Towing with My burb

[BlueJeep]

Since you mentioned trying to find a Vortec for it I'll provide my recent experience. This past weekend I pulled my Jeep (4500 lbs) on my new trailer (2600 lbs) 300 miles behind my '03 Suburban Z71 with a 5.3 and 4L60 with 3.73 rear. I was very impressed with how the Suburban towed the trailer, and I was able to maintain my speed on ALL the hills. I averaged 11.1mpg, which I thought was acceptable. Overall I was very impressed with the 5.3's ability to handle towing duties.

Although this doesn't address your handling concerns since it's a completely different vehicle, it should address your questions as to what it will take to tow 7100 lbs. FYI, my '03 Suburban has rear coil springs and a 4 link suspension with track bar.

[RussTburb]

And there you go! Thanks Bluejeep! As mentioned earlier I am considering a used truck see thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=304525 I've talked to several people with the HD and the 'Max diesel and they are saying 12-13 mpg towning. If I can save $5-10k on a gas pick-up that gets 11mpg when towing maybe that route is an option! Man what a useful tool this web site is!

[Big Block]

Originally Posted by Longhorn Man

the gear should be a 3.54 in a dana rear axle if it is all original.
150K on the engine is quite a lot if it's never been rebuilt. The more I hear/read about these older big blocks, the less I am impressed with them.
I've personally never towed anything in a coil spring truck and thought it was doing a good job... more like what you describe. new bushings in the trailing arms and panhard bar would probably do wonders... poly instead of rubber since you are asking a lot out of it. (less 'squirm')
Take a good look at your rear tires too, and I recomend inflating them to max pressure.

I owner a 1972 3/4 ton sub a few years ago. It was all over the road. Replaced The trailing arm bushings and panhard bar made all the difference in the world. Mine hade a 4:56 dana rear end. It was 402/400 and it got 7-9 mpg at 70 mph. It would pull anything I couldn't stand the gas mileage.

[MrBeast]

Originally Posted by RussTburb

And there you go! Thanks Bluejeep! As mentioned earlier I am considering a used truck see thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=304525 I've talked to several people with the HD and the 'Max diesel and they are saying 12-13 mpg towning. If I can save $5-10k on a gas pick-up that gets 11mpg when towing maybe that route is an option! Man what a useful tool this web site is!

I have been thinking about this thread quite a bit I really think by thinking you need to just go and get another truck, you are pretty far off your mark. Your old suburban has the potential to be the best damn tow rig you have ever run. I really think that starting with suspension bushings, updated rear end gears, and a set of good brakes would do miles of difference for how the burb handles road trips.

I think it would be very worth your while before you spend the money on another truck to spend a few bucks get those items replaced, and see how god it does. Give it just a towing test when your by yourself, see how it handles on a small trip after replacing those things. I have faith that doing so will restore yours in the burb, and it will give you a totally new outlook on your truck.

It also wont cost anything near what that new truck would. If you could find a Vortec 6000, and a 4L80E that would be the perfect combination for your burb and towing needs, it would also give you similar mileage and you could get a runner out of a salvage yard. For instance, Spaldings in Spokane Washington has them the most expensive costing about 1800 for a motor with about 35000 miles on it, that is way cheaper than a new truck, now keep in mind you will have to get a tranny too, and the computer and wiring harness, as well as the accessory drive, but it will all be worth it in the end if you do.

Seriously think about it, when ever you run into trouble with that there are people on this board who could help you out. Actually if you seriously consider going for it, feel free to hit me up for information. - Nick

[RussTburb]

Well Nick, after a heart to heart with the wife, I really think your idea is a good one! I would love to get a new truck, I have it all picked out and everything. HOWEVER, I just don't see the money being there, not even in the spring. I am sitting here reviewing my post and my email from WES. Bushings for the arms and the pan hard bar are less then $61! How hard are the trailing arm bushing to do in the truck? I have a spare set of arms I could do them and then swap but that means new U-bolts. I gotta tell ya, the gas milage is the real downer, 7.5 while towing, running mid grade, with the small tank makes for frequent fuel stops. I will look into the vortec thing. I was thinking 5.3. lots of guys like em and get pretty good milage and tow 7k lbs with ease... just thinking.

