The Official John Lee Jr Thread

[Sharps40]

Stand by...replaced cap/rotor and carb base gasket. Retimed, no slip of balancer or gear and... No change. No power, significant miss, incredible top end clatter that comes and goes between 1000 and 3000 rpm.

No time like the present for a professional assessment....will have it towed tomorrow to one of two shops....One is a hot rod/paint body shop....other is a fine local shop that does racing and ain't afraid of any old vehicle and is a certified Jasper installer.......

Cross yer fingers. But, John Lee is down and out, bad sick....

[TJ's Chevy]

Did you check the compression? You might have a flat spot on the cam. Could be the carb also cause I have never had that issue. I have alot of popping, but all my compression is the same...so for me I think it is weak springs on mine. Your I am not sure. Tomorrow I'll give a friend of mine a call and see what he thinks....He's a 6 cylinder builder and racer. I think it might be a broken piston ring...but I haven't a clue on what clattering is! I feel stupid not knowing! But i'll call and get some info for ya and see if I can help.

[Sharps40]

Given the clatter I think its one of a few issues related to the top end. Wiped cam lobe, bent pushrod, burnt/loose/broken rocker arm or stud, bad valve, etc. Don't know. No sense in unbuttoning it at home as anything other than rockers is pretty much a pro shop job anyway. Might as well let a pro listen to it and advise.

Hadn't thought of piston ring....we'll see, towing tomorrow pm I hope. GoodWife making the arrangements.

[TJ's Chevy]

Hope your able to get it fixed and hopefully is a simple issue! I'll be hoping for ya!

[Sharps40]

Well, its usually a $4.50 or less part that causes destruction....rocker arms, lifters grindin instead of turnin, various studs, piston pin/keepers, ring like ya said, etc. Who knows? Pretty much depends on where the broken part is burried and how much damage is being/been done.

I don't have the time for diagnosis and loud pots and pans clanging is a great sign that something hard is well and thoroughly broken! HA!! No crap there!

We'll see what the shop has to say. Dad called, told him Sorry, we havta to go hunt at the end of the month in a modern vehicle...he said, no worries, lemmie know whatcha need to get John Lee up an running strong again, I'll mail a check in the morning.

Gotta love Dads. Told him to hang onto his money till we see what it is and focus instead on drinkin good Bourbon and knockin some deer over DRT (Dead Right There).

He's like....Cool, that's the plan, we hunt, John Lee gets evaluated while we are out.

[TJ's Chevy]

Sounds like a great plan!

[Jeff La]

Sounds like an excellent plan

[shok]

Any chance you dropped something down the intake while changing the carb gasket?

[Sharps40]

No nothing like that. If I had to guess (age of the motor, 19 year sit after overhaul, etc) I'd hope for broken valve spring. But, it could be anything. It was a very sudden loss of power and commencement of clattering. I'll know in a day or so after we get it over to the shop.

[aggie91]

Sad to hear about John Lee, you where on a good run with the updates/changes you where making. Depending on how bad it is, does this change your plans for the 5 speed install?

[Low Elco]

Sad to hear, I hope it's easy fixable and JL is back in bidness soon.

[Sharps40]

If its more than head work, i.e. if it requires going deep into the motor....a new Jasper or ATK 250 I6 with the weber/hei and I'll have the shop install the 5 speed behind it with a new made Driveshaft Specialist shaft at the same time. We might have to cam it slightly at that time too, a new comp cams or similar perhaps. Get it all together and broke in by Christmas. I really don't want JAFSB! Would love to do it myself but its a time trade off....need my daily driver on the road ASAP so I'll stick to PMCS and Tuning. Leave the heavy work for the shop since it'll be more than a long weekend of down time.

[TJ's Chevy]

Hope it works out!

[K98AL]

Best wishes for you and John Lee Jr.

[Sharps40]

Yep, talkin to the shop manager tonight....prolly get it into the engine fella this week for a good look see.

[TJ's Chevy]

Hope it works out for ya!

[Sharps40]

It'll be fine. Initial thoughts are collapsed lifter (s) but with the radical loss of power they are not sure. It gets towed to the shop today. Can't drive it. The mile home on flat ground was accomplished smoking the clutch in first at about 3000 rpm. And it was a chancey thing with all that. No pull left in his motor at all and with the clatter, who can say without a tear down. Should know by the weekend or early next week.

[bj383ss]

Sorry to hear about John Lee. Got my fingers crossed for you.

I had a cam go flat in my 79' Caprice. It was a high lift cam so I didn't figure out what was wrong with it right away. 8 lobes went completely flat on it. I finally figured it out by turning the engine over by hand with the valve covers off. Cylinders 6,7, and 8 the valves didn't move at all. So I put a new cam in, it broke it in, and then the oil pressure dropped to 0. She is sitting in the garage awaiting diagnosis on that one.

I'm positive it was caused by the lack of ZDDP which I didn't know about.

Bret

[Old Bleu]

Sorry to hear about your engine problems. Hope they get that Rocket I6 purring again without a big expense. We're all waiting on your T5 install. Mine is sitting on the lift about to have the old tranny pulled out.

[Sharps40]

Old Blu...very groovey koolski....take pics! Post pics!

I talked with the shop....if we have to unbutton the motor too far we may evaluate reengining the fleet with a Jasper or ATK 250. If that's the case, shop will be installing the Astro T5 and a Driveshaft Specialist shaft at the same time.

No sense putting a new motor on an old Peanut...kinda like takein a shower an sliden them 10 day old 100 degree hot out dirty striped undies back on! Too much crust!

But for now we'll see....melling lifters are $4.50 each.....rockers are $3.50 each, push rods at $3ish each and a spankin new Melling factory grind cam is $58. So, even if the cam is toasted, a whole new valve train aint' too bad. But we'll see....might simply be simple, might simply be a big damn mess! But I ain't gettn skinned knuckles this time. I'm goin huntin while they evaluate and fix it.

[aggie91]

Sometimes its best to let the profesionals take care of it for you. Just relax and get some of those deer DRT.

[Sharps40]

Dropped valve, bent rod. Continuing assessment but looks like this block is in poor shape considering.

[TJ's Chevy]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

Dropped valve, bent rod. Continuing assessment but looks like this block is in poor shape considering.

Shoot man! Did it screw up the piston and groove up the sides of the block? That's terrible. Sorry to hear that. Are you gonna restore another 6? Sorry about the bad news! If you were closer I would sell you my 292 outta my 64! But, that would cost you a fortune to get it there! Is there any reason why it happened so suddenly?

[Sharps40]

I'll get a look at the Rocket later. My guess is the cylinder is scarred given the jar fulla steel balls noises!

Our guess about what happened? Prolly come combination of reutilization of parts during the rebuild. Its normal to reuse things like keepers, valves, rocker arms, cams, etc. And on an old motor, reuse of high mileage parts compounds the problems of an already 40 + year old piece of metal. And, if it was a home rebuild/small shop rebuild, prolly no magnaflux/die penetratant tests to weed out obviously defective stuff. It happens.

I've had two economy rebuilt engines, this on and a Flat Head Dodge 217, both failed.

Time for a crate motor with warranty I think....250 L6 for sure!

[TJ's Chevy]

I didn't know you could get a crate motor! Crap! I should get a crate motor 292 and be done! HAHA!!!