Project: Recycle

[TA_C10]

Just checking in. Any updates?

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[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by TA_C10

Just checking in. Any updates?

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Technically, yes. I've been e-mailing images/info back & forth w/Mr. PB on possibly obtaining some parts before I posted current status. I purchased some narrowed arms today so.....

I'm revising my front Dropmember (v.1 ) so it can utilize coil-overs. BUT, I want it set up similar to how I built the rear half (air springs OR C/O's). It was in mocking everything up & ordering the parts that I scrutinized the track width & came to the conclusion I needed to narrow the front track width slightly before finalizing my templates & fabricating the brackets.

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I already ordered some Delrin bushings, C/O lower mounting brackets, shocks, CPP modular drop spindles, & caliper brackets; plus made an adjustable mock-up shock so I could get an idea on the location of the upper mount.

I pulled one side of the front suspension apart & set things up so upon reassembly it would all be located in the same spot. The OE hub/disc spindle/caliper were replaced w/the CPP modular spindle & a KORE3 billet hub. I've had the truck on spare trailer wheels in the front to allow rolling it around because I moved a bunch of stuff from a storage unit into my shop & they were closer to the expected final tire height for mock-up purposes. I grabbed one of the OG steelies just because I wanted to see it on there again. Glad I did.

With the changes to the rear end (12bolt to narrowed 9") & using spacers to get things (wheels/tires) where the math said they should be it now appears the rear track width is dead even or possibly a little narrower vs. the front. That's a No-No in my book for hot-rods.

So, narrowed arms have now been ordered, the Ridetech a-arms will hit the shelf for another project, & the Ridetech Delrin spec 73-87 style bushings will be returned to Summit.

The initial upper 'bracket'. It's ugly, but it started out just as some taped together pieces of cardboard:

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I then copied it so it was one solid larger piece so I could play around w/the visuals. It was definitely too fat but it was still in the figuring dimensions phase. Then some slimming down....

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Final upper template. Like stated previously, I was waiting to here from PB on obtaining some parts used on their C/O set-up but it seems w/the delays I'll just fab from what I have so far.

The lower bracket is pretty straight forward. You can see the template made (lower a-arm in white) that utilizes the bag mounting points as the centering of the final bracket. I'll need the upper in place to finalize the lower since the C/O will be slightly offset to clear the upper a-arm mounting hardware.

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Ultimately, the plan is the upper C/O bracket is a bolt-on & sandwiches the original upper a-arm mounting bracket (also using it's retaining hardware).

Since material will need to be removed from the upper air spring mount (so the C/O can clear), there will be a plate that can be bolted under the remainder of the mount & will locate a bag where it needs to be (much like bolting the upper bag plate under an OE crossmember) if I ever want to switch back.

The lower C/O mount will also bolt-on to a 'bag' style a-arm. It's just offset as required.

The shocks (coil-overs) are longer than what is typically spec'd for these C10's. I follow the principle often stated by Rob @ No-Limit…. Run the longest shock that you can for the best travel. Conversion kits are limited by the stock suspension geometry & real estate under the hood. Since I have aftermarket stuff & I'm even tweaking that, I'm adding stroke length for the shock in the design. I'll be using a 5" stoke shock which should allow 3" compression/2" extension while not being too invasive. I used that philosophy & similar dimensions on my dually & it worked well.

Final ride height mock-up is very similar to Gringoloco's swb w/the PB C/O front set-up. I feel my set-up has the upper C/O mounting point about 1-2" higher than PB's does thus a slightly longer shock can be used.

[TA_C10]

Nice, you needed to get this out I could tell

I’ve had a few wrenches photobomb me as well. Lol.

I’m in need of cpp modulars too. My fronts stick out way too far creating a nasty offset from rear. This of course with the wheels that came on truck. 275 all the way around and a huge lip. But this will get fixed next go around.

I like your ability to mod and get that much extra shock travel. She’s gonna handle really nice with that setup.

[aggie91]

Nice work Scoti. I like your approach to have the option to do coil overs or bags. One comment, I think you know this, but wanted to point it out so other people could learn something.

See picture. The sharp inside corners of your upper coil over mount bracket is a good place for cracks to start and could lead to failure of the bracket. Make these in to a smooth radius to eliminate that sharp corner to get rid of a place for a crack to start.

