57 Chevy Wagon - Californa Dreamin'

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by swamp rat

You sir are are much braver.. strike that... much more talented than I. I await with anticipation to see the results!

Thanks, Mike, but sometimes perseverance outweighs talent. You just have to resolve to fix what you screw up.

So today, after sitting down and reading the instructions a couple more times, taking some measurements of the hinge and doing a considerable amount of pondering, I decided to follow the theory that "less is more" and reduce the size of the piece to be cut out. Figured it would be easier to remove more metal than weld it back in. Between the cutoff wheel and the mini air saw, I was finally able to remove the section I'd taped off. I knew from the get go that the wheel well would probably be in the way... and it was. To reach the area that needed to be cut out, I had to take off the tire and wheel as well as the BelAir quarter panel trim. Nasty work trimming the wheel well. It has a heavy layer of undercoating material that really stinks when you burn thru it with the cutoff wheel.

After some additional trimming, I was finally able to fit the hinge in from the back side and mock it up more or less where it needs to be. It looks like it will swing level and stay clear of the quarter. At this point, I need to tack it in place and make a dummy door panel to verify the clearance.

We're definitely swimming in the deep end of the pool now!

[Vic1947]

Rest of the photos...

[Ol Blue K20]

Scary stuff..... to me anyway.

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by Ol Blue K20

Scary stuff..... to me anyway.

I agree, Dale. When this much cutting and welding is involved, you reach a point where it absolutely has to work because there's no going back.

Today I ticky-tack welded the hinge box into place so I could perform the recommended "fake door test". As I feared, installing the hinge dead level isn't the hot tip. The door edge would clear the quarter panel, but not the lower trim piece. It did have plenty of clearance past the upper stainless trim, though. I'll have to follow the advanced leveling procedure and tilt the hinge pin backward at the top and inward the same amount. Since everything is barely tacked in place, it will be easy to break it all loose and start over. Tomorrow...

[Ol Blue K20]

Getting to fit will be your reward!!! I have yella streak, soo normal open works for this coward. LOL

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by Ol Blue K20

Getting to fit will be your reward!!! I have yella streak, soo normal open works for this coward. LOL

I think I'm getting closer, Dale. Tilted the hinge box in and back about 5 degrees and tacked it in place. It looks weird, but it swings level and clears the lower stainless trim a lot better than before. I posted a video below...

Suicide door hinge - YouTube

[bevis1]

This is seriously stretching my geometry and imagination. Gonna have to go lay down for awhile! Maybe a cold malt beverage.

[knomadd]

Well, you've gone well past my comfort level... Looks like you're getting a good handle on it though. I'm curious how it will work out with that hinge... My brain hurts trying to follow the explanation of changing angles and how that would work. Thanks for the video, it helped a lot.

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by bevis1

This is seriously stretching my geometry and imagination. Gonna have to go lay down for awhile! Maybe a cold malt beverage.

Me too, Rickster. I kept looking at it and it seemed totally wrong until I put the fake door panel on it. Even though the hinge looks goofy, it swings nice and level. Wish you were here, not that I need an excuse for a cold malt beverage.

Originally Posted by knomadd

Well, you've gone well past my comfort level... Looks like you're getting a good handle on it though. I'm curious how it will work out with that hinge... My brain hurts trying to follow the explanation of changing angles and how that would work. Thanks for the video, it helped a lot.

Hey, Duane, I'm usually of the opinion that I can fix most anything I screw up, but this is uncharted territory for me too. I'm trying to document it as best I can so as to encourage the other crazies lurking out there.

Since the fake door test went okay, I marked the cut lines on the hinge box and sliced all the excess off. Mocked it up to see if it all looked okay and then realized I'd forgotten to close up the back of the hinge box that faces the wheel well. Removed it and tacked on some sheetmetal and will primer and partially paint it before I weld out the front. I'll probably put an additional shield in using the front edge of the old wheel well as a splash guard, but I doubt I'll be driving it in the mud very much.

[Advanced Design]

Excellent work!

[mongocanfly]

is this gonna be a single hinge door?.....

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by Advanced Design

Excellent work!

Thanks, Doug.

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

is this gonna be a single hinge door?.....

Yes it is, Greg. The folks as Scissor Doors claim it will support 6000# without deflecting. Of course the surrounding sheetmetal would have buckled and collapsed by then, but on its own, it's plenty stout to support the door.

[mongocanfly]

nice!!!...it does look like extreme duty...

[cornerstone]

Hey Vic,

Is it your plan to remove the B pillar from the body and morph it to the rear door? Have you ever seen a suicide door wagon or are you the pioneer? Thanks for all the little details you cover in your thread. I learn more from yours than most other threads.

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by cornerstone

Hey Vic,

Is it your plan to remove the B pillar from the body and morph it to the rear door? Have you ever seen a suicide door wagon or are you the pioneer? Thanks for all the little details you cover in your thread. I learn more from yours than most other threads.

I find it very beneficial to share... lots of times I'm saved by someone who's been down the road I'm headed. However, for this build I searched high and low for any posts with how-to descriptions or photos but to no avail. I did see one picture of a 4dr hardtop that looked like it had been nicely done, but no closeup to see how it worked. So I'm sorta pioneering, I guess. The shop that makes the hinge has been pretty good about responding to my text messages, but they mostly say, "Looks good, tack it and see if it works."

