There is Rare, then there is Super Rare!

[palallin]

I apologize up front.

Blazerman can, of course, do whatever he wants with his truck, up to and including driving it off a cliff, and I would never advocate otherwise.

But why, in a topic celebrating the uniqueness of a super rare truck, are people pushing to modify that unique driveline and turn a super rare truck into just another morphodite?

[LockDoc]

Originally Posted by Dieselwrencher

Such a very cool truck. That rear side pic is very nice to see. They were probably the only ones to do the rear like that I'd have to bet.

Originally Posted by special-K

I have thought about brackets like that to lift a truck and wondered why I hadn't seen it done. Makes sense that M-H would since they are in the business of adapting drivetrain to chassis.

I guess you could also use them up instead of down to lower it...

LockDoc

[LockDoc]

Originally Posted by palallin

I apologize up front.

Blazerman can, of course, do whatever he wants with his truck, up to and including driving it off a cliff, and I would never advocate otherwise.

But why, in a topic celebrating the uniqueness of a super rare truck, are people pushing to modify that unique driveline and turn a super rare truck into just another morphodite?

Discussion my friend, just discussion....

LockDoc

[BLAZERMAN]

Originally Posted by palallin

I apologize up front.

Blazerman can, of course, do whatever he wants with his truck, up to and including driving it off a cliff, and I would never advocate otherwise.

But why, in a topic celebrating the uniqueness of a super rare truck, are people pushing to modify that unique driveline and turn a super rare truck into just another morphodite?

I've been a member here for 22 years and even tho I don't post much these days I would like to stick around awhile.longer so I can't respond to your comment about me without getting banned!
As far as other comments on changing things they come from guys like me that can appreciate a truck like this but would like it drivable. All add on overdrives bolt to the rear of the trans and add about a foot of length . This would mean having to move the T/C and it's cross member much farther back, with it's 157" wheelbase it wouldn't hurt much but would add about another foot to an already.long front driveshaft. I was just suggesting a much simpler alternative that would actually change the truck the least. I would love to see this truck go to someone here that would build it to suit their needs and changing as little as.possible and "drive it" and make it usable as it was intended to be.

[special-K]

Originally Posted by palallin

I apologize up front.

Blazerman can, of course, do whatever he wants with his truck, up to and including driving it off a cliff, and I would never advocate otherwise.

But why, in a topic celebrating the uniqueness of a super rare truck, are people pushing to modify that unique driveline and turn a super rare truck into just another morphodite?

I didn't see anything suggested here that would rape this truck of it's original uniqueness nor turn it into any type of morhodite. What was suggested would only make the truck useful for hiway travel. Since it is just a cab & chassis, a practical use for this truck today would be build it into a classic camper. A simple transmission swap or adding on an auxiliary overdrive, which could have been done back then, would enable the truck to be a traveling machine. To a true truck loving guy like myself, I see a cab & chassis as an empty canvas same as when it left Marmon-Herrington's shop on it's way to begin having fire apparatus installed. All that equipment has been removed so someone else already changed it. It's back to where it started. I'd also like to put a dump body or flatbed with a hoist on it. It would be cool if someone with deep pockets could put it back to a brush fire tanker. But then what use would it e other than to show? Personally, I like to see these trucks get used

[factorystock]

Originally Posted by palallin

But why, in a topic celebrating the uniqueness of a super rare truck, are people pushing to modify that unique driveline and turn a super rare truck into just another morphodite?

IMO, functional upgrades would not take away from what it is, it is still a rare 4x4 conversion to a HD 3500. These upgrades are solutions to pieces that should be on a truck like this. The solid 19.5" is easier to service than the 3 piece 18" and was a period option on these trucks. The overdrive would make this vehicle more blacktop friendly. GM should have had a overdrive option in this series truck, International, which had trucks in this GVW also, did offer a 5 speed overdrive. International had a truck ratio overdrive of .8, NV's are around .73, so, 6.17x.73= 4.50 final ratio, still considered low, but more flexible.

