NV4500 swap is underway

[GCncsuHD]

Subscribed...Hope to be doing this in the near future for my 78.

[jbclassix]

Subscribing!

Thought you would like this picture of my "homemade" tranny jack.



Isn't it nice to have a garrage here in CO!

[snj8198]

sell those and make big bux!

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by jbclassix

Subscribing!

Thought you would like this picture of my "homemade" tranny jack.

Isn't it nice to have a garrage here in CO!

Hey, if it works and everybody lived to tell about then it did its job. That is how my 465 got installed 12 years ago.

I like what you got on that jack!

[Critter]

Looks like a great swap! I think you have it under control. If you don't mind answering a question, what is the difference in distance between the sm465 and nv4500 as far as the front of the bell housing to the shifter location? In other words, if you left the engine in the same location how much further back would the shifter be?

[Dieselwrencher]

Nice swap! On the early AA adapter you were talking about, that cup adapter looks like a dodge specific part, not a chevy part. That could be for some odd ball deal AA did to try to cut costs or just didn't have the capability to have a new tail housing cast. The automatic dodges in 1991-1993 used that so I'm guessing so did the earlier ones.

[DirtyLarry]

That could be Ryan. I was worried sick when I saw that picture hoping like hell this kit didn’t turn out like that.

About all we got done this weekend was getting the AA kit installed on the trans and tcase. The scariest part was cutting the tailshaft on the NV4500! My buddy is always ready for destruction so I let him do while I installed the clutch, pressure plate and bell housing. My other buddy is the smgr at the local Chevy store where we borrowed the NV4500 tail shaft socket. His 300 lbs of body weight help keep the trans still while Bill lopped off the section of tailshaft.







I hate the AA shift handle. Probably will end up ordering an OEM shifter.


The NP205 shift handle appears to remain in pretty much the same location as with the 465.



The trans won’t actually get installed for while we tackle the rust and start getting things ready for the hydraulic clutch and hydrobooster.

Does anybody have any good pictures of where the clutch master cylinder mounts on a square body style firewall?

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by Critter

If you don't mind answering a question, what is the difference in distance between the sm465 and nv4500 as far as the front of the bell housing to the shifter location? In other words, if you left the engine in the same location how much further back would the shifter be?

Thanks!

The depth is the same on both the stock bell housing and the AA bell housing. From measuring from the front of the transmission case to center of the shifter on the NP465 is 6” and 9.5” on the NV4500. So, it looks like the shifter hole to be bored into the automatic turtle shell will be reward 3.5”

This kinda give you an idea. The front of the two trans are equal albeit the 465 is tiled back a tag on the jack.

[Critter]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

Thanks!

The depth is the same on both the stock bell housing and the AA bell housing. From measuring from the front of the transmission case to center of the shifter on the NP465 is 6” and 9.5” on the NV4500. So, it looks like the shifter hole to be bored into the automatic turtle shell will be reward 3.5”

Thanks, I really appreciate it! I am working towards a 6.0/nv4500/205 swap as we speak, but my blazer was originally an auto. I'm still in the parts gathering mode. Curious where the shifter would stick through the floor and this give me an pretty good idea. I have the stock 2001 LS style bellhousing that came with the nv4500 but I'm pretty sure it is the same length as your original sm465 bell. I will be watching your swap like a hawk. Once again, THANKS.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by Critter

Thanks, I really appreciate it! I am working towards a 6.0/nv4500/205 swap as we speak, but my blazer was originally an auto. I'm still in the parts gathering mode. Curious where the shifter would stick through the floor and this give me an pretty good idea. I have the stock 2001 LS style bellhousing that came with the nv4500 but I'm pretty sure it is the same length as your original sm465 bell. I will be watching your swap like a hawk. Once again, THANKS.

That will make a sweet combo for a Blazer!

Yeah, they should all be the same length although the later style manual transmissions that use the internal slave/release bearing may be a tad longer. I do have a stock NV4500 bell housing for the internal slave/release bearing, like you are talking about, from a 2003 GM P-chassis lying around that I can compare to the 465 bell if you like. The AA bell is already on the engine though.

[Critter]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

I do have a stock NV4500 bell housing for the internal slave/release bearing, like you are talking about, from a 2003 GM P-chassis lying around that I can compare to the 465 bell if you like.

Sure, if you don't mind. I will never turn down good info!

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by Critter

Sure, if you don't mind. I will never turn down good info!

Critter,

Here is a picture of the Vortec style NV4500 bellhousing. Notice it does not have a pivot ball for the clutch fork, as it is designed to use the unitized slave and release bearing assembly. This picture is rather confusing being I have a GM bell on an older Dodge version of the NV4500 which is why the trans has a release bearing collar on the front retainer. GM’s with the unitized assembly do not have the collars.

