Restoring Rusty

[lkfldredneck]

Originally Posted by Gregski

~ Mo Parts ~

chocolate donuts showed up today fer da core support, they don't look like the stock ones, hmm, must be more better

I had one hell of a time with my core support mounts. had to get longer bolts. hope yours goes easier, then again its LMC parts

[daddyjeep]

Originally Posted by Gregski

Man, UNBELIEVABLE, the forecast for the next two days (Friday and Saturday) is Rain!!!
They must have known the Greg is ready to paint some stuff.

~ Never Fails ~

3-5" of snow here tonight. I would much rather have the rain.

[Gregski]

Saturday = RAIN !

[Gregski]

Sunday = RAIN !!!

[Gregski]

alright guys, it's raining this weekend, we get it, but that don't mean we get to sit idle, so as you may recall when we set out on this last excursion we called it March Madness, oh yeah, I remember, but didn't all you do was swap some heads on your engine, what's the big deal amigo?

Um no, there's much more to MARCH MADNESS than that, so let's list all the things we are doing before this all goes back together on D Day, Saturday April 16th, 2016

1. Vortec Cylinder Head - Top End Upgrade

2. Paint Frame \ Crossmember

3. Midmount Alternator & Re Route \ Clean Up Engine Wire Harness

4. Replace \ Paint Core Support

5. Black Out Grille Molding and Headlight Bezzels

6. Overdrive Transmission Upgrade

anything jump out at you guys there? ha ha anything we haven't touched on yet...

[Gregski]

ladies and gentelmen, I may have pointed this out before, but it's worth saying again, I have picked out my truck for as much as it didn't have as for what it had

I did not want a 4x4, I did not want an Automatic, I did not want Air Conditioning, I did not want 3/4 ton or a 1 ton truck, nor did I want a long bed.

I wanted a 2WD, 350 V8, manual, short bed, plain Jane, dime a doze (or so I thought, but these plain trucks are harder to find than you know), simple and easy to work on.

And I pretty much got all that, but one thing. Ok, two things I wish the truck had.

1. OVERDRIVE TRANSMISSION, I had no idea going beyond 1:1 ratio wouldn't become the norm till the 80's lol when I bought my beloved '74

2. POSI rear end, I mean paleaze One Wheel Peels are for kidz, ha ha, more on that later [spoiler alert]

and so The Greg went Big Game a hunting for a very rare albino samoan polar bear unit called the New Process 833 trans-a-mission

and on one faithful day back in December '15 he found one

AND WHAT AN ABSOLUTE BEAUTY SHE WAS ~ TAKE A LOOK ~

Craigslist Condition: "Mint"

[Gregski]

now there may be some overlap coming up with my other thread called What can be said about the 4-speed New Process NV833 overdrive manual transmission? which you may or may not have seen, I apologize for the redundancy and will try to keep this more on point of the upgrade and installation process and not bore you to death with regurgitated "facts" and "specs" of that unit that I just happened to gleen off the InterWebs pretending to be a self proclaimed expert on the topic, ha ha

so how much did The Greg drop on this thing? $300 bucks, $500 dollars, surely no more than $750 bones? WHAT? he paid NINE HUNDRED AND FIFTY DOLLARS for it, what a dope!!!

Wait, and he drove over 350 miles one way to pick it up! ah jeez, I gotta hear him explain his way out of this one, lemme pull up a chair

[Gregski]

wow, tough crowd, tough crowd

well guys let me share some insight with you, things I learned along the way while researching this trans, as it may help you

I went the Saginaw 4 speed route and the Muncie 4 speed route first and learned those transmissions were not overdrive transmissions, I was surprised, I did not realize there was no overdrive in the 60's (you know what I mean, I mean not every car had it, I'm sure some did) not even in the 70's

cars ran around with 2 speed automatics for crying out loud with names like Powerglide, and then the 3 speed automatics called Turbo this and that, (non of it being Turbo in any way mind you) then there were 3 on the Tree manuals, wow THREE GEARS really, sounds cool Three on The Tree, but honestly wheres the other gear, LOL

OK, so I punted on the 60s/70s technology and fast forwarded to the 90s ok I will get an NV3500, wait what? they are weak, they come on six banger trucks, ok what about their big brother the NV4500, ok better, but wait the case is longer the stick is going to be between my girlfriends legs, and then theres the whole Getrag mix up confusion (say what? GetWho?) yeah there's the German overbuilt overcomplicated unit that looks like the NV4500 to the uninitiated [pronounced] ME and if you pull the wrong one at the junkyard no one in the States will touch it - go ahead Google it [we'll wait]...