[vectorit]

Well, you can do what my Dad did when I was kid during the days of pullin a trailer for the family in the 68 burb... There is plenty of room for another tank, between the current tank and the rear bumper! Just get another Suburban OEM tank, and mount it up. Just drill the holes for the straps, and set up a Y pipe for the fill tube. From there we had a manual fuel line switch under the driver seat, and a switch on the dash to show the fuel in the second tank. This may sound like sarcasm, but it was the solution to your problem back in the day for my family. But then gas was only a buck or so in those days...

[RussTburb]

I was leaning more towards finding the bigger tank, I think they came in 2 or 3 different sizes, 17-21 or super tanker. Ha, ha. jk. Someone feel free to corect me. I just know mine holds somewher between 17-18 gallons. (only cost $60 to fill! thats cool!) Used to be I could say "She'll pass every thing but a gas station!" but know she has a hard time "gettin' outta her own way!"

[MrBeast]

Changing out the bushings is a pretty straight forward job, you may need a press or a good vise to do it though. It is well worth the upgrade though. I am not terribly familiar with the 2WD setup as far as rebuilding them goes because all of my trucks have been leaf springers with the exception of 2 of em. one didn't need it, and the other I had done by a shop because I was in the navy at the time and didn't have a place to do it.

I would cut the U bolts and replace em anyhow. I always do, I dont even mess with 40 year old U bolts, not worth the hassle, a 4" cut off wheel on a grinder will whack through em like butter. They really aren't that expensive, and the cost will by far be worth the hassle you will save, trust me.

I also know that many have had luck with the Vortec 5300 in thier trucks and burbs, but they are also out in the flat land. Trust me on this, you will be very glad you went for the Vortec 6000 or even 8100 if you do. The reason is you have lots of hills out your way, and lots of up and down, in situations like that a 5300 will get WORSE mileage because it will have to work way harder to get the same job done.

I used to live in Oak Harbor on Whidbey Island. I wound up traveling east with a buddy of mine who was changing duty stations at the same time I was getting out, I had the Vortec 454 in my truck, he had the 5300 in his, we were both running X cab short beds, mine was a 3/4 ton with 33/10.50 BFG Mud terrains on it, his was a half ton with stock rubber.

I was pulling a 1972 Olds Cutlass Supreme on a 16' car trailer, he had a toneau cover on his bed with no load. He was hard pressed to keep up with me at 85MPH, I got 12.5 MPG, he got 16. I love that Vortec 454.

Speaking of which, should you decide to get one and stuff it in your burb, it will bolt in place of your current engine with no modifications to the mounts. It is plug and play. As well should you go with a 4L80E automatic, the computer for the 454 will run it, and all you will have to do is move your tranny mount back slightly and have your drive shaft shortened, much less work than installing a 5.3 or 6000 series vortec, everything on them will be different for mounting. So for you in the long run this conversion would actually be by far CHEAPER than doing the newer motor swap.

The other argument I make for the 454 is that engine is the pinnacle of what GM was able to produce for a big block, it was the last before the new design took place.

[RussTburb]

Thanks for the info Nick. I think I will replace the bushings in the spare arms and then replace them in the truck with new u-bolts. You know what size or how to find a part # for the U-bolts? I'd like to have it all on hand before I start you know?

What did you do in the USN? work with A6's or EA6B's? I was in from 91-95 and was stationed on the Ranger CV61 and the IKE CVN69. A blue shirt on the Ranger, Yellow (flight deck) on the IKE. I really loved the Ranger, not so much the IKE. What I did was cool just the captain was an A-hole. Any way thanks again,
Dennis

[MrBeast]

Originally Posted by RussTburb

Thanks for the info Nick. I think I will replace the bushings in the spare arms and then replace them in the truck with new u-bolts. You know what size or how to find a part # for the U-bolts? I'd like to have it all on hand before I start you know?