Looks good, I hope to see it at C10's in the Park this year...hint, hint...

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by aggie91

Nice work Scoti. I like your approach to have the option to do coil overs or bags. One comment, I think you know this, but wanted to point it out so other people could learn something.

See picture. The sharp inside corners of your upper coil over mount bracket is a good place for cracks to start and could lead to failure of the bracket. Make these in to a smooth radius to eliminate that sharp corner to get rid of a place for a crack to start.

Looks good, I hope to see it at C10's in the Park this year...hint, hint...

You are correct, a sharp edge does promote a possibility for stress failure. To make things better, you need to overbuild the bracket. In this instance, the bracket would be capped in certain areas depending on how it gets built.

You can only do so much when hand cutting brackets. Scribe out reference cut lines on multiple pieces of steel & cut them individually. You'll get 4 different brackets that need to be cleaned up to match. I've found that's harder than it seems (making individual cut pieces match).... I would love to step up my 'game' but can't seem to find someone w/a plasma or laser table that will machine-cut such a small quantity for a 'small' price. That would make a big difference in the brackets. I went through the same struggle in this build when making the shock brackets. It's just difficult to make an engineered looking part when cutting each piece individually by hand & shaping the edges.

[Inverter]

Well well.... someone’s been up at night.
I have some extra PB upper/lower C/O mounts for a level 3. I think they are version 1 DM type but could easily be trimmed.
Why is your rear end narrowed so much ?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by Inverter

Well well.... someone’s been up at night.
I have some extra PB upper/lower C/O mounts for a level 3. I think they are version 1 DM type but could easily be trimmed.
Why is your rear end narrowed so much ?

It's a Lincoln Versailles disc brake housing @ 58" width. The math said a 58" housing would allow ~ 10" wheel w/a 4"bs or a nice deeeep lip. I currently have 1.5" billet adapters on there to utilize the 10" w/5.5"bs steelies w/285/60-16 tires. It has .500" clearance to the un-cut inner bed-side w/the set-up. Ultimately, I'm going for a Nostalgia drag/hot rod look.

Got any pics on those mounts? I took a closer look yesterday & realized I'm beyond my original 1-2" higher dimension stated previously. My final template is about 2-3" higher than the a-arm shaft. Nate & I have been e-mailing back & forth but they're busy & my need is a 1-off deal so it's not exactly a high priority on his end (and I don't expect it to be).

I did order some 1" narrowed a-arms from them over the weekend & I'm waiting to meet w/a guy that was in the shop complex behind my work that's done some fab work for our in-house SS tubing contractors. I spoke w/him & explained what I need & he indicated he might be able to help w/my upper bracket needs. I was hoping to hear from him today (he said Thurs or Fri) but I haven't heard from him yet. With this 'stay in place' order, I sure would like to have what I need so I can make a decent progress push.

[Inverter]

What version is your DM ?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by Inverter

What version is your DM ?

Well.... I'm not sure. I've had it since 06/07 & I don't remember when the updated versions started rolling out. It doesn't utilize the 63-87 C10 lower a-arm shaft so I know it's not one of the earliest versions.

I asked Nate last year if I could get just the upper mount that has the C/O bracket welded to it (on the DM coil-over version) but he said they were not compatible w/my older set-up based off of the pics I sent him. Recently, I reached out again one last time but this time asked if I could get just the specific C/O mounting bracket. That's where we are now trying to determine if he can get what I need but he provided a window of opportunity for his end so I'm pushing forward on mine.

Like stated, It was worth asking but I don't want him doing a bunch of extra work for it to happen. I'm pushing forward on my end & if it works I told him I would follow-up w/what I did in case others reached out to him for something similar.

[Inverter]

Yea... Ive had em make stuff for me n it usually takes a lifetime.
I get it,, cant just interrupt production to make a couple parts..
So the upper hats I have ( that might work for you ) are compatible w/version 1 but the bolt holes on the version 5 or 6 I have look the same. I will get you some pics tonight.. you want me to post here or PM ?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by Inverter

Yea... Ive had em make stuff for me n it usually takes a lifetime.
I get it,, cant just interrupt production to make a couple parts..
So the upper hats I have ( that might work for you ) are compatible w/version 1 but the bolt holes on the version 5 or 6 I have look the same. I will get you some pics tonight.. you want me to post here or PM ?