[TALLone71]

I agree that the modifications to the driveline above would make the truck more suitable, for driving on a daily basis, or tailor it to the needs of of its new owner.as far as the body choice that goes onto it, the truck was built as a cab and chassis, and was modified by m-h, and in spirit all of the suggestions and thoughts about what to do to it, I feel are in keeping with the original thought and spirit of this truck. it would be great to see it back in service, and running again, and getting a new lease on life

[palallin]

Originally Posted by BLAZERMAN

I've been a member here for 22 years and even tho I don't post much these days I would like to stick around awhile.longer so I can't respond to your comment about me without getting banned!

I don't believe I made a comment about you in particular or about anyone in general. I asked a question about a subject of discussion.

If you have something to get off your chest, I'll be happy to provide my personal email so that you can do so without fear of banning.

[special-K]

Originally Posted by palallin

I don't believe I made a comment about you in particular or about anyone in general. I asked a question about a subject of discussion.

If you have something to get off your chest, I'll be happy to provide my personal email so that you can do so without fear of banning.

This is what you said directly about Blazerman:

Originally Posted by palallin

Blazerman can, of course, do whatever he wants with his truck, up to and including driving it off a cliff, and I would never advocate otherwise.

I can see how that could be taken as offensive. First of all, he stated he does not intend to buy it. In fact, he posted it so maybe someone here might. So knowing that, why say what you did? I realize words can be taken the wrong way in print. But it doesn't take much imagination to see how this could be an offensive comment. Certainly an out of context one. Not sure who here has something to get off their chest.

[Dieselwrencher]

Originally Posted by palallin

I apologize up front.

Blazerman can, of course, do whatever he wants with his truck, up to and including driving it off a cliff, and I would never advocate otherwise.

But why, in a topic celebrating the uniqueness of a super rare truck, are people pushing to modify that unique driveline and turn a super rare truck into just another morphodite?

Yes the truck is super rare. But on the flip side of that coin, the truck hasn't been used for several years and there are reasons for that. They suck to drive compared to a newer truck in the same config. Drivability/usability is the main thing IMO. The only people that want these are guys like us that love the odd heavy duty 4x4 stuff, or the off chance purist that wants to preserve them. This later part is highly unlikely because this truck is too rough for one of those types.

So why would you keep it stock if it sucks especially if you're buying it and want to use it? I mean actually use it. Not just haul fence posts on your farm once a year. I guess my truck would fit the morphydite category. But I use that morphydite for nearly everything I do. It just can't haul my family, not enough cab.

Now, with all this being said, if this truck had an Eaton front axle, I would have already made arrangements to buy it. I absolutely hate those D70 weak axles and the truck itself isn't any cool trim package or even a big block truck. (I used to own a couple of the Dodge D70F fronts and was going to put one under my Longhorn) To me that would be the only reason to keep it original. Someday I'll build a Napco clone Longhorn crew cab and it'll have an Eaton front axle just because I want one. It might be on air ride, or coils, or who knows but it will be built to use. You aren't going to use a truck as a working rig or hauler if it has no OD and 4.88s. GM didn't sell many of them or have many of them built because the orders weren't there. The people in the industry already had a clue on which trucks suited their needs. You can't go on many old farms around these parts and not find an old binder truck. I've seen several old 60s-70s 4x4 1 ton on up trucks mainly being IH's. I've yet to find a Chevy or GMC converted truck in the wild. I look constantly and have several others around looking as well.

If the truck was nicer I bet Joesjunk would already have it. Then it would stay preserved.

[special-K]

I would restore that to as close to original as possible to take to antique truck shows to show as an example of what was possible back then. I always do my trucks with a time period it is from or went through in mind. It would need to have some sort of body installed, so I would pick a theme and choose accordingly, same as was done with such trucks when new. GM would build the platform, and the rest of the build would be done by a truck upfitter, such as a fire apparatus business. The only all factory truck with a bed other than a pickup box was the flatbed. All others were fitted with aftermarket bodies as well as other associated equipment required by the tasks the truck was bought to do.

