Restoring Rusty

[Gregski]

and a little later...

man you don't realize how much plumbing and plugging of holes you don't need there is when you swap an intake manifold, lol

I think I blew it on the passenger side valve cover and put it on backwards, but oh well, I'm sure it will be coming off for some unforsaken reason anyways

[Gregski]

and a couple hours later, shortly afer 9:00 PM we was done

she fired up on the first try, which was shocking since I forgot to mention my one year old H.E.I. distributor seized... after I took it off the truck. I went to put it back on and it would not spin by hand, so I was like what the hewk... so I busted out with my trusty two year old (hee hee) Petronix H.E.I. and it dropped right in and like I said fired up on the first try...

so the truck fired right up and ran, I checked the timing and it was at like 26* initial so I dropped it down to 12* initial and called it good, dialed the idle back to 900 RPM which is where I had it before, that's where I get the highest vacuum of 19"

I was surprised that my idle AFR was perfect in the high 13.9s border line low 14.4s just as it was before

different cylinder heads, different intake manifold and the truck idles the same, I took it around the block in the residential area 35-45 MPH and it drove the same(ish)

well other than the dreaded massive exhaust leak!!! see those rusty Hooker headers, I hate 'em!

[Gregski]

so I sat there depressed in my thinking chair drinking my wifes Chardonnay out of the bottle (seriously we were all out of 805) when I remembered December 4th... that's right I bought some FlowTech headers and they have just been hanging on my garage wall for 5 months, gentlemen I think they are acclimated!!! I've been meaning to tell you about those, but you know life got in the way...

[Gregski]

it was nearly 10 PM by now but I got a second wind, I did not know if it was the wine or my hate of the Hookers but the next thing I knew I was pulling out the spark plugs which were still hot, and next thing I knew the old passenger side header was on the garage floor right next to the new one

I got as far as mounting the Flow Tech header on the passenger side and oh my god perfect fit and you can reach all the bolts, one criticism you can't get a socket on the #6 spark plug, had to use an open ended wrench to snug it up, hmmm, nothing's perfect

I called it a day/night here, The Greg is pooped! thanks for reading

[Wgesnerjr]

That's the way I like to start my day; having my morning coffee and catching up with Rusty.

[MikeB]

Yes, no guide plates with self-aligning rockers. And make sure the rockers contact only the valve stem tips, and not the retainers.

As for a Performer RPM Air Gap, I'd pass on the gimmick (and the cold weather warm-up issues) and get a good ol' 7101 Performer RPM. Or if you want to maximize torque in the mid-range, a Performer EPS Or better yet, the much newer-design Weiand 8120 Street Warrior. But, hey, it sounds like the open plenum manifold is working just fine for you.

Did you get rid of that Holley 80457, or convert it to dual inlet float bowls? And are you able to use the rear vacuum port on the manifold? A problem with Edelbrock manifolds is the rear port is somewhat obscured by a Holley float bowl.

Glad to see you got some nice heads. My 350 got new Vortecs four years ago, but if I had a do-over I'd go with conventional heads. No problems so far, but their thin castings are prone to crack if the engine is overheated -- apparently even slightly overheated. That's why the vast majority of used Vortecs have hairline cracks. Of course I learn this after buying the heads, manifold, valve covers, expensive intake gaskets, etc, etc.

[Gregski]

Mike really good info in your post, and I will address all your points soon when my brain is fully On, but first just some quick answers.

Originally Posted by MikeB

Did you get rid of that Holley 80457, or convert it to dual inlet float bowls?

Nope I still have it and yes I converted it to a dual bowl dual inlet sight glass bowls with two metering blocks and got rid of that silly metering plate in the back.

Originally Posted by MikeB

And are you able to use the rear vacuum port on the manifold? A problem with Edelbrock manifolds is the rear port is somewhat obscured by a Holley float bowl.

Ha ha, I almost forgot to plug that port in the back of the intake manifold, I thought about tapping into it with a 90* but then I thought I just use the port in the back of my carb for the brake booster. I may have been able to clear it since I run a 1" carb spacer, but on a second thought I may wanna experiment without the spacer, so it's probably best I didn't use it.

Originally Posted by MikeB

Glad to see you got some nice heads.

As our friend Lucky Costa of the Hot Rod Garage fame said, "after careful hours of research, I bought the first thing I saw" I may have gotten lucky with these, don't know yet, but it's what was sitting on the office floor at the machine shop, the owner said he wanted to use them on his own motor, (BINGO... I thought good enuff for him, good enuff fer me) but he said they been there three years since some guy couldn't afford to pay off one of his engine rebuilds the shop owner got em in a trade/barter.