Here is fine & the gesture appreciated.

[Inverter]

[SCOTI]

Thanks. I'll compare hole locations today.

I did verify on my template today & the C/L for the upper shock mount bolt is 3" above the front stud for the a-arm shaft. That set-up looks like its @ or below the shaft which prob put's it around 1-2 " lower.

[Inverter]

I set these on a bare frame in the shop. All my later gen DM upper hat holes, in that same frame, lined up fine. The C/O mounting eyes are about even with the top flange of the rail. If you’ve already ordered the shocks, these may be too low to get your ride height . I also have a set of Ridetech c/o in a 12.5” mounted height that could work. C/O brands very with their offerings. The shocks dont come in small increments like the coil rates. Going to be critical to get that eye to eye distance between the brackets to match the center stroke and desired R/H.
Its only time and attention 😎

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by Inverter

I set these on a bare frame in the shop. All my later gen DM upper hat holes, in that same frame, lined up fine. The C/O mounting eyes are about even with the top flange of the rail. If you’ve already ordered the shocks, these may be too low to get your ride height . I also have a set of Ridetech c/o in a 12.5” mounted height that could work. C/O brands very with their offerings. The shocks dont come in small increments like the coil rates. Going to be critical to get that eye to eye distance between the brackets to match the center stroke and desired R/H.
Its only time and attention ��

Yes sir & agreed. I made my template targeting the 14.5" ride height dimension provided in Ridetech's C/O shock specs & the truck mocked @ ride height.

Since I need taller aftermarket or modified wheel wells anyway, going higher (within reason) on the upper mounting pivot is possible. Since that's possible, that's the path I'm taking which allows that longer stroke shocks better ride characteristics.

I'm guessing you have a PB C/O set-up that got some updates/changes to have these spares?

[Inverter]

I sold a version 1 DM few years back. These brackets were changes I was going to make but decided to start clean and free up floor space. Whats strange and amazing is a year after that I came across a Craigs ad for a version 5 extreme, shortened arms, rack, spindles. C/Os, hood hinges.... still mostly in boxes. Oilfield guy.... I gave him 1900 for around 6k worth of new,unused parts. I wont be using the c/o but Im allocating everything else to a Sled Ive been tryin to build for 15 years.... But enough about me. Are you going for a 4” RH ?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by Inverter

I sold a version 1 DM few years back. These brackets were changes I was going to make but decided to start clean and free up floor space. Whats strange and amazing is a year after that I came across a Craigs ad for a version 5 extreme, shortened arms, rack, spindles. C/Os, hood hinges.... still mostly in boxes. Oilfield guy.... I gave him 1900 for around 6k worth of new,unused parts. I wont be using the c/o but Im allocating everything else to a Sled Ive been tryin to build for 15 years.... But enough about me. Are you going for a 4” RH ?

It was 4" w/~27" tires; ~5" with the intended front tires @ 27.7".
Currently have the frame set @ 5" (@ front cab mount). Front x-member is a bit higher. Using CPP Modular spindles & the A-arms are level to the floor.

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I was able to get together w/the steel fab guy after work yesterday. I gave him the final template as well as a graphed template w/the dimensions & he said I should be able to get them today. I told him that would be great so we'll see if it happens that quickly.

To keep pushing forward, I advanced the mock-up status. I used one of the early templates just for the visual perspective....

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The material removed was 4" diameter & will possibly need refining. I want to leave as much of the existing upper mount as possible to support the use of an upper bag plate. It's easy enough to take more off where needed if required.

I have a couple small items to finish preparing for the remainder of the drivers side set-up so that I can decide on possible changes.

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Well.... The guy cutting the brackets was @ his shop from around noon till 6pm yesterday but I never heard from him about the brackets

During the wait, I moved forward for a little more clarification on clearances. I made some templates that simulate the coils OD. I padded the templates by an extra .250" for clearance validation:

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Clearance @ the a-arm cross shaft is about .3125 - .375" w/the bolt @ full length. I'm betting they'll be trimmed down when all is said & done but good to know it clears as is: