values of 67-72's deja vu

[Grumpy old man]

Comparing a Ferrari or a gull wing Mercedes to a Chevy c10 as a collectible investment is just funny . when I mentioned buy and holding these old trucks as an investment I surely didn't mean you would be retiring when you sold them rather maybe taking a beach weekend vacation from the proceeds not moving to the beach ! you'll surely do better than many have done with buying gold or silver .The same goes for buying 70's model enduro motorcycles which have seen a surge in value lately just like many old trucks they are worth more in pieces than as a rolling project . I would rather see someone buy up dozens of them than see 1 more get crushed for scrap ! Right now 80's and early 90's model running driving trucks are cheap 10 years from now who knows ?

[fisherman56]

What I really mean to say when I started this thread is that 1st and formost do it cuz you love the trucks. I am partial to the 1967 cuz I had a "67 Camaro when I was a kid, I like the clean lines before the marker lights came into the picture. 2nd either buy rollers and sit on them or when you build kinda keep a lid on expenses. I jumped into a thread the other day about bed rails selling for $500+on Ebay. That's what I mean heck that's almost half of what a Jegs 260hp 350 costs!. I am not about to tell anyone where and how and how much they want to put into their truck I am just saying costs can be kept down and expenses kept in control.

[magwakeenercew2jh]

Originally Posted by Steve Hafner

. . . .
For some, the real value in these trucks is the time spent working on them. There's nothing better then spending a warm Saturday afternoon working on the truck with your children or grandchildren. Those memories can't be replaced...... My two ( ages 12 and 13 ) might not realize this now, but I think they will when they're older.

Steve,

Speaking as an old guy (67) whose father did almost *nothing* with me (not whinin'; just sayin'), they definitely realize it right now...
....and will carry it on forever. Guys like you are in my Book of Heros.

As for me, I tried to break this chain with my three girls....And not just in mechanical-oriented stuff. Not to be sexist, but they are all
grown giirly-girls with strong back bones and a sense of what it's like to do "dude-stuff". Now, they've delivered us seven grandkids.
And, with those guys, I'm trying to carry on that formula as much as I can.

Here's Will a few years ago after *really* helping with the install of RAT's electric windows:

[54belair]

Man, Im glad there are some other "Old" guys here that think the same as I do. I whine on a daily basis about being over spent on my truck project----but really, its all a labor of love for me (I sure wouldnt spend this much time and try to make money on it), the time spent is fun for me----and I feel like Im teaching my grandson something about cars.

[magwakeenercew2jh]

Originally Posted by 54belair

Man, Im glad there are some other "Old" guys here that think the same as I do. I whine on a daily basis about being over spent on my truck project----but really, its all a labor of love for me (I sure wouldnt spend this much time and try to make money on it), the time spent is fun for me----and I feel like Im teaching my grandson something about cars.

Hahaha! "Birds of a Feather."

Twenty three grand (and counting) in a ten thousand dollar driver. I should change my sig line.



We'd have to be pretty stupid to be in this hobby if it were about the end-cash-value of these beasts.

[jabborabbo]

Originally Posted by magwakeenercew2jh

Steve,

Speaking as an old guy (67) whose father did almost *nothing* with me (not whinin'; just sayin'), they definitely realize it right now...
....and will carry it on forever. Guys like you are in my Book of Heros.

As for me, I tried to break this chain with my three girls....And not just in mechanical-oriented stuff. Not to be sexist, but they are all
grown giirly-girls with strong back bones and a sense of what it's like to do "dude-stuff". Now, they've delivered us seven grandkids.
And, with those guys, I'm trying to carry on that formula as much as I can.

Here's Will a few years ago after *really* helping with the install of RAT's electric windows:

You're in that Book of Heros also! Regarding my earlier post, it should be modified thusly:

“you can’t take your stock portfolio out for a nice weekend cruise, nor spend anything remotely close to the kind of quality time you can spend with your kids or grandkids working on or driving a classic vehicle.”

Of course, there are kids and grandkids that would rather inherit a stock portfolio than a classic vehicle, but that's a different discussion....

[IHeartGroceries]

Value is a non-factor for me.

