Is 5.3 swap to much money and work?

[65blackfleetside]

As you can see from all the posts there are be pro's and cons for the old tech vs new 5.3-350 argument. Some guys love the old V-8 systems for their simplicity and retro feel.

When I came over from the dark blue side (Fo*D) to chevorlet 10 years ago I was really sold on the 350 being the greatest American V-8 ever made, especially for the money, power, and reliability that it produced. Chevy 350 parts are sold new and used Everywhere! I loved the 350 /700R4 set up in my 65 C10. Problem was I was getting about 12MPG around town. I was putting gas in it every other day.

At the time I also had a late model 1500 Silverado 5.3 that was 1500 pounds heavier that the C10. I drove 50% of the work week in the 5.3 silverado and was amazed at the fuel usage difference as well as the power that this LS motor produced bone stock!

So much so that i am sold on the LS technology- I never thought GM could build a better motor than the 350, I was wrong.

I know many on here will strongly disagree with me but if you are building a daily driver go with the LS, keep the fuel injection on it as the was the GM engineers designed it to run. 4.8,5.3 6.0 any of those motors will produce more than enough power for a daily driver while getting much better MPG and reliability over the older motors.

I still love the old big blocks and small blocks that the big three build for 50 years but for me it got old real fast paying at the pump.

My current build is a 1951 Chevy with LS 5.3 and 4L60E- Its almost ready for the road.
The bigger costs for an LS will be: your accessory brackets ($600) external fuel pump with plumbing ($350) and wiring harness and ECM reprogram for engine ($600)

you can save some money using factory Accessory brackets but i did not have enough room to go this route. check out ICT billet IF you need brackets? they had some of the best prices at the time i purchased them.

I also purchased a new harness (BP harness) rather than have someone rework the old one $300 vs $600. Had a great experience with those guys too.

It ends up being one of those " well if I do this .. I might as well spend the $ and do this too thing ...Lol be careful going down that trail it can get very $$$

Like anything else there is a learning curve with the new LS technology- thats why a lot of guys are scared of it, But you can figure it out with all of the help on these forums-

Good luck with whatever route you decide!!

[palallin]

Don't get me wrong: the 5.3 is a nice enough motor, but I don't notice that much difference in the mileage, and my 327 is about as reliable as an engine made by Man can get. My truck's drivetrain is engineered a unit, and replacing all of it would be far too expensive and involved even if I wanted to.

Yes, I know the 5.3 is a "327," but it ain't no 327! It hasn't the history, the reputation, or the dead-simple reliability.

[KQQL IT]

Originally Posted by rjs53

I'm at the same point. I have a SBC, solid roller cam AFR210 heads and vic jr intake. With a 715 lift on the cam its not a street friendly motor, but just to change cam and go hydraulic roller lifter and different intake I can almost buy a junk yard 5.3 or 6.0 with 4 speed trans and drive it for a while.

Comp cams
12-433-8 H-R in my 400 and is a ton of fun and totally street able

[57taskforce]

I have big blocks small blocks and some ls stuff. The old stuff is cool and is really easy to work on yes. However as far as longevity and higher performance are concerned, the ls eats the old school stuff for lunch. A cam swap alone turns the ls motors into animals. There’s lots of people running 1000+ hp on mostly stock junkyard engines on forced induction. The hotrod article where they took the 5.3 that ended up being a 4.8 and put twins on it to the tune 1200 hp is an amazing read. In stock form I’ve seen them run past 300,000 when taken care of. If you want to do the swap as said before the best way to do it in my opinion is with a full donor truck or suv. I love the look of an old school small or big block in these trucks and they do perform quite well, they have for the last 60 years! I’ve had several of the old motors and I love them just as much as the ls but for different reasons. Op. It’s really up to you what you want to do, what you want to get out of your truck. If you want to get in and drive it and never have to tune it up except the occasional plugs, filters, belts and oil changes (not to mention cold weather start up) than the ls stuff is for you. If you don’t mind picking up a wrench to keep the old stuff in tip top shape and want to save a few dollars than a 350 is for you.

[BCOWANWHEELS]

Cost, computer, lost vehicle value, complexaty, plus those engines are throw-a-way non rebuildable.............. Stay with stock imo. Far better..............

[57taskforce]

Originally Posted by BCOWANWHEELS

plus those engines are throw-a-way non rebuildable............

I respect you and your opinion but this is false. Iron block ls motors can certainly be bored and rebuilt. Aluminum blocks can be bored, but not anymore than .010 usually.

[Just Yourshadow]

I'm going with a mix of the two, I'm sticking with the 350 but I'll be going SEFI and COP using almost entirely stock GM parts. eventually I'll be throwing a turbo on it sloppy style but for right now I just wanted to see how a motor from the early 70s is going to react to being modernized.