Originally Posted by MikeB

My 350 got new Vortecs four years ago, but if I had a do-over I'd go with conventional heads. No problems so far, but their thin castings are prone to crack if the engine is overheated -- apparently even slightly overheated. That's why the vast majority of used Vortecs have hairline cracks. Of course I learn this after buying the heads, manifold, valve covers, expensive intake gaskets, etc, etc.

Awesome bro, have you tried the Crane Cams 10309-1 spring kit on them to get the higher lift or the Comp Cams 26915, 26918 beehive springs? No doubt they crack I have now gone through five pairs of Vortec heads, that's 10 cylinder heads from the junk yard, and none of them was any good.

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by Gregski

... have you tried the Crane Cams 10309-1 spring kit on them to get the higher lift or the Comp Cams 26915, 26918 beehive springs?

After running the stock heads for a year or so, I switched to GM LS6/LS2 beehive valve springs. Installed them at 1.750" using CompCams 787-16 retainers and 648-16 locks. It's a super clean setup.

Cam is a GMPP roller used in the HT383 and RamJet 350 crate engines. It's a small cam by "bigger is better" hot rodder standards, but GM's HP/TQ chart for the RamJet shows it has a very wide powerband that's perfect for an around town cruiser and running to the dump. But the engine is definitely not a dog when I stomp on the gas. In fact, if/when I go to a lower gear than its current 2.73, the truck should be downright quick.

My headers are Patriot H8048, which are made in the same Mexico plant using the same pattern as Doug's headers. (Both are Pertronix brands.) However, I had to re-route the hard lines on the passenger side because the #2 tube hit them. What a PITA. But, man the tubing is heavy gauge, the flanges thick, and they tuck up high. For the money, your Flowtechs look great.

Edit: Don't even think about using those headers gaskets. What's worked for me over the years are both Fel-Pro square (#1444) and Mr. Gasket round (don't have the P/N) steel core header gaskets. Also, Summit aluminum collector gaskets. All are reusable 1-2 times. But heck, we know you never tear anything apart once it's assembled.

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by Wgesnerjr

That's the way I like to start my day; having my morning coffee and catching up with Rusty.

LOL, thank you so much, I sense since this thread be four years old the original audience may have changed a bit, but I aim to please regardless, also I be lying to you all if I said Rusty being my daily driver hasn't changed the way I wrench on it, its all about Progress not Perfection now, but it's all good

[Gregski]

well I'll be a wart hogs _ _ _ I recon them FlowTech headers came with 3" collector extensions, gaskets, and even bolts, if I can only find that stuff in my garage, it's been five months since I got these, hee hee, unless Summit is just teasing me with this pic...

Collector Reducers Included: Yes
Collector Reducer Exit Diameter: 2.500 in.
Bolts/Studs Included: Yes
Gaskets Included: Yes

[Gregski]

found em! man I wish I remembered I had these, I wouldn't have to buy that $27 exhaust gasket set, oh well

those of you who have been following Rusty for a while, know that we have not been in this house an entire year yet, so I am still trying to get the work shop all set up, and I'm sure you all know how much fun moving and doing the setup all over again is - Not!

[Gregski]

so got the driver side header off, here's a little stare and compare, I hated that dreaded #5 pipe in the ol' Hooker header on the right, the long one across the top

[Gregski]

took some pics of the exhaust gasket against the cylinder head for us all to ponder the sealability factor, or lack there of, these E-Street heads have a funny D shaped exhaust port, note the gaskets be square

Vote of Confidence = low, ha ha

a friend of mine, Mopar Seth seems to think you match the gasket to the header not the head, I don't know what to think

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by Gregski

took some pics of the exhaust gasket against the cylinder head for us all to ponder the sealability factor, or lack there of, these E-Street heads have a funny D shaped exhaust port, note the gaskets be square

Looks like someone opened up those ports. Oh wait, I'll bet they are the 200cc version. There are D-port gaskets available, so you should google them or check Summit.

The keys to gasket selection are not to block the head port and to make sure you have at least 1/4" of seal around the header flange and the head's gasket surface. Otherwise you get blow-outs which give headers a bad rap. Exhaust flow is at max volume at the top of the port, so that's the most critical place not to block.

Enough said. I'll stop hijacking your thread.

[Gregski]

and soon enough it was a cuttin' time, and the wheel of death was out

[Gregski]

so Plan A was simple, we cut off the flange off of the 2.5" pipe and weld on the 3" to 2.5" reduction flange...

