Thoughts on Gen 5 Vintage Air Install

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by 68 C10 Driver

The only mod I did to ensure the fit of the under dash unit was to remove the 2 heater box end pieces and modify the the left side of the main heater box unit by closing off that end and welding on two of the hose fittings. Hard to explain, so here is a pic of the finished product.

Nice job! The heater box and cables take up a lot less space than an aftermarket in-dash unit. And you don't have coolant hoses running into the cabin. But V/A changed that with their latest units and caught up with Old Air.

I'm pretty much locked into an in-dash unit because I cut dashboard holes for the factory vents.

[Extended Power]

I have the gen IV Vintage Air “Sure Fit” kit for a factory non-ac truck.
I installed the heater control lever adapters, and then found an absolutely SMOKIN deal on a Dakota Digital DCC-4000 controller kit.

Without welding anything on my dash...how can I install this controller in the stock heater controller spot?

So far, I’ve thought about gutting the factory control unit, and making a new front for it that would have the new controller on it.

Any other ideas?

[Jason Banks]

If you feel like you could gut a factory one and make it work. You may be able to take this 'weld in' panel and make it bolt in?

https://www.vannattafabrication.com/...ols-p297242213

[Extended Power]

Originally Posted by Jason Banks

If you feel like you could gut a factory one and make it work. You may be able to take this 'weld in' panel and make it bolt in?

https://www.vannattafabrication.com/...ols-p297242213

I seen that one, but I don’t want to mess the paint up inside the truck.

[Jason Banks]

I knew I had seen another one:

https://azproperformance.com/collect...ezel-67-72-c10

[A1971Blazer]

A little different set up on my '67 but I'm liking the idea of having AC..
With the LS1 swap I was able to use the low mount compressor bracket and keep all the hoses down low.
I used reduced barrier hoses and some hard line to plumb it all in. The heater flow control valve is somewhat hidden under the return heater hose.
My center vent also has one hose but it seems to blow straight outward.
I also used the VA control. Center vent temp is about 40° on high.
Very happy with the unit.

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by A1971Blazer

A little different set up on my '67 but I'm liking the idea of having AC..
With the LS1 swap I was able to use the low mount compressor bracket and keep all the hoses down low.
I used reduced barrier hoses and some hard line to plumb it all in. The heater flow control valve is somewhat hidden under the return heater hose.
My center vent also has one hose but it seems to blow straight outward.
I also used the VA control. Center vent temp is about 40° on high.
Very happy with the unit.
Attachment 2311192

I really like how all of your hoses are parallel to each other. I was unable to do that because of the way they had the compressor-end connector clocked on the hose that came with the kit.

[A1971Blazer]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

I really like how all of your hoses are parallel to each other. I was unable to do that because of the way they had the compressor-end connector clocked on the hose that came with the kit.

Thanks
having the compressor down low really helped with that, of course none of the hoses or fittings that came with the kit worked for my setup.
I had to make up a hard line from the compressor to the suction port then a rubber hose on up to the evaporator connection.
On the other end, I shortened the hard line from the condenser so the high pressure port would be just barely out from under the battery tray.
My goal was to make it as neat as possible. you can barely even see the compressor.

[SchmidtM]

On a separate note, I see you have an L31? What made you go carb and not stay electronic? I plan on staying with mine as is and try deleting as much emissions as possible.

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by SchmidtM

On a separate note, I see you have an L31? What made you go carb and not stay electronic? I plan on staying with mine as is and try deleting as much emissions as possible.

I do have an l31. I have a Holley Sniper on it. I wanted to avoid having a PCM box that had to be mounted somewhere. The Sniper has a bunch of obnoxious cabling and giant connectors, but I managed to hide them reasonably well.

[pjmoreland]

Here's a photo of the Sniper

[Accelo]

It's an unbelievable amount of work to clean up an engine bay. One really has to attempt it to appreciate the work and planning that goes into it.
The results are outstanding, good work.
Cheers.

[SchmidtM]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

Here's a photo of the Sniper

I would love to go with the sniper, I was looking at it until I found it would run close to 2k.

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by SchmidtM

I would love to go with the sniper, I was looking at it until I found it would run close to 2k.

I got one of these refurbished units.

https://www.holley.com/products/fuel...bished_sniper/

[SchmidtM]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

I got one of these refurbished units.

https://www.holley.com/products/fuel...bished_sniper/

Hummmm, That pricing may be a total game changer for me. What manifold did you go with? Also do you mind telling me about your wiring choice and what emissions you did away with? Did you use a 4l60?

[Accelo]

Lots of people have trouble with the Sniper. Typically not the units fault. So a lot of them are returned. Sometimes you have to be persistent to solve the issues. The last one I worked on ran fine but would not idle consistently. Could easily been attributed to the Sniper. It turned out the vacuum advance was to lazy for the camshaft installed in the motor and it was changing the timing. I have also ran into ignition interference with the wiring it they are too close together.
I would purchased returned/refurbished Sniper, if it was guaranteed, with any second thoughts.

