87 Chevy Crew Cab 4x4 Converion/Cummins swap

[chevyfreek]

Originally Posted by DieselRat

Had a couple days away, and bought a new car in the past couple weeks of no activity here, BUT I am making good progress.

First up I sold the 54 GMC in my sig and had been looking for a muscle car of sorts. Ended up getting a 72 Duster 340. Not my first color choice but we can change that!



Now back to the project. I got the engine sat in last week and realized it was a little crooked (thats what I get for doing this conversion blind) so I yanked it back out and welded a plate to the passenger side engine stand and that brought it up to level.



Pretty pleased so far with positioning being that I was just measuring off the 4x4 frame as far as mount position and all. Gives me good valve cover to firewall clearance, and should leave me plenty of room for the stock mechanical fan in the front.

Picked up some fuel hardline to re-route my lines, but first I need to figure out how I am hoisting the 250lb trans in by myself! The fuel lines are going to have to come across at the Xmember to hit the ports on the driverside of the engine.

Also started to dissect my wiring to figure out what is what. Pretty basic for the Cummins, just need to get some different senders for oil/water as well as some reducer fittings. I'm at the point where this could all come together quickly once I get the ball rolling. Goal is to have the trans in and be able to start it up with the key by the end of the weekend. Well see how that goes!

What, you don't want a slant 6?!?!

[DieselRat]

Originally Posted by chevyfreek

What, you don't want a slant 6?!?!

I see what you did there

Definitely dont want a slant anything!

[Dieselwrencher]

Hopefully it's your injectors. Was it smoking weird? Coughing or sputtering? To be spitting raw fuel out the exhaust it should be spewing nasty smelling bluish/white smoke and make it severely hard to breath around it.

[DieselRat]

That about accurately describes it. It was puking a lot of 'exhaust' not necessarily color distinguishable. It wasnt blue, more on a white but just bad ****, made my eyes burn trying to see anything going on in the engine bay. (granted I only have a downpipe for exhaust)

So my injectors were all bust, popping off to low, or not at all and dribbing. So my guy at the shop scrapped together a good set of used for me to try out, and aside from a couple that didnt seat fully yet, I was still getting some spew out the exhaust manifold, but hopefully thats just residual left over stuff.

Pulled my valve covers and ran it and doesn't seem like anything funny going on with valve seals riding up. So at this point I'm just gonna put it together and get it warm enough to at least burn up whats in the exhaust and see what happens.

So back on track with building even though I'm not confident in it anymore...

Got my clutch hydraulics from TN diesel, got the master installed last night, gona do the slave tonight.

My driveshaft is supposed to be done sometime this week. So my final list for now is:

clutch slave
bleed brakes
install seat
driveshaft
final look over
drive>??

[Dieselwrencher]

Hopefully it is just injectors. Keep in mind if you go to p pump engine, there will be things that will need to be changed to get it all done. Intake placement, throttle, CAC piping. You could just rebuild your engine too if it comes to that.

[DieselRat]

Nothing much would change as far as my swap to do the Ppump setup. I already have everything set to take an hx35 and intake arm for the intercooler setup. Thats the least of my worries after all I've done.


On another note, I thought of something else I changed that may be the issue. I changed the oil!

It had oil in it when i got the engine initially, and I ran it on the garage floor with that oil, and ran it in the truck the first few times with that oil....then I changed it to rotella and did filter etc.

I noticed when I was running it without the turbo and just had my feed line routed to my drain tube that when it was cold it would spew back out, as in it wasnt draining to the pan fast enough. SO maybe that was my issue in that it was flooding the turbo and leaking past the seals and wound up back in my manifold and now I am just fooling with residual oil. Just happened to have bad injectors to throw into the mix. Going to probably redo my drain this week and maybe even put the hx35 on since my stocker is an oil mess at this point.


Got my clutch hydraulics in and working. Brakes are bled. Waiting on a call for the driveshaft. Been holding off on putting in my sound deadener and the seat on the account that I may have to yank the trans and engine again, but I think at this point I'm gonna go ahead and throw it all in there.

[DieselRat]

STILL waiting on a driveshaft. Stopped by yesterday to see what the heck is going on and got told the guy went on vacation this week. Which is what it is, but when your promised a date, I'd at least appreciate a heads up your gone for a week!!!!

So in the meantime I'm just doing little stuff. Couldnt find a shifter anywhere that was at a reasonable price, so I made one. Just a goof around project. I had some black pipe that was close to the dia I needed, so I heated it on my forget and hammered it square to fit over the stub, then turned a knob on my lathe. Temporary til I find a correct shifter for it.

[Dieselwrencher]

Nice handle and knob. That looks great.

