Restoring Rusty

[Gregski]

and then the gods smiled at us and said let there be LS Swaps...

[Gregski]

... and pretty soon we were WINNING

I don't know much about the 5.3 L LS engines but I do know that in 2002 they got rid of the EGR holes in the exhaust manifolds, so rather than buy block off plates for mine (2001 ?) I decided to just swap the manifolds for that oh so important cleaner look - Chics dig smooth manifolds!

this was such a triple win:

1. we got EGR hole free manifolds

2. they came with downpipes (less bending of pipes for me)

3. they came with downpipes that had O2 bungs already in them in the factory locations

[hatzie]

Programming the 6.0L LQ4 or LQ9 PCM to operate stand-alone for a Manual transmission or early mechanical Automagic is the same as programming the 5.3L LM7 PCM for the same. Other people have done this so tune files that you can peruse to see how the other guys did it should be easily available.
You can change from 4x4 to 2x4 just as easily.

Programming...

Programming the PCM to GM defaults for the donor engine and settings you want would be my first step. Pick a VIN for the LM7 that has a manual transmission and 2WD. Who cares what the VIN in the PCM is as long as it has the options you want so you can write the proper baseline Calibrations to the PCM. If you look at my 2005 Silverado thread there's info on how to do this using a Chinese WiFi MDI or GM VX Diag or some other SAE J2534 interface and the AC Delco TIS web applet. You will have to pay $40 for a 2 year Delco TIS subscription... HP Tuners MPVI2 doesn't act as a J2534 interface.

First set the PCM to an original GM baseline via TIS then start tuning it. Why do I say this?
HP Tuners, and likely others, business model is geared toward servicing professional "tuner" shops. Hobbyists appear to be an annoyance to them. The "single PCM" credits you buy are supposedly licensed to one PCM. There is no un-changeable ESN in the PCM so "Licensed to a PCM" is not an accurate description of how they are determining what PCM is connected to the interface. As near as I can determine they use the PCM Operating System, VIN, and several other software settable items to determine what PCM the interface is connected to. These software settable items could be changed by an update from TIS. If you change/update the OS or configs from TIS after you register HP Credits to the PCM it will void the credits even tho you haven't changed the hardware. They will make you buy two more credits for the "new" PCM. They are pretty hard nosed about it too.

I believe the LQ4 and LQ9 cranks were bored for a pilot bearing. You just have to get one that matches the input shaft on your transmission.

The LS bellhousing is missing one of the RH bolts but the old Chevy bellhousing will still bolt up.

The flywheel and possibly the transmission input shaft length is where it starts to get fun. The distance of the flywheel mounting surface of the crank to the bellhousing mounting surface differ from the old Chebby smallblock and big block engines.

[Gregski]

PICK-n-PULL is also a great place to document how things are connected. Here we snap a pic of one of the ground straps and file it for later. It runs from the back of the driver side cylinder head to the firewall, yes we tried to remove it but that bolt in the back of the cylinder head is impossible to get at while the engine is still in the vehicle, thank you GM (does the G stand for German, LOL)

[Gregski]

top of the morning to you my fellow LS Swappers

decided to evaluate the wiring harness, I knew it was a bit ruff

it appears the previous owner started to thin it out already and judging from the way he put the blue pin guard thingies upside down I have a tendency not to trust his work too much, ha ha

why not just send that harness in to a pro to have him do it for you?

well now how do we expect to fill the Cuss Jar if we do that?

Please Note: there are so many outstanding tutorials WW.LT1SWAP.COM on all things LS Swap that I am not going to reinvent the wheel and do a how to, but just share with you some things from my crazy Pollack perspective (ie LS Swap for the Complete Idiot underlined for emphasis not a link, ha ha)

I will be following the procedures using the [ahem] Old Testament found here: PCM Connector Pinouts 99-02 to identify and label all the connectors.

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by hatzie

Programming the PCM to GM defaults for the donor engine and settings you want would be my first step. Pick a VIN for the LM7 that has a manual transmission and 2WD. Who cares what the VIN in the PCM is as long as it has the options you want.

Seriously, that is Information Gold right there bro

Originally Posted by hatzie

If you look at my 2005 Silverado thread there's info on how to do this using a Chinese WiFi MDI or GM VX Diag or some other SAE J2534 interface and the AC Delco TIS web applet. You will have to pay $40 for a 2 year Delco TIS subscription.

First set the PCM to an original GM baseline via TIS then start tuning it.

thank you so much

[hatzie]

Originally Posted by Gregski

Seriously, that is Information Gold right there bro



thank you so much

The HP Tuners way of installing a "new" PCM is geared toward optimizing their profitability and steering you toward buying year or model blocks for more $.
You don't have to buy 6 credits to program a replacement GMT800 PCM...
Program the "new" PCM to the VIN you are using with TIS and a J2534 interface... then purchase 2 HPT credits for that "new PCM".

