Thoughts on Gen 5 Vintage Air Install

[Extended Power]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

If I remember correctly, there are three studs. Two are longer and one is shorter. The shorter one goes in the evaporator bracket that attaches to the firewall. This stud is just temporary though. You use it to hold the firewall plate in place while you align the hardlines to the four holes in the firewall plate. Then, when installing the evaporator under the dash, the stud helps to guide the evaporator into position by inserting the stud through the correct hole in the firewall plate. Later, that stud gets removed, and it's replaced with a bolt that threads in from the engine compartment side.

The other two studs are for attaching the center vent to the dash.

Thank you so much!!

[pjmoreland]

I ended up replacing the Vintage Air center A/C vent assembly with an OE one so that it wouldn't interfere with the radio case. I epoxied the Vintage Air cap and duct adapter to the OE vent assembly. Couldn't get the duct on with it installed in the dash just like before, so I had to pull it all back apart, attach the duct, and reassemble.

[MikeB]

I think you got the "SureFitsPoorly" kit instead of the "SureFit".

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by MikeB

I think you got the "SureFitsPoorly" kit instead of the "SureFit".

I think you're right!

[68 C10 Driver]

I like the look of the factory air set-up...but I was looking for a cheaper, but unique system to use for my A/C. I like the center vent, but it would be really hard for me to cut into a nearly flawless dash.

You did an amazing job with your A/C, Bravo! I on the other hand cheaped out and installed an under dash unit. The unit I installed was a new old stock, still in the box ACME unit I picked up from a guy who was going to put it in his C10, but sold the truck before he did. Here are a few pics. The good news is I get my full glove box.

[Steeveedee]

^Somebody has himself an awesome beard!

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by 68 C10 Driver

I like the look of the factory air set-up...but I was looking for a cheaper, but unique system to use for my A/C. I like the center vent, but it would be really hard for me to cut into a nearly flawless dash.

You did an amazing job with your A/C, Bravo! I on the other hand cheaped out and installed an under dash unit. The unit I installed was a new old stock, still in the box ACME unit I picked up from a guy who was going to put it in his C10, but sold the truck before he did. Here are a few pics. The good news is I get my full glove box.

I like the way your under-dash unit looks. Definitely less invasive that way. You have a beautiful dash. I wouldn't have wanted to cut that either. The original dash in my truck was hacked up for a DIN radio, so I replaced the entire dash a few years ago. It did bother me a bit cutting the dash, but at least it looks somewhat stock. The side vent holes are smaller than stock holes, so I could still cut them out bigger for stock vents at some point. I kind of prefer how the VA vents look. They don't stick out like the stock vents.

[Rich72C10]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

I ended up replacing the Vintage Air center A/C vent assembly with an OE one so that it wouldn't interfere with the radio case. I epoxied the Vintage Air cap and duct adapter to the OE vent assembly. Couldn't get the duct on with it installed in the dash just like before, so I had to pull it all back apart, attach the duct, and reassemble.

It is 100% tight back there with AC & Radio, if I ever have to go back in there it will be WAY to soon!

So, about the cap... I seem to recall something about replacing that tube where one end is capped. Seems the theory is when both being feed they more or less cancel each other out. So when you use one that is capped, you get more air and free up space (because you only run one hose).

Thoughts on just running one line with that center tube capped?

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by Rich72C10

Thoughts on just running one line with that center tube capped?

Are you talking about a stock A/C system? Doesn't the duct coming out of the driver side of the center vent feed the driver side vent?

[Rich72C10]

Can't recall to be honest how they went when I replaced the hoses (wasn't fun either).

I found where I heard about that - it was a random video for Brother's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjY3...HERSTruckParts

Edit:
Looks like the video is correct, there are two separate lines going to the center outlet.

[MikeB]

Barely enough room for all those vent hoses without doing some creative packaging! I've got some in my truck hanging by large zip ties. No vent hoses is another advantage that under-dash units have.

A friend of mine who is doing a 1973 'Cuda is keeping his heater/defroster system intact, and using an under-dash unit from Old Air. I'm looking forward to seeing how it works. It's similar to this:



Back in the day I had two cars with aftermarket under-dash units, and I don't remember having any problems with them. Of course, you have to give up the outlet to the left of the steering wheel that blows air on your face. But I was much less demanding back then

Cool intro here to a book about early automotive AC systems. https://macsmobileairclimate.org/201...-conditioning/

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by Rich72C10

Can't recall to be honest how they went when I replaced the hoses (wasn't fun either).

I found where I heard about that - it was a random video for Brother's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjY3...HERSTruckParts

Edit:
Looks like the video is correct, there are two separate lines going to the center outlet.

Interesting. With just the one duct attached to my center vent, the air comes out at about a 45 degree angle, which causes it to blow directly on me, the driver. Having both ducts attached might make the air blow straight outward, which might be nice for a center seat passenger.

[Lee H]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

Interesting. With just the one duct attached to my center vent, the air comes out at about a 45 degree angle, which causes it to blow directly on me, the driver. Having both ducts attached might make the air blow straight outward, which might be nice for a center seat passenger.

That's how my Gen 4 is, single hose dumping all the forced air on the driver. Since I'm the only one in the truck it's not an issue. The dual hose for Gen 5 must be a design change to correct the problem

['68OrangeSunshine]

Swell write up, Pat. But is it totally necessary to remove the stock Heater Core from the engine bay?

