S10 Frame Swap w/ AD and LS motor

[tlorber]

Well, I didn't get a whole lot done on the truck last week because of this...

We then got back to Los Angeles to rain. However, over the weekend I was able to weld the baseplate onto my steering column, thanks once again to Old Sarge's thread.



I am also working on how to pickup around 4" on each side of the inner fenders. I have cut the inner fender here, and I hope that with some hammer and dolly work, and then subsequent filler pieces I can preserve as much of the inner fender as possible.

[tlorber]

I got some work done on one of the inner fenders over the weekend-you can see the weld scar on the left side. It still has more to be done on it, but the contour came out exactly as I wanted (so far). This should give me adequate room on the passenger's side. Before I started, the inner fender was touching the header. I plan on doing the same on the driver's side.



I probably have 8 hours into just the one side at this point. I am going to wait on the remaining hole up front until I know how the AC compressor will fit in. That is way down the road.

[99 to Life]

nice job. crazy how much time gets eaten up but little things that most people don't notice.

[tlorber]

Originally Posted by 99 to Life

nice job. crazy how much time gets eaten up but little things that most people don't notice.

No kidding.
But we are all doing this for the love of the journey, no?

[waid302]

Looks very nice!

[tlorber]

Ok so, I've gotten a few things done in the past month. I smoothed out my inner fenders after recontouring , though I still need some filler pieces once I figure out where the AC compressor will sit.





I also got my cab dolly finished. I was shocked that the holes actually lined right up with the cab's. I still want to weld on some outriggers so that I can tip it either forward or sideways to work on the different sides.



Then I started working on the bed floor. The fender tubs will be cut off and I will need to find some material to fill the resulting spaces.



The bed will be shortened by about 5-6" in order to fit.

[99 to Life]

yah know, its funny how people get so pumped on other peoples cab dollies. I must say yours is beast mode. Keep it going.

[tlorber]

Yeah, the only reason it is that beefy is that I got a cart from a client who sold his business (wood shutter manufacturer) and he gave me the cart. I had to do some cutting and welding, but it works. Definitely overkill for this application.

[Green Valley Lawn]

I will be watching your progress Im still debating on the LS1 swap.

[tlorber]

I got a couple things done on the bed this weekend. I cut and sectioned the bed bottom (using the original S10 metal), and I welded the new front bed supports to the frame by using 2"x2" metal tubing. I still need to do some grinding and smoothing to the bed bottom, and then cut the width down to around 49" wide.





Finished length on the bed will be 82 1/2" long. This will require me taking about 7 1/2" out of my bedsides and running boards (originally a 3/4 ton longbed).

[05snopro440]

Originally Posted by tlorber

I got a couple things done on the bed this weekend. I cut and sectioned the bed bottom (using the original S10 metal), and I welded the new front bed supports to the frame by using 2"x2" metal tubing. I still need to do some grinding and smoothing to the bed bottom, and then cut the width down to around 49" wide.

Attachment 1365367

Attachment 1365368

Finished length on the bed will be 82 1/2" long. This will require me taking about 7 1/2" out of my bedsides and running boards (originally a 3/4 ton longbed).

That's interesting. I took 9-1/2" out of my longbed on my '46 to make it into a shortbed. I guess they're just lining up different.

[tlorber]

Mine will not really be a shortbed when it is finished since the S10 started out as a standard cab long bed. You may have started with a standard bed. What was your finished bed length?

[05snopro440]

Originally Posted by tlorber

Mine will not really be a shortbed when it is finished since the S10 started out as a standard cab long bed. You may have started with a standard bed. What was your finished bed length?

The regular cab longbox S-10 is almost the same wheelbase as the regular cab shortbox early truck. That's what I used, and it's the 4th swap we've done that way. The first of which was a regular cab shortbox AD. My finished bed length was the same as a shortbox (within a half inch or so, I believe). I'm assuming you're just placing your wheels differently in the wheel wells.

[tlorber]

I haven't yet determined whether I need to reposition the fenders relative the the wheels. The measurements I've taken from the centerline of the wheels to the rear of the bed are within 1/2" of eachother for the S10 and the '54 bedsides. I will be sectioning the bedsides in front of the wheels, and I'm hoping I don't need to lengthen or shorten the bedsides behind the fenders in order for them to be centered.

[05snopro440]

Originally Posted by tlorber

I haven't yet determined whether I need to reposition the fenders relative the the wheels. The measurements I've taken from the centerline of the wheels to the rear of the bed are within 1/2" of eachother for the S10 and the '54 bedsides. I will be sectioning the bedsides in front of the wheels, and I'm hoping I don't need to lengthen or shorten the bedsides behind the fenders in order for them to be centered.

On what are you basing your measurements then? Sorry, I'm just curious, and trying to understand what you're basing your shortening measurements and box placement on. My shortening was based on where I wanted the wheels to end up within the fenders. Very easy.

[tlorber]

I put the '54 cab onto the S10 frame. I left about 5/8" behind the cab for the gap, which is where my S10 bed bottom now ends (i.e. where the new bed front will be located). This determined how much of the S10 bed would be sectioned out (roughly 5 1/2") leaving me 82 1/2" total bed length". Now I just have to section my bed sides to match what I have sitting on the truck, assuming the fenders line up as I stated above.

