Working Man's Burbon

[HO455]

Originally Posted by LockDoc

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Thanks for the follow up.

I have never seen an original gauge that moved more than a needle width in either direction. My '68 CST 20 is the only truck I now have that even works....

LockDoc

As always you are welcome. Thanks for the info on the needle movement or lack of.

[HO455]

Originally Posted by Average Joe

Wow!

Fantastic documentation and write up. Thanks again for sharing your work!!

Thank you. It wasn't as good as it should have been. I noticed some errors this morning and have had to do some editing and clarifying not to mention just plain spelling corrections. Somehow the needle in my brain skipped to a different track so I misspelled gauge every time. Dhoo!

[crakarjax]

I tried to do a regulator bypass recently and bailed because I found that my alternator would constantly put out max voltage. I did not add a resistor as you described. Do you think that could have caused the overvoltage?

[HO455]

I would need more information. What model of alternator did you use? How did you convert the wiring? A wiring diagram would help a lot. Some photos of the installation too.
Then for best results I suggest doing a post in the electrical section to get more brains ( and bigger ones than mine) on your problem. I'm confident that the solution can be found.
If you post in the electrical section drop me a line and I will drop over there and help out.

[HO455]

When I have the time I have been plugging away at making some Burban bolts. As everyone knows, (OK not everybody, only the folks who have needed them know) the row of bolts that secure the back edge of the plywood floor are not available, so when Richard 2717 said he bought a hundred of the closest bolt he could find I offered to buy some from him for the WMB. My plan was to turn them down on my lathe, so I needed enough to extra bolts to have some to screw up while I was learning if it was even possible to remachine them into a bolt that would work. Richard2717 being the nice guy he is sent me the whole box and said just to send him a couple sets back. I'm not wanting to bore everyone so I won't go into the details of trying to set up a production line.
But basically it is a two step process to for me to turn them down from the bolt on the left to match the factory bolt on the right. (Photo 1) The steel used in these bolts isn't the greatest quality so that has slowed the process down some. So Richard2717 if your watching I'm making progress.

[Beach-Burban]

Originally Posted by HO455

When I have the time I have been plugging away at making some Burban bolts. As everyone knows, (OK not everybody, only the folks who have needed them know) the row of bolts that secure the back edge of the plywood floor are not available, so when Richard 2717 said he bought a hundred of the closest bolt he could find I offered to buy some from him for the WMB. My plan was to turn them down on my lathe, so I needed enough to extra bolts to have some to screw up while I was learning if it was even possible to remachine them into a bolt that would work. Richard2717 being the nice guy he is sent me the whole box and said just to send him a couple sets back. I'm not wanting to bore everyone so I won't go into the details of trying to set up a production line.
But basically it is a two step process to for me to turn them down from the bolt on the left to match the factory bolt on the right. (Photo 1) The steel used in these bolts isn't the greatest quality so that has slowed the process down some. So Richard2717 if your watching I'm making progress.

Nice work, HO455...I have never had the rear chrome strip and carpet out of the Beach-Burban before, but your post made me run outside and pull it up just to see what you were talking about! Interesting bolts...smooth flat heads, right? Mine still have original paint covering them and although the nut and excess shank hanging down are rusty, they look as if penetrating oil would spin them off in one piece. My plywood looks to be in real good shape, so hopefully I won't have to find out if that's true or not! Thanks for the education...I refer to your build thread quite often.
Woody

[richard2717]

Looking good. I don't have that kind of patience any longer lol. As I said before no rush on this end at all take all the time needed. I was just glad to find something remotely close.

