Make it handle

[robnolimit]

Ackattack glad you made it through all this. Yes, some caster will help. You really should go out and try the autocross at a Goodguys event, it's a bunch of fun. As far as the 'driver mod' I agree 100%. But, I'm not the guy for that thread. I have a tough enough time getting around the coarse myself. It would be nice to get Mary Pozzi or Mike Meyer to chip in, but honestly, there not into trucks to much. Here's a laugh. In Columbus, I was watching one of the vendors run, in a car that I considered to be a 'bad choice' for autocross or short coarse competition. He loves the car, but I thought, still not a great choice. Then, I walked back to our pit area and realized that I built a TRUCK. What a bonehead! Lesson learned. Build whatever turns you on and have some fun.

[danielhaskins336]

Hey rob I was wondering if you will do alignments in your shop?
Posted via Mobile Device

[Ackattack]

I was just looking at ridetech's website and in their complete suspension package: http://www.ridetech.com/store/suspen...0-level-3.html

they include tall spindles. Then, when you click on the "included" tab, it shows standard spindles. I didn't see any more on thier website on the tall spindles for our trucks, but would be interested in learning more.

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by danielhaskins336

Hey rob I was wondering if you will do alignments in your shop?
Posted via Mobile Device

Sure, by appt. We are open sat from 9am to 2pm, that seams to be most convient for alignments.

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by Ackattack

I was just looking at ridetech's website and in their complete suspension package: http://www.ridetech.com/store/suspen...0-level-3.html

they include tall spindles. Then, when you click on the "included" tab, it shows standard spindles. I didn't see any more on thier website on the tall spindles for our trucks, but would be interested in learning more.

Looks like I need to call and rag on Tony (web content isn't his job, but he needs to catch all the crap) The description is somewhat generic, those are 'A' body spindles, not C-10. As far as I know, no body makes a tall spindle for a truck. But i'll keep a lookout at SEMA.

[Ackattack]

Originally Posted by robnolimit

Looks like I need to call and rag on Tony (web content isn't his job, but he needs to catch all the crap) The description is somewhat generic, those are 'A' body spindles, not C-10. As far as I know, no body makes a tall spindle for a truck. But i'll keep a lookout at SEMA.

darn it

[FRENCHBLUE72]

Hey rob I just finished the article street trucks did on you very nicey done.. I have a question about a watts link set up.. Does it matter how long the arm is for the center pivot? I know it should be centered on the rear end but how long(or tall) per say should that center bar be? I hope I explained that right...

[shawnr21]

Man, It only took me a week and a half to read this thread.

Just a thought I've had while reading all this. I think all of Robs recomendations are awesome and maybe a bit modest. I can really appreciate a humble guy, no **** talkin, just go out and prove it on the track. I've been looking for the right rear suspension for my truck for the last few weeks when a friend pointed me to this thread. I ordered a fatbar kit from Rob last week and think he is the type of guy I want to support. He is supporting all of the forum members with all his insider info!!!

Awesome work Rob!!!

Now, I do have another question that I havent seen any talk about. Sorry to derail from the suspension geometry but i'm wondering about rearend differentials. I've read that an eaton posi unit possibly breaking loose on exit and that a truetrack is more suited to accelerating out of the corners. Anyone care to give their opinions on this? Rob, do you mind sharing what your trucks have?

Thanks

[bo-w]

Originally Posted by robnolimit

Ackattack Here's a laugh. In Columbus, I was watching one of the vendors run, in a car that I considered to be a 'bad choice' for autocross or short coarse competition. He loves the car, but I thought, still not a great choice. Then, I walked back to our pit area and realized that I built a TRUCK. What a bonehead! Lesson learned. Build whatever turns you on and have some fun.

Rob You do realize that this is why we are all reading this performance handling thread on a TRUCK forum lol . we are ALL in the same boat here !! thanks again for the amazing insight and tech on this thread

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by bo-w

Rob You do realize that this is why we are all reading this performance handling thread on a TRUCK forum lol . we are ALL in the same boat here !! thanks again for the amazing insight and tech on this thread

Exactly his point..... these are trucks!

[Greywolf200]

Horsepower TV did a program on ProTouring/Autocrossing. The event was at Nashville Speedway. While all of the action shots were various cars, several times they showed a really nice dark green '67 C10 that was on the ground. I guess autocross is getting more popular.

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by FRENCHBLUE72

Hey rob I just finished the article street trucks did on you very nicey done.. I have a question about a watts link set up.. Does it matter how long the arm is for the center pivot? I know it should be centered on the rear end but how long(or tall) per say should that center bar be? I hope I explained that right...

I getcha. The rule on a watts is even and parallel. Usually the center pivit link is 3" to 4" from center pivit to the link mount hole. The two links MUST be the same length. AND, they must be parallel at the point where the center link is centered between them. Hope that was clear?

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by shawnr21

Man, It only took me a week and a half to read this thread.

Just a thought I've had while reading all this. I think all of Robs recomendations are awesome and maybe a bit modest. I can really appreciate a humble guy, no **** talkin, just go out and prove it on the track. I've been looking for the right rear suspension for my truck for the last few weeks when a friend pointed me to this thread. I ordered a fatbar kit from Rob last week and think he is the type of guy I want to support. He is supporting all of the forum members with all his insider info!!!

Awesome work Rob!!!