I forgot this trans was buried under a bench in the garage where it is hard to pull out or I would have pulled the bell off for a side by side comparo with the 465. None the less, it measures the same depth as the 465 bell at around 6.25”





This is what the later model unitized release bearing/slave assembly looks like. I personally do not like these as they are known to cause issues when the truck is real warm plus they are habitual about leaking and ruining the clutch disk friction material.

[Critter]

Yeah here is mine with the factory unitized release bearing. I love the idea of them but have heard the bad stories as well. Between my dad, brother and myself we have owned 4 trucks with these and NV4500s. All had over 200,000 hard miles when we got rid of them. All had clutch work done at around 150,000 miles due to a life of towing, but the slave was still in decent shape everytime...but they got changed anyway. I plan to use one on this swap however I'm not sure if I will get a GM replacement or aftermarket. Anyway I appreciate the discussion, now get back to work on your swap!

[snj8198]

Hey Larry,

The shifter and boot assembly in Critter's pics are the same you and i were talking about. Is that what you had in mind?

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by snj8198

Hey Larry,

The shifter and boot assembly in Critter's pics are the same you and i were talking about. Is that what you had in mind?

Yes, sir that is what I want. Let's make a deal!

[Critter]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

I found a driveline mounted park brake that bolts onto the back of a NP205 but it is big money.

Have you looked here?

I talked to them a few months ago. IIRC a disc for the 205 flange, this caliper, and a couple pieces of hardware were around $250. They said they didn't have a specific bracket to put it to a 205 but the particular salesman I spoke with said he personally put one on his lifted ford bronco with an np205. Just a couple pieces of strategically placed square tubing and angle iron for a bracket and it worked great.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by Critter

Have you looked here?

I talked to them a few months ago. IIRC a disc for the 205 flange, this caliper, and a couple pieces of hardware were around $250. They said they didn't have a specific bracket to put it to a 205 but the particular salesman I spoke with said he personally put one on his lifted ford bronco with an np205. Just a couple pieces of strategically placed square tubing and angle iron for a bracket and it worked great.

No, didn’t look at those guys and can’t remember where I saw the kit that was like $700. Thanks for the link… I’ll keep them in mind.

Man, it sounds like you guys have gotten great service out of those unitized bearings. I used to handle a bakery customer based in Ft. Wayne, Indiana that a fleet of bread vans with NV4500’s. They ended up swapping all them over to the external slave like the earlier NV4500s had. In fact, that is where I got the bell housing. They were going to throw it away so I talked them out of it and dropped it off at the UPS store on my way to the airport.

[MTCK]

Awesome! Glad to see you're rolling on this project. The AA kit actually looks top notch (it had better be $$$). Have you thought about grabbing a 2000+ 14 bolt housing and keeping the stock style disc brakes with the internal drum parking brakes? While you're at it, you could rotate your pinion up and reweld the spring perches so you can run a CV rear drive shaft... Snowball effect? Can't wait to see the result!

[Musclerodz]

you will have to reinforce the aa tc handle bracket. it flexes and make it difficult if not impossible to shift the tc case with fresh seals

[MalibuSSwagon]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

Does anybody have any good pictures of where the clutch master cylinder mounts on a square body style firewall?

I'll see if I can take pics of my C-10's firewall tomorrow.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by MalibuSSwagon

I'll see if I can take pics of my C-10's firewall tomorrow.

That would be great! Thank you

[edge]

DirtyLarry
NV project is looking sweet!
I put a slave cylinder firewall shot in my K10 album. See if it helps.

[MalibuSSwagon]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

That would be great! Thank you

There you go! Dont mind the mess, the truck is all original and I haven't got around to cleaning up under the hood yet

[DirtyLarry]

I really appreciate the pictures! That will really help me determine the right spot.

Thanks again!

[DirtyLarry]

Thanks for the firewall pictures Edge and MalibuSSWagon!

Well, I haven’t gotten a whole lot done lately other than continuing to collect parts.

While searching for studs to use in the AA transfercase adapter we determined AA misdrilled the holes. I thought I was going crazy as there wasn’t a bolt in the world that would fit their threads. One quick call to them and they quickly sent me a replacement. As it turns out they had a few of these adapters that were machined wrong.


3/8 bore on the left and goofed up M10 something or another on the right.


Oh, I am in dire need of a hydraulic clutch pedal assembly! If anybody has one that needs a home please let me know. I am not having any luck finding pedals around here. Everything I find in the bone yard is an automatic.

The column and pedals are out. Poor interior looks like hell.