[HO455]

Originally Posted by Beach-Burban

Nice work, HO455...I have never had the rear chrome strip and carpet out of the Beach-Burban before, but your post made me run outside and pull it up just to see what you were talking about! Interesting bolts...smooth flat heads, right? Mine still have original paint covering them and although the nut and excess shank hanging down are rusty, they look as if penetrating oil would spin them off in one piece. My plywood looks to be in real good shape, so hopefully I won't have to find out if that's true or not! Thanks for the education...I refer to your build thread quite often.
Woody

Thank you for your support and encouragement. You are lucky that you have good wood.
Mine has a bunch of holes drilled in it and the edges in the front are getting pretty bad. I would like to get it replaced before the summer ends but we'll see.
My Burban doesn't have any chrome strips holding the carpet. The SPID doesn't list any carpeting or mats so that may be why.
And the worth fact for the day is: I believe that the actual name for that style of bolt is "Plow Head" bolt.

[Beach-Burban]

Originally Posted by HO455

Thank you for your support and encouragement. You are lucky that you have good wood.
Mine has a bunch of holes drilled in it and the edges in the front are getting pretty bad. I would like to get it replaced before the summer ends but we'll see.
My Burban doesn't have any chrome strips holding the carpet. The SPID doesn't list any carpeting or mats so that may be why.
And the worth fact for the day is: I believe that the actual name for that style of bolt is "Plow Head" bolt.

Plow Head...sounds like an insult a rancher would sling at a farmer! Yes, it is nice having "good wood"...not so good when yours has a bunch of holes drilled in it...ouch! As my last name is Wood, I've heard a slew of jokes...the most frequently used one was when I walked into the locker room at the station, everyone would greet me with "morning Wood"! Funny stuff!!! The chrome strip I have clamps down the rear edge of the carpet directly over the row of "plow head bolts"...now I used it in a sentence!
Woody

[HO455]

[HO455]

I got the latest gadget installed! A wide band air/fuel guage made by Innovate. First photo shows the O2 sensors ready for installation after calibration. The instructions were obviously written by someone who is very knowledgeable about the product and assumes everyone knows what they know. So there are gaps in the instructions nothing too terrible but it is definitely not a step by step guide to installation.
This thread by Gregski covers the same guage I purchased.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=713728

The second photo shows it up and running. My initial feelings are good. It seems to be consistent with its readings. It shows my idle ratio to be about 13.4 at start up and within a minute it is at 12.3. When it is idling hot the ratio is 11.8 at the richest. These numbers aren't steady (steady enough not to cause concern) but what my mind is averaging them to be. Obviously I need to lean the idle circuit out but I'm letting things be for now until I get a good handle on how it reacts over time.
Once the truck is driving around in high gear the ratio is between 14.3 and 15.8. With it getting leaner as the truck speeds up leading me to believe that the primary side jetting is good but the power piston spring is too soft. I haven't really had any chance to see what the secondary side is doing. The accelerator pump action also seems to be lean, but as this is my first time with a permanently installed A/F meter I may find that I am wrong about that.
More to follow.

[pwdcougar]

Originally Posted by HO455

When I have the time I have been plugging away at making some Burban bolts. As everyone knows, (OK not everybody, only the folks who have needed them know) the row of bolts that secure the back edge of the plywood floor are not available, so when Richard 2717 said he bought a hundred of the closest bolt he could find I offered to buy some from him for the WMB. My plan was to turn them down on my lathe, so I needed enough to extra bolts to have some to screw up while I was learning if it was even possible to remachine them into a bolt that would work. Richard2717 being the nice guy he is sent me the whole box and said just to send him a couple sets back. I'm not wanting to bore everyone so I won't go into the details of trying to set up a production line.
But basically it is a two step process to for me to turn them down from the bolt on the left to match the factory bolt on the right. (Photo 1) The steel used in these bolts isn't the greatest quality so that has slowed the process down some. So Richard2717 if your watching I'm making progress.

Wow they look great! I used flat head phillips bolts and they look like crap!

Paul

[HO455]

Originally Posted by pwdcougar

Wow they look great! I used flat head phillips bolts and they look like crap!

Paul

I thank you sir. We will see how well they actually work.

[HO455]

Today I started the rear floor replacement. (Actually I started gathering stuff to do this months ago) I wanted to get this done before fall and the rains began again. Not only are there quite a few holes from past accessories but the wood has passed its expiration date, as the photos show. Working alone I started at 11:00 am and quit at 7:30 pm. I got almost all the bolts removed or they are no longer holding the plywood. The exceptions were the two body mount bolts that go through the wood and the 4 bolts that bolt the air tank to the bottom of the floor.

