Fake SPID

[BigRed76]

I'm pretty sure 72's have 13 digit VIN's correct?

[SCHRUMGMC]

I thought it was 13, an now and days its like 18 I believe

[jocko]

Originally Posted by BigRed76

I'm pretty sure 72's have 13 digit VIN's correct?

correct, 72 was the first year for the leading C or T to differentiate between chev and gmc.

[SS Tim]

Originally Posted by BigRed76

I'm pretty sure 72's have 13 digit VIN's correct?

Well yes the 72 VINs went to a thirteen digit format. It was simply implemented by adding to the front of the 71 VIN a "C" for Chevrolet or "T" for a GMC.

However the truck in question is a 71 by the VIN presented though incorrect. Please refer to my pictures posted back at #17. There I show the bad spid, its misalignment and an original 71 Baltimore SPID (with a redacted six digit serial number) for direct comparison. Of font and format.

If you have more questions on decoding check out the link in my signature.

[BigRed76]

Originally Posted by SS Tim

Well yes the 72 VINs went to a thirteen digit format. It was simply implemented by adding to the front of the 71 VIN a "C" for Chevrolet or "T" for a GMC.

However the truck in question is a 71 by the VIN presented though incorrect. Please refer to my pictures posted back at #17. There I show the bad spid, its misalignment and an original 71 Baltimore SPID (with a redacted six digit serial number) for direct comparison. Of font and format.

If you have more questions on decoding check out the link in my signature.

Oh I understood what you meant, it just made me remember about the 72 VINs being different

[67c10rustbuket]

Originally Posted by leddzepp

It's a beautiful truck. He would have been better off with no SPID at all.
Posted via Mobile Device

Exactly! I wonder if the title has "CIE" ???

I dont see anything wrong with shortening a truck but trying to pass it off as original is not cool. Anyway it is a very nice truck, if it were mine the first thing I would do is peel that thing off!

[buckskins4ever]

Theres no fraud here. Just need to read the add-on he or the builder put on the remade build sheet. Several things are definitely late model codes......especially the LS9 code for the V8 and the F51 ABS Brakes. He has just attempted to give the potential buyer a somewhat looking SPID.(poorly done though) When blasting mine I removed the SPID, since there is not one thing that is factory any longer. I am going to make up a decal with all build details on it and stick inside glovebox as well. Buyers should want to at least know what has been added or altered.

[SS Tim]

Originally Posted by buckskins4ever

Theres no fraud here. Just need to read the add-on he or the builder put on the remade build sheet. Several things are definitely late model codes......especially the LS9 code for the V8 and the F51 ABS Brakes. He has just attempted to give the potential buyer a somewhat looking SPID.(poorly done though) When blasting mine I removed the SPID, since there is not one thing that is factory any longer. I am going to make up a decal with all build details on it and stick inside glovebox as well. Buyers should want to at least know what has been added or altered.

As I stated above "But then fraud is not a laughing matter."
However it is a laughably poor attempt and very transparent in this case.

In truth fraud is very very gray area. But for a seller who knowingly misrepresents material facts (original build) to his benefit (higher sales price in this case) by altering a SPID (accepted reference) without disclosing its alteration is commiting fraud at some level as the buyer is injured through a true lessor value.

Now on the codes you say are late/incorrect. RPO LS9 is the era correct code for a 350 V-8. F51 is also era correct for HD "FT & RR SHOCK ABSORB"ers.

Personally I would recommend anyone rebuilding a truck to a configuration other than stock but appearing stock should consider using a replacement door with a new sticker if desired. That way you have some proof at sales time or when a divorce atty. trys to overvalue your truck in a settlement.

[yuccales]

Originally Posted by SS Tim

or when a divorce atty. trys to overvalue your truck in a settlement.

Very good thinking!

[Daddy'O]

I started this post to validate my thinking the SPID was false for my own peace of mind, and as a reminder for potential buyers of these trucks to be aware of “potential” deception. I say potential because I have no way of knowing if the seller of this particular truck is actually attempting a fraudulent sale for personal gain.

The seller of this truck advertises it as a short bed (obviously it is) but has not advertised it as being an “original” short bed. Cool, I have no problems with that. My only concern is the fact the seller boasts about the SPID and the SPID is what raises the red flag(s).

