LS1 Bagged 52 Chevy 3100 Build

[w70442]

Hi,
Nice work. Looks like we are doing nearly identical builds. I'm putting a 49 5 window on an 88 s10 frame with the drivetrain from a 2000 formula firebird. I too bought a wrecked car and plan to use as much of it as I can.

I'm also currently trying to work out where to place the enigine due to the compressor and alternator issues. With the idea of using everything from the firebird I could, I looked into using the rack and pinion to replace the old steering gear box since it is in the way anyway. Good news, bad news. Bad news is that the firebird rack is too wide. The good news is that I think I can still convert it to a rack and pinion and keep the alternator in the stock location. By replacing the oil pan with the H3 hummer "muscle car" pan, I will be able to move the engine a few more inches forward creating a gap between the rear of the alternator and the frame cradle in order to get a steering shaft from a rack and pinion up through the opening. I'm waiting on the stainless s10 swap headers I ordered so I can see how high the engine will actually need to sit with those installed. That may open up that gap a little more.
There seems to be a lot of mystery/misinformation out there about converting to rack and pinions. Yes, if you don't keep the original geometry of the steering components intact, you will have problems. I think I have found a good solution. Well, borrowed someone elses good solution anyway. I've found that there are a few companies offering rack and pinion conversion kits for older gear box steering cars. One solution is to fabricate a bracket that attaches to both inner tie rods so that when they move, they carry/move the new bracket. The bracekt basically replaces the drag link. The original inner tie rods attach to the bracket transferring the steering through them.
This gives you more responsive steering simply due to the rack and pinion technology itself over the old ball bearing gear box but it also eliminates 4 joints in the old steering system that can cause slop. Two joints at the idler arm and two at the pitman arm. Plus, with the steering box gone, it won't interfere with the radiator installation.
Here's a link to one of the rack and pinion set ups. They are a little pricy. I would think somone with a welder and plasma cutter could easily duplicate this set. Now to find a smaller (narrower) rack .....
http://www.flamingriver.com/index.ph.../s0014/FR331KT

[Bagged3100]

Hey w70442 I looked into trying to adapt a rack and pinion off of something else also. But everything ive read and looked at all said it was very difficult to get everything to line up perfectly and not cause major problems. And as far as putting the engine in the frame so it clears the alt. in the stock location it would have to be moved forward a good bit and sit really high. And i think if you move it that far forward there would be way to much weight hanging out infront of the axle. Also would have really bad roll center with the engine sitting so high. Are you running the a/c compressor in the stock location also cause that will give you some fitment issues also.

[Bagged3100]

Today I tore apart my door hinges and sandblasted them painted them and rebuilt them with new pins and springs. I got them installed and also aligned the doors the best there gonna get for now with the old style latches.

[w70442]

Originally Posted by Bagged3100

Hey w70442 I looked into trying to adapt a rack and pinion off of something else also. But everything ive read and looked at all said it was very difficult to get everything to line up perfectly and not cause major problems. And as far as putting the engine in the frame so it clears the alt. in the stock location it would have to be moved forward a good bit and sit really high. And i think if you move it that far forward there would be way to much weight hanging out infront of the axle. Also would have really bad roll center with the engine sitting so high. Are you running the a/c compressor in the stock location also cause that will give you some fitment issues also.

Hi,
I'm still in the process of locating the engine but it appears to me that the engine won't really be any further forward than the stock s10 engine was. Granted, the s10 engine prob didn't weigh as much as the ls1 but the position of the weight looks to be similar. I don't know how high the s10 engine sat but the ls1 shouldn't be much, if any higher. Right now, my clam shell mounts are on the engine and are about 1/2" from the pass side cradle and about 1 1/4" from the driver side. I'm moving the engine toward the pass side an inch to gain clearance for the headers on the driver side. That said, I'm going to cut and reposition the down tube on the driver side so maybe I can center it after all. I bought the Hummer H3 oil pan in order to be able to move the engine forward as much as I did. I haven't put the pan on yet but I don't think I will have to raise the engine much if any with it installed.
Yes, I plan to notch the pass frame rail to keep the compressor in the stock location. I really don't want to have the alt and compressor mounted way up on top on the engine. I'm not concerned about notching the frame rail in front of the cradle as it isn't really doing anything but supporting the fenders and radiator anyway. However, the cradle will have to be notched a little for the compressor.
Using the stainless headers from racing innovations (ebay $199), you have two choices for engine location. Either with the alternator about 2-3 inches ahead of the cradle or about 8 inches further back which causes the alt to hit the cradle. To use this position, you also have to make a plate to weld to the cradle basically extending the cradle toward the rear of the car so you can mount the motor mounts to that plate. This gives tons of room up front but causes you to have to relocate the alt and compressor.
Just bought the 1/4" sheet metal to make the rack and pinion mounting set up like I saw at flaming river. I'll post how that turns out on my build thread, "49 5 window firebird".

