this did not remove the buzz, it did increase power and performance from idle to about 2500 rpm. It also allowed me to lean the mixture screw down to 2.5 turns rich with is right on the rich end of the allowable mixture tolerance for this carb per Weber USA.

But, still the buzz and still at the top end of the rich adjustment...well, the number of turns and the lean buzz indicated my primary idle jet was still a bit too small, too lean...so, a quick install of a 70 size jet and a tweaking of mix and idle speed. While my idle mix is still happiest at just shy of 2.5 turns rich, the idle speed (550 rpm) comes on at 5/6 of a turn in on the speed screw - previously it was 1.3 turns in. This new setting of just shy of 1 turn in from first contact is perfect as it keeps the primary butterfly durn near closed at idle. That's as it should be...idle on emulsified fuel from the idle port and run to 2500 rpm on that same emulsified fuel from the slightly higher transition port (the transition port also receiving all of its fuel thru that #70 idle mixture jet). And?

Hooo Ahhh!,,,,the annoying buzz is gone!

Took John Lee out for a test ride and celebrated with an icy cold R-o-C Co-Cola! Smooth buzz free transition from idle to run. Plenty of power across the entire band.

Now for more driving and some plug checks but...that's it, I think the carb is done.

But...final carb settings seem to be as follows:

Cold Idle: 1200rpm with first kick down to 800 rpm
Hot idle: 550 rpm
Primary Idle Jet: #70 (Large body jet)
Secondary Idle Jet: #50 (Small body jet)
Primary Main Jet: #125
Secondary Main Jet: #165
Idle mixture: Just shy of 2.50 turns out from bottom
Idle speed/butterfly adjustment: 5/6 (fifth flat on a six sided screw head) of one turn in from first contact with linkage
HEI timed 18 Degrees BTDC (35ish degrees all in w/no vacuum advance hook up at 3000 rpm)
Plugs gapped at a strong 45 thousands - plugs burning brown/clean.

[Sharps40]

An increasing drip from the front main seal to the floor. It had to happen eventually. Rebuild was 1994 and only 200 miles run on it when I bought John Lee in late March 2013. But, do I want to drain the radiator and unhook all them new hoses....no! (Course if ya still have the I6 Radiator on the forward mounts, all bets are off, pull the radiator. I have the V8 radiator on the rear mounts so a simple lift and plenty of room.)

So, unbolt the top clamp, pull the fan and pulleys and belt and raise the radiator about 6 inches and hang it from the hood. Nice, now I have the room needed to install the blanacer puller and work the balancer off for repairs. While out, I cleaned it, inspected the rubber union and installed a National/Fed Mogul balancer repair sleeve. The balancer shaft was scored from years of runnin on the seals and the seal was dry and cracked/worn. So, a leak. Then, carefully pull out the old crank seal from the timing cover, clean up the recess and tap in a new National/Fed Mogul seal. Lotsa grease on everything for the install and with the radiator up, there is enough room to tap, tap, tap, the balancer, with a variety of medium and large SmasherWackers until it reseats on the crank snout....Boing, a change in pitch and you know the balancer is fully seated.



Now, balancer and new seals in place. Time to mod the crank snout for a balancer retention bolt. The V8 bolt is too long and hasn't enough thread for the I6 so I purchased a 2" long, fully threaded bolt in 7/16x20 to go with the Mr Gasket washers from the V8 balancer bolt kit....(adding threads to a grade 8 bolt is an exercise in futility, just buy a somewhat shorter, fully threaded bolt and be done with it.) In any event, there is enough room to drill a 25/64 tap hole in the snout with the radiator up but ya have to raise the engine about an inch to get the drill positioned for a straight in hole. If you don't raise the motor its gonna need a real small drill and a much shorter bit than I have....a 90 degree headed drill might fit w/o raising the engine, but, I just lifted it. Its only another 15 minutes work to unbolt the engine stands.



Now, I had a dull tap, even in iron it rolled in threads instead of cutting them so I took a break to hit the store for a good tap wrench and a spanky new and sharp 7/16x20 tap. But, drillin the hole, watch yer angles, get it straight in and go about 1/8" deeper than the length of the bolt beyond the washers. I use WD40 to start the threads then switch to axle grease to catch the chips and move em outta the way.



Once the new bolt and the newly drilled and tapped snout is swarfed clean with brake cleaner and all the chips blasted away and the pulley groove is dry/clean, install the new bolt with medium strength blue locktite, the flat washer and the lock washer. Snug it up tight. Clean up, start up and go ride....no more leaks! Yee Haaa!!! Hope the rear main don't start leakin!

[T Smith]

Good on you! Can't put a price on piece of mind that the balancer ain't coming off and I do hate oil leaks!

May just be an optical delusion and really doesn't matter but that tap looks crooked in the picture?

[Sharps40]

Prolly is crooked, I took the shot after cleaning everything up...I think its in a thread or three. Sides, drilled by hand and not on a lathe, the hole is bound to be a bit crooked. But, bolt and washer pulled up snug and flush and I'm feeling that piece of mind that comes with good mechanical fasteners as opposed to smushin two parts together with a hammer!

[jcramsey]

Lookin good...let me know if you ever make it further south in the low country!
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