I think a service body (utility bed) would be my most likely choice, since that is what I like and have built for my work through the years. It would relate to my own history. That said, Alaskan campers likes to put their units on utility beds. Last catalog I had they offered them as an option. And they make a camper to fit the standard utility bed sizes. There were camping rigs built back in this truck's heyday just like that, so could be era-correct. If I did all that I would certainly want to use it for more than taking to a few shows a year. I would be using it as built, go camping! That means traveling some distance, so there comes the changes. The truck would be doing more than darting out of the firehouse to fires rarely more than a handful of miles away. And these trucks weren't geared well for the hiway. The year after this truck was made the national speed limit was dropped to 55 mph. For a little more than two decades these trucks were just fine out on the hiway. Installing overdrive in a hiway truck has been commonly done since way before we saw cars and light trucks get overdrive. It was done way before '72. Overdrive was known as a big rig thing when I was growing up. On a truck like this it would be the type of mod you would expect to see, same as a PTO winch, snow plow, dump hoist, lift gate, etc. As far as changing tire size goes, it's the same as the wheels that most commonly came on C/20s. 16.5s that have become about obsolete or 16s that came on obsolete split rims. We are out here looking for what we can get tires for and be serviced in a size and design as close to original as possible, in a commonly available size today. None of these changes are done for the purpose of altering the truck to please a fickle trend. They are done to better gain the intended use from the truck, same as when it was new.

These days a truck like this would come with a diesel. If diesels were offered back then, this one would be a most likely candidate. I didn't bring that up till now because I am appreciating the truck for what it is. I could see a business owning this truck for true work purposes doing a swap as a practical thing. Trucks have been built by their owners for practical uses since long before the widespread "hobby truck builds" we see happening today. You might say trucks have always been built to customize. Except for pickups, trucks come as a power unit to install needed equipment on. They are all custom

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by palallin

I don't believe I made a comment about you in particular or about anyone in general. I asked a question about a subject of discussion.

If you have something to get off your chest, I'll be happy to provide my personal email so that you can do so without fear of banning.

I read the comments & did not interpret anything as offensive.

[Joesjunk]

Originally Posted by Dieselwrencher

Yes the truck is super rare. But on the flip side of that coin, the truck hasn't been used for several years and there are reasons for that. They suck to drive compared to a newer truck in the same config. Drivability/usability is the main thing IMO. The only people that want these are guys like us that love the odd heavy duty 4x4 stuff, or the off chance purist that wants to preserve them. This later part is highly unlikely because this truck is too rough for one of those types.

So why would you keep it stock if it sucks especially if you're buying it and want to use it? I mean actually use it. Not just haul fence posts on your farm once a year. I guess my truck would fit the morphydite category. But I use that morphydite for nearly everything I do. It just can't haul my family, not enough cab.

Now, with all this being said, if this truck had an Eaton front axle, I would have already made arrangements to buy it. I absolutely hate those D70 weak axles and the truck itself isn't any cool trim package or even a big block truck. (I used to own a couple of the Dodge D70F fronts and was going to put one under my Longhorn) To me that would be the only reason to keep it original. Someday I'll build a Napco clone Longhorn crew cab and it'll have an Eaton front axle just because I want one. It might be on air ride, or coils, or who knows but it will be built to use. You aren't going to use a truck as a working rig or hauler if it has no OD and 4.88s. GM didn't sell many of them or have many of them built because the orders weren't there. The people in the industry already had a clue on which trucks suited their needs. You can't go on many old farms around these parts and not find an old binder truck. I've seen several old 60s-70s 4x4 1 ton on up trucks mainly being IH's. I've yet to find a Chevy or GMC converted truck in the wild. I look constantly and have several others around looking as well.

If the truck was nicer I bet Joesjunk would already have it. Then it would stay preserved.

Rob was nice enough to offer it to me before he posted it here. It sure is a cool find