I will simply never part with it!

[Rod Run]

Originally Posted by Grumpy old man

I think what is happening is that many guys have to pass on building that dream muscle car just for the cost of the entire project and are finding it's way easier to talk their wives into letting them buy an old cheap truck to "use " around the house than build a $30,000.00 Camaro that will sit in the garage until that Sunday drive/trailer ride to the show . They are cheap to buy and parts are easier to find "now" and you can still haul flowers home for your girls garden on Saturday ! Your just not going to see a lot of patina Camaros driving around , trucks ARE THE NEW CRUISERS and recent prices for detailed finished trucks show it as true . Now even tho the drive trains are just as involved as any muscle car the trucks are Just cooler to drive today !

I am one of those "Camaro guys" (I have a '69 big-block) and I bought it back in 1990. I picked it up in pretty damn good shape, with a small block, for about $4k. If I was going to try and buy it in that same condition today, it would be $20k. Right now I probably drive it under 2,000 miles a year, mostly to shows. It's not that I try to keep the miles off of it, but it's just hard to put to many miles on any one car when you own 4 of them.

I bought my current step-side about 2 months ago, as a project driver. I drove by it a few times and just bought it on an impulse buy (same as I did with the Camaro & most of my toys). I paid $3k as it sits right now and I know I could easily get $4k for it anyway. This is going to be a budget build and it won't be shiny, because I don't want to worry about parking it anywhere (as I do with my Camaro and GTO).

As far as investments go..... I never buy or build a car hoping for a return on my investment. I build them because I like them and assume that I'll always lose AT LEAST half of my money if I sell.

As Jay Leno always says: "If you build a car to make money on it, you're doing it wrong"

[Grumpy old man]

I've been building cars/trucks for many years and I will attest to the fact the only person who makes real money on a project is the guy building it providing the labor at $100.00 an hour and 20% markup on parts !

[fisherman56]

I still think you can make some money on these trucks. You are right to buy them cause you love them and love to drive them. But still any profit you make (IF YOU EVER SELL IN THE FUTURE AND SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO) has got be from wise buying, or buying wisely. I got my '67 from trading a 94 F250 for it. I am going to look at a couple of bucket seats today for $30 no rips or tears, sure they might not be buddy buckets, but I am not putting $1,000 into them either. Once again that's almost enough for a Jegs engine. Every one want's a nice truck, but control in what you spend or put into it is where the difference is.

[67ChevyRedneck]

Selling for a profit and investing are two different things. It's entirely possible to sell these trucks for a profit, lots of people do it (lots of people lose their ass too) but in terms of an investment, that 10-20K you put into the purchase or rebuild of the truck today would net you a significant amount of money if invested today and removed in 30 years. Assuming you spend no money on keeping the truck nice and running for 30 years ( ) it's value might keep up with inflation. Vehicles are a bad "investment", period.

[Grumpy old man]

Buy low sell high it's done every day , But you have to know what to buy and where to sell and never fall in love with anything ! Every material item has a price attached to it the trick is knowing ready cash on the street today value not some blue book price or suggested retail , right now i'm looking for and buying failed projects many at rock bottom prices from distressed owners and in this economy there are tons of distressed project owners willing to part with their pride and joy at this time of the year , You know when the first thing someones says is "well the blue book value is " Thats where you have to stop them and remind them Kelly blue book doesn't buy cars and their not standing there with cash ! I have paid too much for a couple of cars but the owners family needed as much as they could get and it was easy to see .

[fisherman56]

Back to the beginning of this thread. I basically stated that the values are rising on these, and pretty soon it will be too hard for the average person to get into these 67-72's and have any hope of enjoying them or making any money because history repeats itself. I still stand by that and say buy all you can or want to. (trucks and parts) Then you have the option to build when you want and also to have an easier budget to work with. And if bad times befall you and you have to sell or just want to sell may you make some money.

[fisherman56]

Grumpy, You got the right attitude! Never fall in love with anything! It sure makes it easier to sell! I never buy anything without thinking to my self can I re sell this down the road if I have to or want to? (meanwhile having fun with it along the way!) Last year I was into buying-selling wheelhorse tractors. I had 10 at one time! Yes buying a distressed truck-project, is one of the ways, to get a good deal.