[NewType72]

Gotta love the details and lmao to the slant 6

[DieselRat]

Haven't given up on this yet.

3 weeks to the day, I finally bothered the guy enough that he finished my drive shaft. While waiting is not my strong suit it was well worth he, he does quality work. (for any PA guys its Associated Truck Parts in Boyertown PA, Ernie is the guy) Perfect fitment and correct U joint which I was concerned I gathered false info about!

So first drive impression was, this thing sucks. Brakes were pulsing and hardly working, power steering was not even an option. Its slow as a turtle and bouncy as hell. All things I set myself up for HA!

With the hydroboost setup I failed to bleed it fully, and somehow got air back into the system, once I got it bled properly everything worked flawlessly and started to feel like a real truck, now I just need to fix my wobbly tilt column. Its bouncy because I forgot to mention I dont have rear shocks yet I wanted to make sure it settled before I order shocks.

And the slow part I was anticipating, for now.....I wanted to make sure everything worked stock before I went messing with the pump, changing turbos, fuel pin, injectors etc.

And LASTLY my oil problem seems to have gone away. I have no clue what happened or why, but I pulled the downpipe last night and other than some risidual goo, it was dry and just had normal diesel exhaust build up. I almost thing my gasket was restricting the drain back to the pan and it spit up into my manifold and just took a good running temp to burn it all off.

So for right now I'm in test and tune mode until I can afford some more parts.

[bL.A.zer90045]

Great reference!!! Doing a 2wd to 4wd swap on a crew frame for a forum member/freedom fighter.ive done several 4wd-to-2wd square swaps but never 2wd-4wd,would you say it would be about the same,or?

[DieselRat]

Never did it the other way around, but essentially the same I suppose. It certainly helped to have the whole frame to take my measurements from but really not necessary. Probably the worst part will be sourcing the different spring hangers for the swap. For the rear you can shackle flip, which takes care of the rear most. You need to find the front rear hangers. Basically just strike a center line then re attach them. For the front there are a few companies that make the b52 hangers to do the longer spring swap in the front, then you can buy the shackle bushing and shackles from DIy4x or offroad design. The engine stands are the tricky part when you keep stock driveline because everything has to line up! For the cummins it was all custom anyways so that part wasn't 'as crucial'

[DieselRat]

iKnocking out a few more small things. Not sure if I mentioned already how the mechanical fan doesnt fit, If I had mounted the engine an inch further back I woulda been fine, ya well. SO i got one of those 2 speed fans from a 3.7L ford (taurus etc) I mounted that between my radiator and the intercooler. Ran it through an ST-85 relay from NAPA, then to a switch in the cabin that I will likely just leave on as its wired through a key hot switch, unless its really cold out. Finally got my right Coolant sender (not sensor) which I didn't realize until I drove it that my gauge wasn't working. And lastly I ordered a set of rear shocks. So once those come in I think its time to take it for a spin to the inspection station and put some miles on it!

[Chevy3+3]

What about your t-case shifter? What are you going to do there?

By the way did you say you bought 3" Tuff country HD lift springs? Doesn't appear to have sagged much even with the weight of the engine. I bought 2.5" Skyjacker lift springs and they sagged pretty good with the 454 sitting over them. Skyjacker told me they only guarantee the 2.5" lift springs to provide 2" of lift with a big block application. They did exactly 2". I will say my spring packs sit level. No positive or negative arch and they ride fantastic. I want another inch of lift in the front but don't want to effect the ride quality. I'm thinking of installing a set of ORD 1" zero rates on the front.

[DieselRat]

Good eye on the TC shifter. I dont have any of the shifter parts yet, and I also don't have a front driveshaft, so it will stay 2wd til I gather money for a shaft and parts for the TC, and in the meantime I didn't know where I was going to end up with a hole in the floor for the shifter to come through so I just left it all out until that time comes. The truck likely wont see snow driving unless its a family trip or something, I got the jeep for the salt and trash they put on the roads around here!

I talked to offroad design and they didn't care for my idea of going with the 3" springs in front to try and net 2" of lift, and so far its worked out PERFECT. Granted I am sure they will sag as I put some miles on it, but nothing adding an extra leaf or whatever wont fix. They wanted me to upgrade to custom springs that cost at least 2x as much that would handle the cummins, but I bet they ride stiff enough to split your teeth.

My thoughts on going with the HD 'regular' springs was I saw a couple guys doing the swap on STOCK big block springs, and while they were definately not happy and negative arched like crazy, it worked. So I would absolutely do it again. 3" Tuff Country HD up front and 2.5" shackle flip in the rear and it sits perfect for my liking.