... and then there's the speedo electronic connection instead of the cable, and this and thats, and nope, we'll punt on the 90's tech

OK, back to the 80s, hmmm wonder if these trucks ever came with Overdrive transmissions from the factory? Say what? They did? Thank you Wikipedia.

and that's how we got ourselves one of them 1980-85ish ... (87ish) New Process 833 units

[enaberif]

Its funny how we want so many options out of a truck but always have to settle simply because what we want isn't available. Where I live short box trucks are almost impossible to find in the 73-87 and 88-98 era so you usually end up with a long box unfortunately.

As you also have found the NV3500/4500 are not that great of transmissions as the stated reasons about but one thing about the 4500 that is even worse is it requires a special type of fluid that is STUPID expensive from the dealership. NV3500s have an issue with the 5th/Reverse nut coming off randomly and losing those gears.

For the 73-87 era and 2wd trucks the A833 is a perfect choice IF you can find them and for the 88-98 era the T56 is a good choice as well.

[Gregski]

so after looking for one for over a year, sure missing a good deal here and there, you know how that goes, you hesitate to pull the trigger than you wish you had - I finally found one, the guy wanted $950 for it and would not budge on the price (I know I tried to negotiate, honest I did, I'm not made of money)

but to sweeten the deal and justify the cost he inclduded / threw in the following

1. The HURST shifter and linkage (later we found out one rod was missing, and the threads on the stick were broken)

2. The dual bolt pattern bellhousing (we thought it was for the hydraulic clutch but it wasn't, and later we found out the trans was dual bolt pattern also)

3. The crossmember (that we needed)

4. The clutch disc and pressure plate (who uses used parts anyways)

5. The pedals (we thought it uses different pedals cause of the hydraulic clutch)

[Oberon67]

Originally Posted by Gregski

wow, tough crowd, tough crowd

well guys let me share some insight with you, things I learned along the way while researching this trans, as it may help you

I went the Saginaw 4 speed route and the Muncie 4 speed route first and learned those transmissions were not overdrive transmissions, I was surprised, I did not realize there was no overdrive in the 60's (you know what I mean, I mean not every car had it, I'm sure some did) not even in the 70's

cars ran around with 2 speed automatics for crying out loud with names like Powerglide, and then the 3 speed automatics called Turbo this and that, (non of it being Turbo in any way mind you) then there were 3 on the Tree manuals, wow THREE GEARS really, sounds cool Three on The Tree, but honestly wheres the other gear, LOL

OK, so I punted on the 60s/70s technology and fast forwarded to the 90s ok I will get an NV3500, wait what? they are weak, they come on six banger trucks, ok what about their big brother the NV4500, ok better, but wait the case is longer the stick is going to be between my girlfriends legs, and then theres the whole Getrag mix up confusion (say what? GetWho?) yeah there's the German overbuilt overcomplicated unit that looks like the NV4500 to the uninitiated [pronounced] ME and if you pull the wrong one at the junkyard no one in the States will touch it - go ahead Google it [we'll wait]...

... and then there's the speedo electronic connection instead of the cable, and this and thats, and nope, we'll punt on the 90's tech

OK, back to the 80s, hmmm wonder if these trucks ever came with Overdrive transmissions from the factory? Say what? They did? Thank you Wikipedia.

and that's how we got ourselves one of them 1980-85ish ... (87ish) New Process 833 units

Was there a reason why you didn't just go with the Muncie, and put a lower rear-end ratio in it?

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by Oberon67

Was there a reason why you didn't just go with the Muncie, and put a lower rear-end ratio in it?

Honestly, cause I'm not that smart, but I'm learning, and wouldn't that effect my gitty up, in other words if I put in highway gears in the diff to cruise at 75 MPH at about 2500 RPM wouldn't my truck be slower off the line, yet with an overdrive trans I get the best of both worlds a "quick" and I use that term loosely, LOL truck off the line and a happy truck on the freeway

[Gregski]

so The Greg began cleaning the parts for the new transmission, starting with the new cross member, I have not pulled out my old cross member yet for a stare and compare but I think they is different

the new one I think is multi talented in that it (I'm taking a guess here) can support the TH350 Trubo 350 automatic as well as the 833 manual, correct me if I am wrong, I think it is also rubber mounted, oh yeah this is where I tell you the donor truck was a 1984 supposedly (I never saw it)

[Gregski]

and into the paint booth it went, actually used POR15 on this baby for durability, I like painting things with a brush, need to do that more, spraying wastes a lot more prodcut

[Titomars]

Originally Posted by Gregski

so how much did The Greg drop on this thing? $300 bucks, $500 dollars, surely no more than $750 bones? WHAT? he paid NINE HUNDRED AND FIFTY DOLLARS for it, what a dope!!!