Now, I do have another question that I havent seen any talk about. Sorry to derail from the suspension geometry but i'm wondering about rearend differentials. I've read that an eaton posi unit possibly breaking loose on exit and that a truetrack is more suited to accelerating out of the corners. Anyone care to give their opinions on this? Rob, do you mind sharing what your trucks have?

Thanks

Thank you all very much. Glad we can help out. The Bullet has a true Track, and I like it, no problems. I have used Lockers and track locks in the past. Tack locks are smooth, but have a 20000 mi. lifespan before needing to be rebuilt. Detroit lockers are great for the drags, but not so smooth on the street/or roadcoarse. - But, D.L.'s are bullitproof. The J.T. has a 'Lockrite', and inexpensive locker. It works pretty good, but it clicks at low speed in parking lots. I'll be in Vegas at SEMA all week, and going to learn about 'Wavelock' and 'Black Gold' diffs. I'll let you know what I find. Check our facebook at www.facebook.com/nolimithotrods We're going to put up live SEMA feeds wed/fri, and Optima feeds on sat.

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by Greywolf200

Horsepower TV did a program on ProTouring/Autocrossing. The event was at Nashville Speedway. While all of the action shots were various cars, several times they showed a really nice dark green '67 C10 that was on the ground. I guess autocross is getting more popular.

Man, I missed it, hope it replays. The green truck is Mark Turner's. we saw it in Texas in the spring. Brian finch helped with the build. Turner has contacted us about a new C-10 chassis for the next truck build - he's got the bug. He also has a bad a$$ vette and camaro. -and he's a really nice guy.

[robnolimit]

The rumor is that the coverage of the RTMC (Run to music City) was a test to find out the interest level. There may be coverage next year of a 9 event series. We'll have to wait and see.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by robnolimit

The rumor is that the coverage of the RTMC (Run to music City) was a test to find out the interest level. There may be coverage next year of a 9 event series. We'll have to wait and see.

Is this silimar to the RTTx events (Run To The Coast, Hills, etc...)? I went to a RTTH event a couple of years ago & really enjoyed it.

[robnolimit]

yes. same thing. We went to RTTC, run to the coast.It was a great event. Autocross, speed/stop, and 2.2mi. roadcoarse. It was cool to see some cars excell in one event over another, and the few cars that could do it all.

[FRENCHBLUE72]

Very clear thanks agian..

[BMERDOC]

Rob asked me to post some pointers about rear thrust angle, toe and camber in my alignment thread. While walking mindlessly with the kids Trick or Treating tonight I thought it may be proper to cut and paste it to his thread too...


Per Rob's request:

I'll try to make this simple. Thrust angle is the relationship between the rear axle and the centerline of the chassis. As I had stated before, Thrust should be zero. If the centerline of the axle is 90* to the centerline of the chassis it will be zero. Just like the front toe, toe out is negative and toe in is positive. If the thrust angle points to the left of the chassis centerline the thrust angle is negative, to the right, positive. This angle is the average of the two rear toe angles which is not to be confused with total toe which is, well, the sum of the two toe angles. If the thrust angle is negative the truck will want to rear steer to the left causing the truck to want to go right. You would have to add constant left hand input causing the "dog tracking" look. Of course, the opposite would be true if the thrust angle were positive.

Camber can have an effect on tracking too. No matter wether its front or rear. Lets stick with rear camber. A vehicle will tend to steer toward the more vertical or positive cambered tire. Lets try a small quiz...if my left rear camber is 0* and my right rear is negative .75* which way would the rear of the car wanna steer?....
....
....
If you said left then you are correct. It would want to rear steer left and you would have to steer left to cancel it out. Both camber angles must closely match so as to not cause a "pull" or "drift".

Caster has NO affect on the rear axle...unless, in the off chance, you have a four wheel steer car. If that was the case it would closely follow the rules of front caster. Although I won't go into 4W steer it did remind me of a good point.

Rear angles have a greater effect on how a vehicle tracks. Anyone who has driven a forklift knows they can be very twitchy.

[Tony@AirRideTech]

Noted about the miss info on the web site.... thanks for busting my balls Rob..

Another note on locking diffs;
I have run a bunch of different brands of lockers on the streets and I can tell you for street driving and getting the best perfornace diff you can... the detroit Tru-Trac is the stuff. If you dont do a tru trac then use the Eaton Pro Posi.

[killerpickup]

Here are a few shots of my project.

[hgs_notes]

This thread should be required reading for anyone that is wrenching on their truck, period. I have 2 questions, first on the spindles. Does he position of the the pin on the spindle change the effects of the caster? Not saying it changes caster, but will a dropped spindle and a stock spindle feel the same at an equal caster setting?

Second, rear track bars have been discussed, and where the front mount should be located in the vertical. What about moving the mounts outboard or inboard? Seems like wider would be more stable.

[hgs_notes]

One more question regarding rear sway bars, why not mount it through the frame rail? I've seen it done for off road and monster truck designs. Just have to use the kind with removable arms and weld in mounts in the frame rail.

[hotrod1]

HGS notes

Go here and look at the 2nd post down.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=412449&page=4

[chevyrestoguy]

I'm really interested in the low-buck caster mod to the lower control arm that was referenced earlier in this thread. Did it ever work?

I am a big believer in caster, and I am ready to do the spindle swap on my '64 (already swapped it over to a '79 suspension). I would really be interested in doing this mod while I've got it apart.