[48ChevBagged]

Like your build. Looks like you have a good start. I love the choice of the engine. I have done several of these trucks now and my last one had a 4.8 LS with a 4L60e trans. Good luck on the build I will be following along.

[8LUG]

Great work bro!!

[Bagged3100]

Thanks alot 48ChevBagged and 8Lug, your truck looks good 48ChevBagged. But I got a alot of parts in yesterday. I got my steering coulumn and drop mount and floor mount from summit racing and my full chassis wiring harness from speedway and also got new rockers and inner and outer cab corners. Gonna replace the body panels next.

I AM STILL WAITING ON MY CONTROL ARMS!!!

[ratty 46]

Interesting & well thought out build. Sux that the frame guy BS'd you. You did, however, overcome that issue.

I'm watch'n.

[tlorber]

Bagged,
Nice Thread. I am just in the beginning stages of a frame swap, so I am watching with great interest. I had a couple comments from research I've been doing:
The truck motor I am buying (LM7 from a Silverado) has the alternator and AC compressor at the top of the motor, so clearly there are stock brackets that might get you where you need to be. Also, most threads describe having to cut the floor and fabricate a tunnel. Before you chuck the firebird body, maybe could use that tunnel as a starting point for a refab? If that's the case I'd like to know for mine.

[99 to Life]

Hey man, great looking truck, nice score. I'm in PA too, northwestern part, titusville and pittsburgh areas. I have quite a few of these trucks, doing another as we speak. Bagged 49' on dime frame but not LS on this one. I'm laying out my suspension first, so I can see where my lowest point and ride height are gonna be, then that will dictate how high I mount the body. Are your arms coming from thor bros too? I'v heard turnaround is really slow. Hope you get them soon so you can really get working on your suspension.

Lastly, maybe I missed it, with your shorbed frame being 108 inches, you could just section it right after the cab and add your 9.7" inches there, that way your axle hump, pearches all move as one, then no need for the extra length you added on back. Just a thought. Nice work so far, can't wait to see it unfold.

[mcdonald77]

currentperformance has some nice poly engine mounts instead of the clamshell. I used there mounts and other parts. The LS engine was in the stock location and I used my original drive shaft. If the engine is in the stock location, the 8.8 should be fine using the stock s10 drive shaft.

[Bagged3100]

Hey everyone, sorry its been awhile since ive posted anything. But thanks for the comments ratty46, tlorber, 99 to life and mcdonald77. I havent had much time out in the garage but i did manage to get the rockers replaced and also the bottoms of all the corners. It was pretty mentally challanging, mostly because the panels were cheap and not very well made. If I had to do it again i think i would have paid the extra money and went with a higher grade company. But its done now and time to move on to redoing the cab mounts and making a floor.

[Bagged3100]

Replacing all the rusted panels

[Bagged3100]

New panels are in

[Bagged3100]

The new panels are in

[Bagged3100]

Cutting the rusted floor out now. Then redoing the cab mounts because I did not like how much play is in the s-10 cab mounts. I am making mounts so that all i have to do is drop a bolt down through the mount and it lines the cab up perfectly every single time.

[ratty 46]

Looks like you got some metal work to do ... and moving right alone.

Keep us posted.

R46

[daveshilling]

the frame-bolt thing you are doing is exactly the typer of tips/tricks we should be gathering somewhere...perhaps a Body Panel tips/tricks thread? Has this been done and I'm just rehashing?

[99 to Life]

hell yah, thats what I like to see, bringing it all back. nice work

[Bagged3100]

Ok I got a little bit of work done on the truck. I redid all my cab mounts and also made the the braces for the floor

[Bagged3100]

The tubing for the front brace was in the way for my transmission to mount up so I had to make a notch for the transmission to clear. This will also be my transmission tunnel for the floor.

[99 to Life]

bagged3100, coming along man. What is your seat situation with that shifter location? you going with bench or bucket? Also where the patches from? I'll be working on my floor real soon. I'm trying to make almost everything, have some ideas and plans to make my own panels in multiple production. Hope you get some work done over the holidays.

[sqrlnts]

Killer job, can't wait to see this one come together. Keep up the hard work and thanks for sharing.

[Jgowin]

Looks great, I'm doing floors cab corners on mine currently as well. And I agree with you on the rust repair panels, it's a pain getting them to fit.

[Bagged3100]

Hey thanks for the comments guys, 99tolife the shifter works out perfectly. But yes i am running bucket seats not a bench seat. It would deffenitly not clear a bench. I got my parts from the car and truck shop located in California. And its nice to hear that your gonna be making all your floor panels yourself from scratch. Thats what my plan is as well. I have it all in my head but wheather or not it will work out as nicely as i have it planned ill have to wait and see.