Wait, and he drove over 350 miles one way to pick it up! ah jeez, I gotta hear him explain his way out of this one, lemme pull up a chair

Hummm, I have been following your other thread. Low and behold the other night I saw a GM 833 on C/L the guy is asking $400.00
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/pts/5513697175.html

At one time I really wanted to convert mine over to a 4 spd. But not a truck 4 spd. being a big block only one 4 spd. would do me. The rare and disgustingly expensive M22 rock-crusher. I finally decided that a built TH400 would do me.

[Titomars]

Originally Posted by Gregski

so The Greg began cleaning the parts for the new transmission, starting with the new cross member, I have not pulled out my old cross member yet for a stare and compare but I think they is different

the new one I think is multi talented in that it (I'm taking a guess here) can support the TH350 Trubo 350 automatic as well as the 833 manual, correct me if I am wrong, I think it is also rubber mounted, oh yeah this is where I tell you the donor truck was a 1984 supposedly (I never saw it)

That is multi talented looks just like a 4X4 cross member.

[Gregski]

the transmission bracket that goes between the transmission and the crossmember looks different than the one for the SM465 granny gear Muncie, slightly different, they both attach to the trans with two bolts and that top part matches, but the bottom is different the Muncie attaches with two bolts, the 833 uses just one

top Muncie bracket

bottom 833 bracket

keep in mind I have not done this swap yet, I am in the process so if I state or make any mistakes, please correct me

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by Titomars

Hummm, I have been following your other thread. Low and behold the other night I saw a GM 833 on C/L the guy is asking $400.00
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/pts/5513697175.html

Oh my, that is an EXCELLENT deal especially since it comes with the linkage and shifter and bell housing, someone ought to snatch it up!

and I was just in the Bay yesterday dang it

[Titomars]

Originally Posted by Gregski

the transmission bracket that goes between the transmission and the crossmember looks different than the one for the SM465 granny gear Muncie, slightly different, they both attach to the trans with two bolts and that top part matches, but the bottom is different the Muncie attaches with two bolts, the 833 uses just one

top Muncie bracket

bottom 833 bracket

keep in mind I have not done this swap yet, I am in the process so if I state or make any mistakes, please correct me

you can use the 2 bolt if you like dependent on your cross member. Or if you have a preference of one or two bolts. mount height is the only thing you might need to watch for. GM used basically 2 different heights. the difference is about 1 inch between the two

[Titomars]

Originally Posted by Gregski

Oh my, that is an EXCELLENT deal especially since it comes with the linkage and shifter and bell housing, someone ought to snatch it up!

and I was just in the Bay yesterday dang it

I had thought about one of these back when I was wanting a manual transmission. But I deemed it not strong enough for my 454.

[Gregski]

alright lets see these beauties side by side

833 on top

Muncie on bottom

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by Titomars

I had thought about one of these back when I was wanting a manual transmission. But I deemed it not strong enough for my 454.

are you saying it may work with my old Muncie crossmember? this one with that big drop in the middle?

[Gregski]

I think I am going to use the new bell housing just because I don't like the pointy Bermuda triangle in my old one, it just gets in the way, no idea what it's for

plus since both the bell and the trans have the dual bolt patterns I may put in a few extra bolts just for good measure, to control that torque monster, ha ha

[Titomars]

Originally Posted by Gregski

are you saying it may work with my old Muncie crossmember? this one with that big drop in the middle?

Looking at your photos...... Yes it appears you could. the 833 member bolts to the bottom of the frame rails and the Muncie obviously bolts to the top. if you look closely you will see your frame has extra cross member holes in it for the many different trans options. Also the 833 member bolts to the underside of the rail flange

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by Titomars

That is multi talented looks just like a 4X4 cross member.

OK, that makes sense. But wait a minute. The seller said his boys were going to convert an automatic 4x4 truck to the 833 manual, and I pulled this crossmember off of the 4x4 automatic truck not quite understanding what the dad was telling me I was just grabbing what ever parts he was willing to part with. So maybe this crossmember will work with my trans, or maybe I didn't even need it.

One thing I just learned looking at my old pics of my crossmember, is that mine is mounted high to the top frame rail ie C channel where as the new crossmember I believe was mounted down low to the bottom of the frame rail C channel.