So in other words, the S10 bed bottom essentially stays where it originally was (i.e. cross members bolt to the chassis as they used to, except for the front one which is now relocated). With the rear of my bedsides aligned with the S10 rear cross sill, the fenders APPEAR to be properly centered, but I will need to bolt them back onto the bedside and mock them up to verify. I hope that all makes sense.

[05snopro440]

Originally Posted by tlorber

I put the '54 cab onto the S10 frame. I left about 5/8" behind the cab for the gap, which is where my S10 bed bottom now ends (i.e. where the new bed front will be located). This determined how much of the S10 bed would be sectioned out (roughly 5 1/2") leaving me 82 1/2" total bed length". Now I just have to section my bed sides to match what I have sitting on the truck, assuming the fenders line up as I stated above.

So in other words, the S10 bed bottom essentially stays where it originally was (i.e. cross members bolt to the chassis as they used to, except for the front one which is now relocated). With the rear of my bedsides aligned with the S10 rear cross sill, the fenders APPEAR to be properly centered, but I will need to bolt them back onto the bedside and mock them up to verify. I hope that all makes sense.

I think I understand now, and I hope I'm wrong but I think you're in for some heartache doing it that way. If my comments are off base you can ignore I'm just trying to help.

You might want to check out the following two documents.

Page 4 of this one: S-10 Vehicle Information Pack
Page 60 of this one: 1954 Restoration Pack

I hope the measurements of both bed length and the distance from the center of the wheels to the back of the bed help make this more clear. You're trying to match the floor of a bed that's 80" long with 45.6" behind the wheel centers with the sides of a bed that need to end up somewhere near 78" long with 42" behind the wheel centers.

All of these swaps that I've seen need to have the rear of the framerails bobbed, and it seems like you haven't done that. As a result I think things aren't going to line up correctly for you. What we did was figure out where we wanted the wheel center in the fender, then find the measurement from there to where the front of the bed needs to be. Once you know that, the difference between that and your original bed measurement is how much you need to shorten it, then you'll also be able to figure out how much you need to bob the framerails and in your case the rear of the bed floor.

[tlorber]

Snopro,
The pic below shows how the bedside aligns with the wheel when the rear is aligned with the rear cross sill. The middle stake pocket is just off of the centerline of the wheel. The S10 bed has 43.5" between the wheel centerline and the rear cross sill, while the '54 bedside has 43".



Hopefully this does not put the wheel too far in the front of the fender. If so, my worst case would be to cut and lengthen the bedsides behind the rear fender, and shift everything from that point toward the front. Not a huge deal since I'll have the material from when I shorten the front of the bedsides, but still something I'd rather not have to do-there are plenty of other projects that are consuming my time.

[chuckmc8]

I really like the idea of using the S10 floor. I plan to haul whatever I want in mine (i.e. greasy truck parts) so I want to steer clear of the beautiful wood furniture boards in my AD.
Im looking forward to how your's pans out. Thanks for posting the pics and info.

[tlorber]

I got one bedside on just to mockup its location-I still need to cut about 8" off the front of it and then splice, but the rear wheel looks to be in a pretty good location. Once I get the bed into final position and get some weight back on the truck, I'm figuring the suspension will drop another 1.5"-2".



Chuck, I wanted the metal bed for the same reasons as you. I actually got the Idea from BlueJeep, who has a more detailed writeup on the process. He has a couple postings on this thread, so you can find his build thread if you want. Mine won't be exactly the way he did it, but I think all of these are different and require some adaptation.

[05snopro440]

Originally Posted by tlorber

I got one bedside on just to mockup its location-I still need to cut about 8" off the front of it and then splice, but the rear wheel looks to be in a pretty good location. Once I get the bed into final position and get some weight back on the truck, I'm figuring the suspension will drop another 1.5"-2".

Attachment 1368144

Chuck, I wanted the metal bed for the same reasons as you. I actually got the Idea from BlueJeep, who has a more detailed writeup on the process. He has a couple postings on this thread, so you can find his build thread if you want. Mine won't be exactly the way he did it, but I think all of these are different and require some adaptation.

Looks good!

[tlorber]

I got some time to work on the truck last night. I filled about 60% of the firewall holes (what a PITA, and still plenty more to do), got the fuel pipe filler panel in, and I was able to cut a section of my bedside out. The cut came out real clean-I just have to weld it together and get then get the other side done.

[tlorber]

Not directly truck related, but I got a little practice on the English wheel this weekend. My son has a school project to make some medieval artifacts, so one of the things we are making is a shield out of some aluminum I had in the shop.









It still has a ways to go, but it was fun using the wheel to smooth out the metal.

[99 to Life]

thats cool man, always nice having some family projects like this. I am dying to get a wheel amongst other tools and find the time to get working on some random fun stuff like this.

[tlorber]

I got the wheel on Craigslist. Finding the wheel was easy-finding the time...not so much.

I did get one of my bedsides grafted back together after sectioning it. I still have some grinding, holes to fill and some dinging to do-then on to the other side.