[Gregski]

remember to slip on the bracket before you weld on the flange, hee hee

... preferable on the right side of the beed

[Gregski]

yes, Ray Charles welded these for me [ahem] with his feet, ha ha

ok I have not dialed in my welder on that beed ok, I'm going with that excuse

[Gregski]

and after all that we would have to cut it all up and start over with Plan B, because the header collectors don't run parallel to the floor but are angled down ever so slightly, darn it

so the other side looks more like this after it's all buggered up, hard to tell there's an angle but trust me on this one

[Gregski]

OK, so...

How does it run?

- honestly about the same, not any worse, and not significantly that much better, maybe these E-Street heads are not that much better than the Vortecs I had on there. Also I get the same excellent vacuum at idle of 19" even with the single plane intake manifold. If anything the driveability may be a bit more crisp. I can get it to 4000 RPM in second gear, but I haven't gotten it to 4000 in third gear (it's direct drive in my transmission) cause I ran out of road, ha ha

Did it fix the coolant leak?

- too soon to tell, need at least a week of driving

Did it fix the exhaust leak?

- no, and this frustrates me to no end, so I will try a round port gasket next I think, I also reached out to Reflex Tech Support, we'll see what they say

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by Gregski

OK, so...

How does it run?

- honestly about the same, not any worse, and not significantly that much better, maybe these E-Street heads are not that much better than the Vortecs I had on there. Also I get the same excellent vacuum at idle of 19" even with the single plane intake manifold. If anything the drive-ability may be a bit more crisp.

Your E-Street heads probably flow better than the Vortecs at lifts above .450". However, Vortecs are hard to beat at lower lifts and have great "average flow" numbers from .200" to .450" or so. They were designed to make lots of torque in the L31 pickup truck engine with cam specs of 191º/196º, .414"/.428.

BTW, I was wrong about your heads being 200cc. Looks like the only E-Street head is 185cc with either 64cc or 70cc chambers. Good bang for the buck.

Have you determined your static compression ratio? That cam would probably like 9.5-10:1 with aluminum heads.

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by MikeB

BTW, I was wrong about your heads being 200cc. Looks like the only E-Street head is 185cc with either 64cc or 70cc chambers. Good bang for the buck.

Yeah these are the 185cc ports with 64cc chambers so I am quite happy with those specs. However there's some nonsense about them not being able to be run with roller cams. That is not an issue with this flat tapped block/cam combo, but in case I wanted to move them to my other spare roller block... just thinking ahead

also they don't recommend reving them above 5,500 RPM which I don't expect to be an issue on this ol' mouse!

IMPORTANT NOTE: "E-Street Cylinder Heads are equipped with 1.460” diameter valve springs that have been tested to 5,500 rpm with
an Edelbrock Performer camshaft. DO NOT EXCEED 5,500 RPM WITH THESE SPRINGS. Higher operating speeds may induce valve float
which can cause severe engine damage. Performer RPM heads are recommended for higher engine speeds. Check the spring specs for
your camshaft before installing these heads."

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by Gregski

Yeah these are the 185cc ports with 64cc chambers so I am quite happy with those specs. However there's some nonsense about them not being able to be run with roller cams. That is not an issue with this flat tapped block/cam combo, but in case I wanted to move them to my other spare roller block... just thinking ahead

It's just a matter of selecting proper valve springs for the roller cam you may choose someday. No big deal at all. The main thing is having enough spring pressure to keep the heavier roller lifters in check.

Those round port gaskets look great. I sometimes file them open a little to make sure no part of the port is covered.

***Edit: I just posted a question at Summit asking for spring installed height, seat pressure, and rate. A 1.46" spring installed at a height that allows .550" lift would typically be stiff enough to handle 6000 RPM or more, as well as many mild roller cams. The only thing that makes sense is Edelbrock chose a soft, long travel spring for this head.

[Gregski]

Happy Mother's Day... weekend everyone!

So the "exhaust" leak has been bothering me so I snuck out early on Saturday morning and replaced the square port gaskets with these round port ones on the passenger side, and today (Sunday) I snuck out early 8:00 am before all the festivities started and did the driver side.

[Gregski]

here I am comparing the new round port exhaust gaskets (top) with the oval ones (bottom) that came with the Flowtech headers.

I think the oval ones would have been way too tall to cover the E-Street heads flat bottom D shaped ports, but these round ones may just work.

the sharpie outlines the difference, note the top gasket is wavy and not flat so it seems like its off the pen mark, just letting you know