The B pillar stays like it is, but after I remove the rear door hinges, I'll have to plate over the recesses and transfer the striker plate from the left rear door to the rear of the B pillar on the right side.

Phase one is getting the hinge in place to where it will open reasonably level and clear the quarter panel and trim. That's where I am right now. I've been tacking it in place to make it sturdy enough for phase two which will be fitting and welding the plate that mates to the hinge into the back of the door. I will then unbolt the mating plate from the hinge, swing open the door and remove the front hinges. That will be the moment of truth. With the stock hinges removed and the door bolted back onto the hinge, I'll see how it looks and operates.

Phase three and four will be cutting out the door handles, swapping sides and moving them to the front of the door to mimic the mid-60's Lincoln Continentals. I'll also transfer the stock latches and make them work with the original striker plates. If that doesn't go well, one of the guys on the tri-five forum has offered to sell me a pair of Bear Claw latches he had leftover from a 34 Ford project. But that presents other challenges as well.

I'd be further along, but I had to make an unplanned trip to O'Fallon, IL yesterday to work on Crusty. The consignment shop used a jump box to get it started which somehow killed the Optima battery and fried one of the Viair compressor relays. They did all this in front of a buyer whose wife then convinced him to take a pass on the truck. Very frustrating. But I got it all fixed and good as new. My butt is still wore out from all the driving, though.

[cornerstone]

Originally Posted by Vic1947

They did all this in front of a buyer whose wife then convinced him to take a pass on the truck. Very frustrating. But I got it all fixed and good as new. My butt is still wore out from all the driving, though.

"Very frustrating"? That may well be the understatement of the year...If it were me I'd need bail money...
After an 8 hour drive, another $200.+ optima battery, an unnecessary repair, and a lost sale... I'd like to think that I could be that calm about it.

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by cornerstone

"Very frustrating"? That may well be the understatement of the year...If it were me I'd need bail money...
After an 8 hour drive, another $200.+ optima battery, an unnecessary repair, and a lost sale... I'd like to think that I could be that calm about it.

Well, the actual damage happened a couple of weeks ago, but it's taken this long to gather parts and find a day when the weather wasn't interfering. So I've had some time to simmer down. I was pretty blown up initially, but dwelling on it usually doesn't help. When you outsource something you should be doing yourself, there's always the chance results won't match expectations. We've all been there. Me more than I'd like to admit.

[Vic1947]

The passenger side hinge box is in it's final resting place... or at least I really hope so. By welding in patches and sealing the edges with RTV, I've made a big commitment. I haven't completely finished welding and grinding, but just cutting all the spot welds to reposition the hinge would be a huge task. I also added a gusset that connects the side of the hinge box to the inner wheel well. Since I have no plans for mini-tubs, attaching the gusset to the wheel well made the most sense. The box should be sturdy enough to support the door with welds / patches attaching it to both door jamb walls and the wheel well.

[Vic1947]

The next step is to cut out the area on the door where the angle piece goes that bolts to the hinge. With the door closed up against the new hinge, I made marks where I need to cut for it.

[Ol Blue K20]

I have my fingers crossed for ya Vic

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by Ol Blue K20

I have my fingers crossed for ya Vic

Must have worked, Dale. I've been saving up some photos in anticipation of doing the first test with the door attached to the hinge. But before the reveal, here's what led up to it.

After marking the door for the area to be removed, I used the air saw to make my cuts. Sure looked like a big hole to fill, but I'll need the section that the latch bolts to later on. A little trimming was necessary to fully clear the swing arm and its mating piece. It was immediately obvious that I'd need to splice in some material to get the back edge of the mounting flange up against the inner door panel. I cut some 1018 cold rolled to the size and angle needed to position the flange and tacked it in place. The mating flange was now snug up against the inner door panel and well out of the way of the window channel.

As added insurance for adjustments down the road, I machined a couple of powdered bronze spacers to fit where the bolts pass thru. This takes up the slack and keeps the holes centered during mock up. I also followed the advice of the techs at Scissor Doors and used washers between the swing arm and the mating flange during the mock up procedure. After welding, removing the spacers will give me a small amount of adjustment in the XYZ directions.

[Vic1947]

From here it was just a matter of tacking the flange in place and then piecing in sheetmetal to fill the gaping holes. Welding and grinding has produced surfaces on the door and jamb that will only require a small amount of body filler.

It was now time to see how the door worked, so I bolted it to the hinge swing arm. Good thing I'd used the washers as shims because the door was too far forward. I removed the washers and the lower bolt hole spacer and reinstalled the bolts. Success at last! The door gaps looked pretty decent and the door opened nice and level. At the moment there's a tiny bit of droop (~1/16") at the top front edge of the door frame. I believe the latch will fix that easily, and if not, I can put a thin shim at the hinge to lift it. I'll wait until I have the latch and power window in place to make a decision on that.

My main goal was to check clearances and see how the door swings. All that looks good at this point.

[Vic1947]

And here's how it works...

Suicide Watch - YouTube

[mongocanfly]

nicely done Vic.....

[Ol Blue K20]

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

nicely done Vic.....

I concurwith mongo. It's another great job Vic!!!