[HO455]

There are 5 different kinds of fasteners (Not counting some of the odd ones that the truck has collected over the years) used to hold the wood down. (Photo 1) Bolts #2 & 3 are used to bolt the spare tire wheel well in.
In addition GM used two kinds of nuts on the bottom, a regular hex style requiring a 1/2" wrench to remove and square stove bolt style nuts that require a 7/16" 8 point socket for removal.
Bolt #4 is used around the perimeter of the wood and is the most numerous. I don't have a count yet but, I will get a complete list posted.
Bolt #1 is used to fasten the wood to the underside support channels that run from one side of the truck to the other. They don't connect to the frame. These are a carriage style bolt with a large flat head. These bolts are counter sunk below the level of the floor and have a little metal insert under the head of the bolt with a square hole to match the square under the head of bolt. (See photos 2 & 3) I do not know if the metal inserts with the square hole are available so I am hoping that I can reuse all of them.
Bolt #5 is used to secure the floor across the back. (Last photos) They go through a light guage angle with stamped countersunk holes with square holes. These bolts are called Plow Head bolts and as far as I know they are not available in the size used on our Burban.

There are 12 of the #1 bolt.
There are 7 of the #2 bolt ( I think, I can't read my handwriting. Dhoo!)
There are 6 of the #3 bolt
There are 39 or 40 of the #4 bolt. Mine had 39 but there was a punched hole in the driver's side wheel well that appears to never had a bolt installed.
There are 6 of the #5 bolt.

[HO455]

More photos of the angle piece that goes across the back. Unfortunately mine is in less than optimal condition, so I will have to figure something out. Replace or possibly repair it. As of yet I have been unable to remove any of the bolts through it. But i m hoping that soaking in penetrating oil overnight will solve that issue.

About 2/3's of the bolts loosened and then spun in the square hole. This meant I had to hold them on top and turn them from below. After trying several different ideas I ended up grabbing the head from the top with a pair of Vice Grips. I then used a sheet rock style screw to screw the Vice Grips to the floor to keep them from spinning. (Photo #3) Having a helper would have made this much easier and faster. I also found that using an impact on the nut would cause the bolt to slip out of the Vice Grip, but using a ratchet instead allowed me to either unscrew the nut or twist the bolt in two.
I kind of cheated on the rear support channel bolts as the air compressor and tank are in the way. I used a hole saw to cut the wood around the bolt away so I can remove the rest of the wood and then deal with those bolts from above. I used a wood jig to hold the hole saw in place as I removed the pilot bit from the hole saw so it wouldn't hit the bolt. (Photo #4)
I started by removing the spare tire well. The most difficult part of this was making sure that I didn't strip any of the captured nuts. (Photo #5 the bolts through the circular side of the wheel well go to the hidden nuts) These nuts are not accessible short of cutting a hole in the quarter panel. I loosened them a half turn then shot them with penetrating oil then turned them back in to get oil through to the nut. A slow process but no nuts were stripped. The six Phillips head screws were particularly a pain as the head stripped out on three of them. The one in the bottom with no access to the nut was the last one I did and was expecting a real fight to get it out but it seemed like it was crossthreaded when it was installed and it fell out after a 1/2 turn. Hopefully it won't come back and haunt me later.

[richard2717]

Easiest way I have found for removing the bolts is to just drill the heads off and punch them thru. They mostly want to spin and tear up the metal anyway when trying to remove the nuts. I have been able to save a lot of metal repairs to wheel tub flanges and to the front and rear metal connections. It is difficult to get to a few of the spare tire bolt heads but can be done.