We as buyers need to be smarter than the seller. This is especially important for a buyer looking for an original or fully restored original truck. A buyer should as previously stated “use due diligence” in determining the facts of the truck before spending their hard earned cash. Unfortunately we cannot always trust what a seller says to be fact. Only documentation like build sheets, Protecto plates, original invoices, etc can give a buyer extra confidence in a seller. But not too many sellers have these documents.

Bottom line – be an educated/informed buyer. No one likes to get taken – makes them feel foolish after the fact. And the money spent only compounds the emotion.

Please don’t ask me how I know but suffice it to say – “I have experienced these feelings”.

Thanks to all for your inputs and replies.

[SS Tim]

Well said Wayne!
Too often these trucks are an emotional purchase that later turns out to be a pig with lipstick and all too often it seems professionally applied.
So to all that made it this far, do your research as best you can, bring an extra set of eyes when looking at a truck, get the facts and look at the documentation before money changes hands. But the most important thing is to enjoy yourself. We are here for fun and education.

[Daddy'O]

Turtles?

Come on guys. Please stick to positve, informative, and constructive inputs and replies.

Thanks!

[Wasted Income]

Oh, I thought that's what we were doing here is posting random thoughts that pop into our heads.

That SPID is a nice try, but no cigar. Like it's been said, the font is off, and the background is WAY too white and clean for a truck that old.

I too am curious what the frame looks like. Sketchy to "update" the SPID after a frame swap or chop.

[leddzepp]

Originally Posted by Daddy'O

Come on guys. Please stick to positve, informative, and constructive inputs and replies.

Thanks!

I agree. Several members need to review the rule below:


IV. Pure trolling, either to upset someone or simply for your personal
enjoyment, is strictly prohibited. If you're here to cause trouble, it will be a very short stay.

The personal attacks need to stop, or this informative thread will be locked.

[Daddy'O]

Here is a photo of the VIN plate. The photo was hard to obtain due to the lighting and my poor old camera so the details of the rivets is lacking. Tim let me know if you need a better shot of the rivets.

I could not find the VIN on the frame due to heavy paint. I found no evidence of a cut frame so I will assume a frame swap. The owner was no where to be found yesterday so hopefully I can run into him today or tomorrow and ask some non-threatening questions.

This truck is nothing more than a re-paint. No attention was given to the under side of the truck - even the shocks looked 20 years old.

[SS Tim]

Wow, More questions than answers.
Gotta love the two-tone extending to the weatherstrip. The buildup and lines around the plate would suggest a lot of paint has been sprayed there.
That plate looks really nice, almost new and the rivets seem really dark compatively. Without good pictures that is about that.
The VIN number is at least what would be expected. It decodes as Chevy 1/2 ton pickup 1972 Baltimore assembled.

But the "as built" and "maximun GVW" on the plate are numbers for a middle weight C20 with aux springs....

[Joesjunk]

I looked at that truck yesterday, I tried to see if the frame was cut, but couldnt really tell. There was definitely no detail on the underside

[Daddy'O]

No luck talking to the owner today.

Tim - the rivets were black and looked new. Interesting about the GVW being for a C20.

The truck goes across the block Saturday afternoon. I am really anxious to see what it brings.

Here are a couple of photos - sorry they are so poor but where they have the truck staged it is really difficult to get a good photo.

[Already Gone]

subscribed

[SCHRUMGMC]

Beautiful Orange Truck

[FRENCHBLUE72]

Thats a shame she looks like a nice truck.... Hey tim where would the two tone stripe end? Id guess at the outter cab spotweld area but I have never owned a 2 tone truck before?

[SS Tim]

Originally Posted by FRENCHBLUE72

...Hey tim where would the two tone stripe end? Id guess at the outter cab spotweld area...

typical...

[leddzepp]

Looks like it sold for $24K.

[SS Tim]

Originally Posted by leddzepp

Looks like it sold for $24K.

That is not even remotely funny. Somebody is getting royally fastened. Wonder how many of these actually close and how many are withdrawn post-auction to prevent legal action by burned buyers.

[FRENCHBLUE72]

That's about where I was thinkin
Posted via Mobile Device