[67ChevyRedneck]

Originally Posted by fisherman56

Hey all is it me, but are we on the cutting edge of investment here?

You're very first sentence

The biggest hindrance for Mustang Coupe values is production numbers. Well over 1 million were produced the first couple years. First gen Camaros? Just a few hundred thousand. Even though they're extremely popular, first gen mustang coupes are still very affordable. You can still pick up a non running project car on craigslist for under a grand.

If you include GMC (production numbers were lost in a fire) Chevrolet produced over 2.5 MILLION of these trucks, assume a 1:6 ratio for GMC's and that's almost 3 million. I don't think you'll see a big jump in price anytime too.

[fisherman56]

Yep, that was my first sentence! but it wasn't the only sentence! lol

[Grumpy old man]

you will definetly see a price increase in these trucks along with any muscle car of real interest because the next generation of buyers have no hands on skills (yes i know there are still some kids learning to work with their hands) but as a general rule 90% couldn't turn a screw driver let alone build anything to speak of and the desire for old metal will never cease when everything of late has been made of plastic ! I don't care if you have a brand new camaro whats it going to be worth in 30 years ? 0.00 !

[fisherman56]

Well 1st of all how many of those 3 million are left? If production numbers are the key factor of value, then the 8ft c20 stepper would be worth a small fortune. I used to have a extremely rare Harley Davidson of which there were believed to be only 3 or 4 left in the whole world with the original equipment left on them, even the Harley Davidson museum did not have one in it. It was not extremely valuable. Values in the case of these trucks are not due to high or low production numbers, but that they are cool and beautifull. And the '67 in my opinion is the "key" of the 67 -72 years. My 2cents worth.

[Grumpy old man]

Well... their all cool but I chose the '67 myself . I've always wanted a 72 k20 with the two tone blue and white , my dad had one new in 72 and it was just a really good truck , he sold it and bought a 74 witch rusted out fast then he bought a c30 79 with a 454 and that thing cornered like it was on rails , I like them all but my daily driver is a 95 GMC Z 71 extended cab and I kept it because I think its one of the best body styles recently . My dad now 92 still has the '68 k10 we have used for deer season in Maine since it was new granted it sits in the barn but it has survived all these years with no major repairs or rust .

[magwakeenercew2jh]

Originally Posted by fisherman56

Grumpy, You got the right attitude! Never fall in love with anything! It sure makes it easier to sell! I never buy anything without thinking to my self can I re sell this down the road if I have to or want to? (meanwhile having fun with it along the way!) Last year I was into buying-selling wheelhorse tractors. I had 10 at one time! Yes buying a distressed truck-project, is one of the ways, to get a good deal.

The cool thing is, we all get to be different and still be friends!

I *like* to fall in love with whatever I'm building.
Then again, my approach has always been buy high and sell low.

For me, REAL love is lavished on REAL people. But I have a passion for these damned things......
Playing with them keeps me happy (and mad); balanced (and coo-coo); broke (and rich..but not in $$$).

[fisherman56]

Buy high and sell low LMAO! It is a passion, and it's hard not to add an addition to the addiction! I hope all you married guys don't have too much trouble with the wifey! Me, I am single so my money is mine and buying toys isn't a problem with me, as long as I leave myself some money to buy food, LOL!

[davepl]

And every time someone lowers another one or shortens another frame or cuts the dash for a radio, mine goes up in value just a tiny bit...

[fisherman56]

You are so right about that! I am somewhat a purist sort of, I am not into the the slamed and bagged trucks. A lot of folks, are especially the younger ones. But if they didn't slam and bag I think a lot of intrest and hence values would go down.

[factorystock]

Originally Posted by Grumpy old man

right now i'm looking for and buying failed projects many at rock bottom prices from distressed owners and in this economy there are tons of distressed project owners willing to part with their pride and joy at this time of the year .

Your right!.http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/cto/4241297906.html

[davepl]

As long as it's not a rare unit (402 SWB, etc) then I have no objection to the kids cutting them up... they made millions of them (literally).