[04ls1gto]

Also helps to get underneath with a wire brush or wheel and clean threads off. Getting plywood out is a multi person job. Do yourself a favor and get some marine grade plywood for the new one

[HO455]

Originally Posted by richard2717

Easiest way I have found for removing the bolts is to just drill the heads off and punch them thru. They mostly want to spin and tear up the metal anyway when trying to remove the nuts. I have been able to save a lot of metal repairs to wheel tub flanges and to the front and rear metal connections. It is difficult to get to a few of the spare tire bolt heads but can be done.

Actually I did that on the bolts across the front. Thank you for pointing that out.
The ones on the sides the wood was so degraded that I could pry the head of the bolt up 3/16 to 1/4" and clamp it with the Vice Grip. So I would set five bolts up (Thats how many pairs of Vice Grips I have ) and then jump underneath and twist them or the nut off.

[HO455]

Originally Posted by 04ls1gto

Also helps to get underneath with a wire brush or wheel and clean threads off. Getting plywood out is a multi person job. Do yourself a favor and get some marine grade plywood for the new one

That was part of last months preparations. I gave the bolts a shot of penetrating oil and a week later hit them with a wire wheel and another round of oil. I did a round of oil last Thursday hoping that enough oil would make things just fall off.
I have two sheets of Gator Board I got off Craig's List for the new floor. It is Douglas Fir marine plywood that has a resin non-skid coating on both sides. It is commonly used on docks and ramps.

[HO455]

After removing the air tank and the body mount bolts it was time to get the old wood out. The little piece in front passenger side corner only took a push and it fell right out. Then I screwed two wood blocks to the remaining big piece. (Photo #1). This allowed me to take the persuader and bump the wood towards the passenger side. (Photo #2) It all went fine until I came up against the rear tire. Curse those wide tires. Fortunately I had plenty of travel in the suspension and was able to jack the truck high enough so the plywood would slide over above the tire. Otherwise I would have had to remove the wheel.
The next step was to raise the drivers side up so the piece would then slide out of the back. Those GM engineers didn't leave a lot of extra room to get the floor out. The wood just fits at an angle through the back door/ hatch.
I wonder at what stage in the assembly process the wood was installed at the factory. It is hard to believe there was any cost savings for GM by using wood instead of a metal pan.
OK back on track. I used some wood clamps in the extend configuration (instead of compression) to push the wood upwards on the drivers side. (Photo #3) with them holding the wood I slowly wriggled the piece out the back, resetting the clamps a couple of times as I came out. As 04lsGTO said having friends would have made this much simpler. Finally success (Photo #4).

[Average Joe]

Wow! Nice work and fantastic write up!!! Your abs must have really gotten a work out going back and forth so many times. Very creative idea though fastening the vice grips down.

[HO455]

Here are the three under the wood supports. (Photos #1 & #2) Actually the front one isn't really a support but it has the cage nuts for the rear seat and its seat belts. I am guessing that a Burban that came with the third row seat would have a different version of this and possibly one for the third seat too. The seats have been in and out of the WMB so many times over the years all threads in the cage nuts are stripped.
The two 2 bolt hole plates in the back support are where the upper part of the body mount bushings contact.
I failed to get pictures but I was able to get the bolts out of the rear top plate without damaging it. I had to heat them with my Map gas torch and then grab the bolt with a pair if Vice Grips. While wiggling the bolt with a the pliers I tapped the end with a ball pein hammer.

[CG]

This thread is one of the reasons that I sometimes think it would be better to have all of our trucks grouped in one area instead of split up. Sure there is some burb specific stuff you are doing, but overall this is just a really good build thread with a ton of great ideas and fixes. Things that everyone, no matter what they are building would benefit from.

Blazers was an area I seldom looked at until I picked up a SWB K10 truck project. My thinking was they would have a similar overall look because the wheel base was so close. There was so much stuff there that pertains to all of our trucks, I wish I would have dug in earlier

Thanks for a very good build thread. You are doing a great job!

[richard2717]

Originally Posted by HO455

I wonder at what stage in the assembly process the wood was installed at the factory. It is hard to believe there was any cost savings for GM by using wood instead of a metal pan.
(Photo #4).

I tend to wonder if it was to help deaden sound since a lot of these did not get any other treatments on top of it.