[Coley]

......can't help think about the difference in reality between 400hp on tap and 600-1000hp on tap.
Not that there isn't a clear difference, but highly unlikely that it is useful.
A well built, strong small block (stroked 350 to 383) will easily produce 400hp and substantial torque and this will reflect on a light back end vehicle, like a truck, in a big way.

However, in reality (...you guys all know that place)....show some pics where you are using and putting up that extra hp from these LS builds?
Hopefully there are some smokin' 1/4 mile times out there....because this just can't be parking lot burn out stuff....you don't need much power to do that.

Post up your pics from your power results....and no, I don't mean a paper dyno sheet that you keep in the glovebox, lol.
If you some timing sheets showing your 1/8 mile or 1/4 mile times...those would be cool to see.


Now if it is just the driveability and reliability element....very hard to beat an LS motor, even a stock one.

All good
Coley

[Warrens69GMC]

the 327 (5.4) is nothing like the 323 (5.3)

[KQQL IT]

A LS swap will be high on my list with my 68 the 454 in it has something coming from together. When it expires. LS- 4l60 or 80e depending on the engine size.

[jcwren]

Originally Posted by BCOWANWHEELS

Cost, computer, lost vehicle value, complexaty, plus those engines are throw-a-way non rebuildable.............. Stay with stock imo. Far better..............

Seems to me if you keep the original engine and trans, and don't have to cut up the chassis to put in the LS, then you're not losing value. You can always keep the engine around to include as part of the sale, if/when you decide to sell. If someone really wants a non-LS, they can always put it back.

[weq92f]

.
On the value-loss question...

Value loss swap:
I've seen so many LS-swapped trucks that I turn away from immediately because...the junk yard motor was put in there without even being cleaned. The top cover is nasty, dirty and stained a decade+ of road grime and engine oil. The block is nasty, heads are nasty and all the outer components and wiring are also direct from the junk yard...dirty as hell and just grimy looking.

The engine typically is running...OK... but not totally excellent like a new motor with all perfectly working sensors and perfect tolerances. The thing starts and idles...OK... but it's got 200+k miles on it so it's starting to get tired and will have all manner of sensor issues until they have all failed...eventually...

Non loss LS swap:

These typically are those cars and trucks that received either a spankin new GM crate LS or the owner/builder/installer actually took the time and expense to go through the salvage engine to check the bearings/seals/rings/valvetrain, cleaned the engine and tested/repaired/repla ced any failed components and dressed the thing up a bit to make it look like it's didn't just come out of a 2002 Sierra Van or whatever. Also, the ECU and wiring appear to have been well thought out and placed properly either in the engine bay or in the cabin of the vehicle.

Thankfully it's usually easy to spot one of the Value-loss type LS swaps out there and even easier to walk away from it!

-klb

[webfoot]

Right but the same goes for any old SBC you see in a truck too. How many of those are spit shined and rattle canned with cardboard "shields" to keep the paint overspray away from other areas, butched wiring, so it seems like a silly argument against them as shadetree is shadetree no matter what is done.

If a dirty motor runs and is put into another vehicle and it still runs, who really cares though? That is what is done with a lot of SBCs. machine work and complete overhaul aren't cheap. "what cam is in that?" "oh its got a 3/4 cam camel humps and a race converter" with a 2.73 rear on a 327 with a 750 double pumper carb.

If the work is done properly, most of the expense of the swap is the conversion. The motor is the lowest expense.

Kool aid? Get real.

[Slowguy]

Some, but not all...

I cleaned mine up a bit and did a “bit” of freshening up while I was at it

...but you are correct; you should se the before pictures! And it ran fine before but just a WHOLE lot better now

[57taskforce]

Originally Posted by slowguy

some, but not all...

I cleaned mine up a bit and did a “bit” of freshening up while i was at it

...but you are correct; you should se the before pictures! And it ran fine before but just a whole lot better now

nice!

[cleanfreak]

I've seen these posts , and asked myself also. I've bought 3 or 4 LS trucks for the drivetrain and still haven't. You need to determine what you want from your truck. My LS daily drivers are perfect at what they do , And my sbc 67 and sbc 68 are perfect at what they do. Heck, my 68 still has points...Ive been lucky at finding cheap good sbc's , and I just like the 50 year old technology still working. It's all what you want , not the money or the work

[MARKDTN]

Originally Posted by palallin

Don't get me wrong: the 5.3 is a nice enough motor, but I don't notice that much difference in the mileage, and my 327 is about as reliable as an engine made by Man can get. My truck's drivetrain is engineered a unit, and replacing all of it would be far too expensive and involved even if I wanted to.

Yes, I know the 5.3 is a "327," but it ain't no 327! It hasn't the history, the reputation, or the dead-simple reliability.