[kipps]

Originally Posted by hatzie

The flywheel and possibly the transmission input shaft length is where it starts to get fun. The distance of the flywheel mounting surface of the crank to the bellhousing mounting surface differ from the old Chebby smallblock and big block engines.

The 5.3 LM7 should be bored for a pilot bearing as well. After all, it was the same crank as a 6.0, which was optioned with a manual.

Put a 4.8/6.0 flywheel on the 5.3, and you'll be within adjustment distance of the original small block.

The Vehicle speed sensor could cause some issues. I'm still looking into that on a Gen 4. I also intend to get an accurate enough signal through the computer to run a stock '91 speedo.

Some random measurements and notes of mine are found here.

[Gregski]

so my harness is 90% good except for the branch that runs to the MAF which includes the passenger side two O2 sensors, well the previous owner cut them both off, so I yanked out the after cat wires and left the pre cat ones in, but I am stumped by some junk that appears to be spliced on to a black ground, one pink wire, and one really heavy gauge red wire that runs up to the fuse block with a single black connector

maybe one of youz can help me out

[hatzie]

I have the 2005 service manuals in hardcopy but those are for the 2nd design T800 chassis. Unfortunately your donor was 1st design T800.
Alldata has Mitchell wiring diagrams. Not GM... and there are errors in some areas but definitely better than Haynes or Chilton.

Maybe my 2005 wiring diagrams could shed some light on it. What position on the fuse/relay block was that plugged into?

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by hatzie

I have the 2005 service manuals in hardcopy but those are for the 2nd design T800 chassis. Unfortunately your donor was 1st design T800.
Alldata has Mitchell wiring diagrams. Not GM... and there are errors in some areas but definitely better than Haynes or Chilton.

Maybe my 2005 wiring diagrams could shed some light on it. What position on the fuse/relay block was that plugged into?

thank you for trying to help, unfortunately the fuse block did not come with it, and the engine was already out of a vehicle so we did not know what it came out of, here is a better look at that single red wire stand alone plug and a fuse block panel I grabbed off the internet

[Gregski]

play your cards right and you too can some day find yourself at the Pick N Pull Premier yard, no actually just take a right instead of a left at the check in counter, ha

scored a MAF off of a 4.8 L 2001 Chevrolet Silverado 1500 Extended Cab! snagged the entire enclosure just in case we decide to replicate the stock look, don't know yet

I bought it based on Internet information that the 4.8 and the 5.3 are pretty much the same, correct me if I am wrong

[Gregski]

I don't usually buy used O2 Sensors but when I do I ensure they are the wrong ones! ha ha

So I pulled the O2 sensors off of that truck assuming mine was a 2001 as well, but later I found out mine are not the square plug but the flat four kind, maybe somebody can set me straight on this as I thought the square plugs may have started in 2002 when they went EGRless exhaust manifolds, but what do I know?!

so these are the wrong ones for my harness

12562943
DENSO
234000-5170
08B07

[Gregski]

fortunately a 1999 GMC New Sierra 1500 also 4.8L Extended Cab had the right O2 sensors

[LeesTruk]

Nice to see you joining the LS community. I also am running an LM7/4L60e combo. Yer gonna love it!! I'm sure you've done your research before jumping into this project. Here's a couple of tips for you. The truck exhaust manifolds won't fit, not unless you want to do some frame surgery. Get yourself some Trailblazer/Envoy/Rainier v8 manifolds. No slicing, no dicing, a simple bolt-on. AND... your down pipes will bolt right up to them. Check your rear gear ratio. I found that with a 3:08 gear, my RPM's @ 70/75mph were around 1600. The LS motors like to rev. You can use your existing gauge senders simply by drilling/tapping the pass. head and original oil pressure sender base. The PCM sends a 4cyl. tach signal so you'll have to see if your aftermarket tach can be changed for that, and most likely the tach is gonna need a pull-up resistor to function. Also, does your aftermarket speedo operate mechanically or electrically? If mechanical, your gonna need some sort of electro mechanical adaptor (check Speedhut) as the 4L60E uses a speed sensor that tells the PCM your speed, and the PCM tells the trans when to shift. You gotta have that. The swap is a definite learning experience, but well worth the effort. Tejas Steelworks has a nice guide you can use (free, online) to help you along the way.

[hatzie]

If the O2 sensors are otherwise the same you can change out the Metripak connector shells on your harness or the O2 sensors themselves fairly easily.

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by LeesTruk

Nice to see you joining the LS community. I also am running an LM7/4L60e combo. Yer gonna love it!!

Thanks for all the great info, I can't wait

Originally Posted by LeesTruk

The truck exhaust manifolds won't fit, not unless you want to do some frame surgery. Get yourself some Trailblazer/Envoy/Rainier v8 manifolds. No slicing, no dicing, a simple bolt-on. AND... your down pipes will bolt right up to them.