[MikeB]

I'm looking to go with EFI. My old 1406 Edelbrock carb works perfectly on the road, but it acts like the float bowls are empty when I try to start it after the truck has sat for an hour or so. I think I'll start a new thread asking for throttle body EFI recommendations. Coming to this forum soon!

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by SchmidtM

Hummmm, That pricing may be a total game changer for me. What manifold did you go with? Also do you mind telling me about your wiring choice and what emissions you did away with? Did you use a 4l60?

I read that the Sniper doesn't like dual-plane manifolds that have a full division bar between the two sides of the engine, so I went with an Edelbrock Performer RPM Air Gap because it has a notch cut in the division bar. If you have a manifold with a division bar, you could probably just cut it down.

I did have an issue with the Sniper initially where it would cut out randomly while driving. That was fixed by installing MSI Super Conductor spark plug wires.

I also had an issue where the secondaries were getting stuck slightly open, which caused high idle randomly. That was solved by realigning the butterflies and by putting an additional turn on the secondary return spring.

The stock throttle arm on the Sniper makes for a very touchy throttle. I installed a throttle extension arm they sell, and it made a huge improvement.

I did go with the HyperSpark distributor that allows the Sniper to control timing. This is not a required feature though.

California doesn't do emissions tests on model years 1975 and older, so my truck has no emissions equipment other than a PCV valve.

Initially, I had a 700R4 in my truck when I installed the Sniper. Now I have a manual transmission. Neither one required anything from the Sniper.

Holley came out with a new version of the Sniper recently that supposedly is less sensitive to electrical noise. Also, if I remember correctly, they condensed the wiring into fewer connectors. There is an add-on module for the Sniper 2 that can control a 4L60E.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lr1dejYaPRM

[weq92f]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

...<snip>...
Holley came out with a new version of the Sniper recently that supposedly is less sensitive to electrical noise. Also, if I remember correctly, they condensed the wiring into fewer connectors. There is an add-on module for the Sniper 2 that can control a 4L60E.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lr1dejYaPRM

.

That new sniper version, as I understand it, incorporates design/engineering scavenged from the MSD Atomic (version 1) that was built by MSD before being acquired by Holley. Holley now markets the sniper (version 2) and both the MSD Atomic ( version 1 ) and the newer version 2 of the Atomic which, as I understand it, is also a hybrid between the two different EFI kits.

MSD's product, the Atomic version 1 is a very reliable unit and is still available for purchase new at the 1500-1800 dollar price point depending on whether you purchase the fuel system.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-2900 -- full kit

I have put around 10k miles on this system with very little trouble. All my worries revolved around bad IAC modules. Once I found a good one (rockauto) and got the blades adjusted correctly for my engine, it's been perfect.

Hth,

-klb

[Extended Power]

Lol, reading the instructions for install...I gotta go back a few steps and remove the AC box AGAIN. (Major pita when doing stuff yourself)
Have to install a temperature sensor in the box, but on the side facing the firewall.
I’m gonna ask the wife to help...hope she can spare 5-10 minutes.

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by Extended Power

Lol, reading the instructions for install...I gotta go back a few steps and remove the AC box AGAIN. (Major pita when doing stuff yourself)
Have to install a temperature sensor in the box, but on the side facing the firewall.
I’m gonna ask the wife to help...hope she can spare 5-10 minutes.

I had a heck of a time getting that A/C box under my dash.

I don't remember having to install a temperature sensor. I just read through the instructions, and I can't find it in there.

[Extended Power]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

I had a heck of a time getting that A/C box under my dash.

I don't remember having to install a temperature sensor. I just read through the instructions, and I can't find it in there.

I found a Dakota Digital DCC-4000, brand new, in the box, for $250 Canadian.
Guy just said he had been trying to sell it for 6 months with no interest at all.

So yeah...I already had the adaptors on the stock heater control levers, and was ready to install it when I found the controller on market place.

Wow! Update! Glad I looked at the pictures again in the instruction pamphlet.
The hole which I thought had to go on the backside of the heater box, has to go on the frontside! So, crisis averted!!

[Extended Power]

Another tip for anyone installing a Vintage Air system...
If you are planning on installing a set of front rad support panels, you will have to mount the Vintage Air dryer can an inch or so lower, and modify the aluminum lines to line up again.

Once again...one step forward, two steps back.

[UniqueOdyssey68]

Good thread! I haven't bought the vintage air system, not at that stage yet, but was looking for templates for the firewall cover. Was thinking about drilling holes prepping firewall for it so it's ready when I do buy. Contacted Vintage air, they do not offer any templates, not even downloadable printable The new Gen 5 firewall cover is part number 648215 for almost $80! Ugh!
This is the part that's tough when you don't have $2k+ to buy it now just to have it sit on the shelf for months until the project is ready for it to be installed..

['68OrangeSunshine]

Originally Posted by UniqueOdyssey68

This is the part that's tough when you don't have $2k+ to buy it now just to have it sit on the shelf for months until the project is ready for it to be installed..

The biggest problem with buying an assembly or part in advance to leave it on the shelf for months [or years] is that the warranty starts ticking the minute you buy it... By the time you get to that phase of the project, it's out-of-warranty.
So even if the factory screwed up, you ate it anyway.