I would like to address reliability and reputation. The new LS family has been around for over 20 years. I think it has been extremely reliable and has a great reputation. A truck 5.3 can easily go over 300K miles with no issues, not so much for a Gen 1 small-block. My son has my old 2001 Tahoe with 310K+ miles. Never had a valve cover off. Still uses less than a quart of oil in 5000 miles-and it's not black when it comes out. Never had a starter. Had 1 fuel pump and 1 alternator replacement. You can't find very many Gen 1 small blocks that could make that kind of claim-especially oil use. A 300K mile 350 would need a full set of valve guides and would be leaking oil like a sieve-not to mention rattling pistons.

I have nothing against Gen 1 small blocks. I have 2 running (with TPI). But the LS engines really are next level.

[Heavymetl]

The LS is like a bunch of absolute expert-level hot rodders got an unlimited budget and said "let's build the best pushrod V8 ever!"

We'll start with a deep skirt, 6 bolt main block. Raise the cam for stroke clearance and valvetrain stability. And add .020 of deck height over the SBC for good measure.

Then use a gerotor oil pump on the crank snout. Much more efficient than a gear pump.

"We need a large cam core" they said. 55mm and it allows for much higher lift and duration with nice stable ramps for low spring pressure and lower roller lifter speed. Brilliant!

Low tension rings, 6.098 cracked cap rods , 3.62 steel crank, hypereutectic pistons outta the hole for quench.

The cylinder heads first line on paper was injector targeting, as it sprays right on the back of the 15 degree intake valve. Then replicated, high velocity, high flow intake ports, pedestal mounted rockers (big gains there at rpm), and beehive springs.

Composite, coolant isolated intake manifold with long runners for "area under the curve" torque production. The TBSS/NNBS is the factory apex for production manifolds.

All precisely controlled by an ECU using just a handful of simple sensors.


Also, stock engines are really choked down and restricted from their potential. The 5.3 in my 68 Nova has been 11.74@114 with just a cam, springs, headers, and underdrive pulley. Using a TH350 and 3.73 gear. That's yesteryears 383 type performance in a simple junkyard swap.

[Coley]

One thing that would really help the LS engine option....would be a kit to change the appearance under the hood.
It is a modern engine, and as such...is as boring as watching paint dry compared to the original engines.
Plastic covers, etc, etc....serious yawners with the hood up.

As a daily driver you never have the hood up so if that is the case...not an issue.
However if you like going to show'n shines, etc and popping the hood....don't expect anyone to linger too long looking at the engine, at least any longer than they do at the Toyota dealership, lol.

The folks at Holley understood this when they did their super nice '67 C10 shop truck....check out the detail on that newer engine. Very clever and very nicely done to disguise it as an original engine.

All good
Coley

[dmw319]

why not a 5.7L?

[webfoot]

Originally Posted by dmw319

why not a 5.7L?

Lots harder to find now as those were only put in the 4th gen camaros & FB plus corvette through 04 as opposed to millions of LM7 (5.3L) blocks.

Nice looking build Slowguy!

[Wikid61]

A 406 SBC can be done for around $3200-up w/ 425 horses & 525 foot pounds of torque. OR>>>>Find a 1973-76 El Dorado 500 cube motor (rear sump) & get maximum torque, simple tuning & 17+ MPG @55 MPH at 2000 RPM. Or follow the popular crowd w/the latest trends of giant wheels w/O-ring tires, LS & 'patina' that was contrived at best. http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/148...-block-torque/

[Cap'n Hook]

Originally Posted by Wikid61

A 406 SBC can be done for around $3200-up w/ 425 horses & 525 foot pounds of torque. OR>>>>Find a 1973-76 El Dorado 500 cube motor (rear sump) & get maximum torque, simple tuning & 17+ MPG @55 MPH at 2000 RPM. Or follow the popular crowd w/the latest trends of giant wheels w/O-ring tires, LS & 'patina' that was contrived at best. http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/148...-block-torque/

That article you quoted says $6k for that BBC setup. You’re into serious coin there vs a $1.5k 5.3l and 4l60e combo including computer and harness that’ll net probably somewhere around 21mpg. No way a 425hp BBC nets anything over 10-12mpg, cuz you’ll never be able to keep your foot outta it!

[Coley]

A nice 350 small block, stroked to 383 with a kit, a professionally built Quadrajet, a reasonable cam for a heavy vehicle (NOT long duration), new electronic ignition, a new/quality dual plane intake manifold and professional dual exhaust.....and your golden.
You will light up your tires at will, idle great, accelerate like hell, you can detail the heck out of it custom or leave it completely stock appearing.

Ba-da-bing.

All good
Coley

[trac209]

Many guys who have gone the LS route toute mileage as the best advantage and really if you ask me that’s where the advantage ends,even then it’s marginal when you can buy a stand alone Efi and get in that range easy. Friend of a friend has a 383 making an easy 550hp with a 5 spd and a efi and he gets 20 plus mpg all day long. To each there own,personally I find the LS swap the world fad to be getting out of hand.