What did you do in the USN? work with A6's or EA6B's? I was in from 91-95 and was stationed on the Ranger CV61 and the IKE CVN69. A blue shirt on the Ranger, Yellow (flight deck) on the IKE. I really loved the Ranger, not so much the IKE. What I did was cool just the captain was an A-hole. Any way thanks again,
Dennis

I was an AT3, also NAC, worked on P3's and EA-6B's as well while I was at VAQ-129.

[RussTburb]

Just hung up from talking with WES at Classic Heartbeat. Parts are ordered. Should be here by the end of the week! U-bolts, Rear control arm bushings (trailing arm) and Pan Hard bar bushings! around $100. I'm going to replace them this weekend and see how it tows after that. Pobably still gonna put shocks and springs on it but I wanted to see how big of a difference just the bushing made. I crawled under the burb the other day and both trailing arm bushings were splt! I'm hoping it makes a HUGE difference! I'll try and take some pics of the process and that will probably start the ever so slow "ROLLING RESTO" build thread. I am gonna bring home the old green parts burb that has been in "STORAGE" for the last what? 4 or 5 years. "STORAGE"=sitting outside, behind some guys barn. Thanks fo all the help and STAY TUNED!
Dennis.

[low'n slow]

Good luck with it. I replaced the panhard bushings in my 63 Riviera and it made all the difference in the world.

[MrBeast]

Dennis, glad to see it happening, Also Wes at Classic Heartbeat seems like a pretty stand up guy, and the nice thing is he is local to you. Good luck, I will be watching your progress.

[jorgensensc]

Save yourself the aggrevation and just burn the old bushings out. It is a whole lot easier. The trailing arms will interchange, but the 3/4 ton traling arms actually have braces welded on to the bottom of the trailing arms. If it was me I would pull the originals off (if they are in good shape) torch out the old bushings, slap some paint on them, put new bushings and ubolts in, and take her for a spin. Be sure and put the panhard bar back on. If you don't it could twist a trailing arm. Good luck.
Shawn

[RussTburb]

Ya, I crawled under the ol girl today and compared the 1/2 ton arms with the 3/4 ton. I am thinking of the same plan. I did order new pan hard bar bushings too so I am going to do them at the same time. I know that it would be alot easier to do shocks and springs then too, but I really want to feal the difference the bushings make. I'm thinking its probably a 2 day job. I will pull the arms, bar out on Friday and install the bushings Saturday. I have soccer and birthday parties to take the kids to but I still think I can get em done.

[RussTburb]

Parts are HERE! Thanks for the Great service WES. Gotta tiddy up the garage/driveway for this project!

NICK aka BEAST, Pay attention son, here is where the fun starts!jk. I might be shooting you a PM the bushings are Polly and I will Hopefully be adding grease zerts. Thanks again
Dennis

[MrBeast]

Originally Posted by RussTburb

Parts are HERE! Thanks for the Great service WES. Gotta tiddy up the garage/driveway for this project!

NICK aka BEAST, Pay attention son, here is where the fun starts!jk. I might be shooting you a PM the bushings are Polly and I will Hopefully be adding grease zerts. Thanks again
Dennis

Dennis, I am on this site way too much, trust me, I will be paying attention.

[RussTburb]

UH OH! Stated the job today (Monday) and I've hit a stumbling block. WES and I were very clear on 3/4 ton Dana, and yet the bushings for the panhard bar are too small. I have a bar from a half ton and they look like the right bushings for that. Did GM make a larger panhard bar for 3/4 tons or is the one I have homeade? (It kinda looks like it is or at least maybe aftermarket. just from the welds and such.) I'm calling wes so hopefully I'll be on track soon! I thought about installing the 1/2 ton bar as it WILL fit but is kinda scrawny looking.