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by '68OrangeSunshine

Swell write up, Pat. But is it totally necessary to remove the stock Heater Core from the engine bay?

You could probably leave the stock heater core and box on the firewall, but it wouldn't be functional.

[Richard]

Airflow is most likely better on center vent with a single inlet as long as the larger duct is maintained from the source. The outlet pressurizes and distributes the air. With the stock configuration of two inlets blowing towards each other create more turbulence and airflow is diminished. Just capping the factory vent creates some problems because of the design. There are some aftermarket replacements that taper appropriately.
One of the things I do not like about the compact aftermarket systems is that they use smaller ducting. Smaller ducts create high velocity versus higher volume with larger ducting. I assume the fan in these systems has the ability to overcome the static pressure created.

['68OrangeSunshine]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

You could probably leave the stock heater core and box on the firewall, but it wouldn't be functional.

Guess I'll look for another system. The stock A/C Heater Core is already there. Ain't broke; don't wanna fix it.

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by '68OrangeSunshine

Guess I'll look for another system. The stock A/C Heater Core is already there. Ain't broke; don't wanna fix it.

Sounds like an under-dash system is made for you.

['68OrangeSunshine]

Originally Posted by MikeB

Sounds like an under-dash system is made for you.

I have a Production A/C optioned truck. ['71 GMC Jimmy 4x4 K/1500 Deluxe trim] The OEM air components were stripped, over the years, so I'm starting from Square One or Two. As I live in the Desert South West, I'm looking for a High Performance Air Conditioner.

Under Dash would be great in my Orange Stepside -- if I could source 292 A/C Compressor brackets. But the Jimmy cab already has the factory A/C ducting. And being a 'two door station wagon' [according to AZ MVD] has about 2-1/2 times the cabin volume of a pickup.

[72-k20-burb]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

.

Vintage Air does make a control panel for our trucks. I declined to go that route due to the $275 price tag. I kind of like having the original control panel in my truck. The levers are super easy to move now that they are only moving the sensors that are attached in place of the original mechanical cables.

https://www.vintageair.com/custom/pr....php?pn=473080

Wait - I just called Vintage Air yesterday about the Gen 5 kit and they told me I NEEDED to use their controller because gen 5 is electric only, no cables. Sounded like the cable conversion was no longer a thing. I'm a factory AC and really don't want the cheaper looking controller than my OG chrome one.
In one of the photos it looks like you are running the cable conversion sensors, did those come in the kit?

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by 72-k20-burb

Wait - I just called Vintage Air yesterday about the Gen 5 kit and they told me I NEEDED to use their controller because gen 5 is electric only, no cables. Sounded like the cable conversion was no longer a thing. I'm a factory AC and really don't want the cheaper looking controller than my OG chrome one.
In one of the photos it looks like you are running the cable conversion sensors, did those come in the kit?

The cable conversion sensors did come in my "Without Factory Air" kit. I was planning on using a factory A/C controller, but the guy I talked to on the phone when ordering the kit told me to use my original non-A/C controller with the sensors. I didn't ask him why.

[Jason Banks]

You got the compressor hoses to look pretty nice. On my IV kit, I ended up getting new hoses made so they didn't look like spaghetti. I wondered what fit/orientation they were going for, of if my ends were just crimped on at different orientations that they should have been...

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by Jason Banks

You got the compressor hoses to look pretty nice. On my IV kit, I ended up getting new hoses made so they didn't look like spaghetti. I wondered what fit/orientation they were going for, of if my ends were just crimped on at different orientations that they should have been...

I would have preferred to have the A/C lines coming straight out of the firewall. I don't like how they swoop over toward the inner fender. It doesn't bother me enough to do anything about it though. Their orientation where they attach to the compressor dictated how they are positioned at the firewall.

[68 C10 Driver]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

I like the way your under-dash unit looks. Definitely less invasive that way. You have a beautiful dash. I wouldn't have wanted to cut that either. The original dash in my truck was hacked up for a DIN radio, so I replaced the entire dash a few years ago. It did bother me a bit cutting the dash, but at least it looks somewhat stock. The side vent holes are smaller than stock holes, so I could still cut them out bigger for stock vents at some point. I kind of prefer how the VA vents look. They don't stick out like the stock vents.

@PJMORELAND - Thanks. The only mod I did to ensure the fit of the under dash unit was to remove the 2 heater box end pieces and modify the the left side of the main heater box unit by closing off that end and welding on two of the hose fittings. Hard to explain, so here is a pic of the finished product.

So I took some images from my build post here: https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...=815278&page=9 and starting with Post #220 this was what I did to modify the inside heater box.

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by 72-k20-burb

Wait - I just called Vintage Air yesterday about the Gen 5 kit and they told me I NEEDED to use their controller because gen 5 is electric only, no cables.

Last time I looked, the V/A kit included rheostats (variable resistors) that attach to the OE levers. Maybe they stopped using those, or the sales guy was mistaken.

I was at the Old Air factory in Fort Worth several weeks ago. Like V/A, they use the rheostats attached to the OE levers, but also have an electronic panel designed for our trucks that I think looks nicer than V/A's. It's personal preference, but I would choose the electronic panel instead of using the rheostats. That plus the electronic panel has a much shallower depth.