Ah snap I just bought a second set of used EGR hole free truck manifolds (only $40 bucks, but still). And being too cool for school I did not have Pick N Pull mark em for returns.

Originally Posted by LeesTruk

Also, does your aftermarket speedo operate mechanically or electrically?

It's electronic.

What engine mounts do you recommend?

[kipps]

Originally Posted by LeesTruk

Get yourself some Trailblazer/Envoy/Rainier v8 manifolds. No slicing, no dicing, a simple bolt-on.

That's if you're using the auto tranny.

If you're using a manual tranny with z-bar linkage or a driver's side external slave, you'll need a 99-02 F-body manifold on the driver's side.


Edit to add: I'm told the stock truck manifolds will fit a square body frame with only minor modifications. Supposedly you have to whittle away about 3/8 of an inch on the frame, and it's good to go.

[Gregski]

I also found another 12200411 PCM in this gorgeous 2002 Chevrolet Tahoe 4dr 1500 4WD LS

I bought it because this one we know has a VIN: 1GNEK13V32J326764 and so we will see how my ELM 327 Interface handles it?

We also get to see how the wiring harness enters the red and blue connectors going into the computer (since my harness was already [ahem] "worked on" some of the wires were slightly re routed to put it nicely)

[Gregski]

OK so bear with me as I try and explain the method to my madness.

The 2002 Tahoe VIN is 1GNEK13V32J326764 we know that as a matter of fact

My ELM 327 Interface (which I do not recommend for this action, I just happen to have it for some reason) reads it as: 1iGNEK13V3:2J32

OK, let's set those over each other

1iGNEK13V3:2J326764
1iGNEK13V3:2J32

so the "i" is meaningless and so is the ":" but note how it only reads the first 13 characters out of the 17 possible?

OK, so now let's reverse engineer what the ELM 327 Interface had for my ECM (we must do this manually as the online VIN checkers won't help us since we don't have enough digits)

1iGTEC!14V01Z19V

using what HATZIE shared with me and the InterWebs we go about deciphering the digits

1 = US

G = GM

1GT = according to the World Manufacturer Identifier ... [wait for it] GMC holy snap, BONUS, cause you know my truck is actually a GMC

E = Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, or GVWR, is revealed by the fourth character. E for 6001-7000

C = RWD instead of K = 4WD awesome that's what we wanted

1 = Identifies the body style, number 1 is used for a 1500

4 = Identifies the body type, the number 4 is for a two-door cab

V = this 8th digit is the engine designation V = 4.8L LR4, T = 5.3L LM7 so this sucks but maybe the computer is not original to this motor so fingers crossed as we drop the pan and check the number on the crank

0 = A Check Digit used to algorithmatically validate the entire VIN (blah blah blah)

1 = Indicates the model year ie 2001, more Awesomeness aka Drive By Cable

Z = plant in which the vehicle was manufactured, couldn't care less

1 9 V _ _ _ = The last six digits are used to identify a specific vehicle within the border Year/Make/Model class, not sure why there is an alpha "V" in there

[Gregski]

couldn't help my myself, had to lift her skirt up and take a look at 'em Cylinderellas heads

man these valve covers are cast = Nice!

Everything appears to look in order on the interior. So I gave both sides a little sprinkle of holy water (WD-40)

then I cleaned one valve cover for comparison, (engine like that you don't clean both sides in one day... ha ha - one's got to pace himself)

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by hatzie

Programming...

Programming the PCM to GM defaults for the donor engine and settings you want would be my first step. Pick a VIN for the LM7 that has a manual transmission and 2WD. Who cares what the VIN in the PCM is as long as it has the options you want so you can write the proper baseline Calibrations to the PCM. If you look at my 2005 Silverado thread there's info on how to do this using a Chinese WiFi MDI or GM VX Diag or some other SAE J2534 interface and the AC Delco TIS web applet. You will have to pay $40 for a 2 year Delco TIS subscription... HP Tuners MPVI2 doesn't act as a J2534 interface.

First set the PCM to an original GM baseline via TIS then start tuning it.

let's dance

[Gregski]

so this Chinese knock off VXDIAG VCXNANO Vehicle Communication Interface comes with absolutely zero instructions or documentation

I guessed at installing something called VX Manager.exe off of the DVD provided and that appears to install the drivers for it

so I get a program called ALLScanner to launch and I saw some video of a dude clicking on the License icon so I did that and it got licensed, but now what?

I guess I need the GM GDS2/T2W Diagnostic module but the darn thing won't install I have tried it now on two computers

[hatzie]

Tech2win and vxmanager setup.
http://youtu.be/kaI9kYxgEyQ

[Jake Wade]

That engine is CLEAN under the valve cover. Looks like whoever had it changed the oil regularly. Nice score!