[JohnKimble]

That is one clean build you have there! Is that a dash cap or entire dashboard? Very nice!

[DieselRat]

The dash is all factory. Its cracked in 3 places and looks horrible! Eventually I plan to replace it.

Bit the bullet and got the truck registered yesterday taking the plate from my 2000 cummins. (which was the motivation for this build, to replace the ext cab)

So now I am STUCK driving this truck@!

Last night I took it out for an extended around the block drive to get it up to temp and all, and it got to temp, then kept going, then leveled out where its supposed to be, hopefully just an air bubble in the system that worked out.

Unfortunately the tires that were on it are dry rotted and crap, woke up this morning to a completely flat front tire.

Wife says to me yesterday you NEED to get tires on it, it looks ridiculous with those little tires. I was wanting to hold off! But now I guess I have to.

What are the largest tires I can put on stock dually wheels without any kind of spacer between them in the back? I'm thinking its gonna look best with 285-315 or 35's all around, I just don't want to coin up for wheels just yet.

[MTCK]

I don't think you will get any wider than a 255/85 without a spacer. A buddy just put a set of those cooper st maxx on his 2000 dually and needed a 1/4" spacer to keep the big side lugs from touching.

There was also a guy on here running like 315's on a lifted maroon late 70's dually but he had a big spacer. Looked tough but damn near needed an oversize placard.

[Dieselwrencher]

235/85r16s are close on chevy dually wheels. Plan on buying some spacers IMO.

[Chevy3+3]

What size are on it now?

I'm running 235/85/16 on mine. They are fairly close on the rear but I've never had them rub even under heavily loaded gooseneck trailer. You MIGHT be able to get a 255/85/16 on it without rubbing as someone else mentioned above. If they did then a 1/2 or less spacer would probably be enough.

If you go any bigger than that then you gotta run spacers. I like how the 285's look on a square dually but I also like the tall skinny stock look.

[DieselRat]

Well as much as I wanted to go bigger on tires I ended up sticking with 235 85 16. Hoping the lift settles some, I never intended to have it skyscraper high in the first place, but I got it somehow.

Plenty of room with the 235, if I had gone 255/85 I certainly would have needed a spacer with anything but maybe smooth street tires. I've run spacers in the past on other vehicles and while I never really had a problem, I'm still not crazy about the idea so I'll just deal with the smaller tires for now.

On a side note, buying 6 tires sucks, why did I have to get a dually

I did however go get it inspected and have been driving it! Its completely stock engine wise and its a slow turd, but I'm making myself leave it alone for at least a week to make sure nothing else comes up before I mess with the pump and try and wake it up some.

So my seat of the pants first impression is, it drives damn nice!!! I did a home alignment with my old school alignment tool (long bar with adjusters on the ends if you've ever seen one) and its about spot on, I will probably get it checked soon to make sure, way easy with a knuckle to knuckle tie rod as opposed to Y link I'm used to. Its fun shifting through the gears and so far the tranny is flawless which I was concerned about buying used junk from random people. Sounds like the throwout bearing is squeeling some, which is irritating, but I also still have a hole in my floor so its right there. While its a huge truck, it doesn't drive like that. I was expecting the worst but its way above that! So 8 months or so ago I had this stupid crazy idea that instead of buying a 'new' used truck, I would build this junk, and today driving it to work for the first time without being in fear of my life, or some crazy problem coming up, is a damn good feeling. While I probably have enough money into it that I could have bought a half way descent common rail or other cummins truck, it wouldn't be the same. I'm a big fan of 'built not bought' and theres no better feeling than knowing every single nut and bolt on your truck.

This thread is far from done, but I feel that I've finally reached the summit for building and now I can hopefully just do fun things to it. It needs interior work, it needs power, and details cleaned up that first priority in getting it on the road. Been a lot of text and not enough pictures, so today on my way home I plan to do my own little photo shoot to share with all you guys how it came out to this point. Thanks for following along and offering advice along the way. This forum is probably my favorite to post on because of the lack of know it alls, and bad advice/opinions flying around like elsewhere. I'm a mopar guy at heart but chevy guys are the best

[daddyjeep]

Glad to hear it is on the road and doing what it is supposed to do. I look forward to the "fun" stuff.

[MTCK]

Congratulations, super cool that you have her on the road. I know exactly what you mean and agree with the built not bought premise. Looking forward to the pics.

[Dieselwrencher]

You may have enough in it to go buy a common rail truck. But just remember what parts for your 12v cost compared to CR stuff. You can go broke quick if you have a fuel system failure or worse yet, a fuel system problem that kills the engine. I have 90% of the stuff gathered up for a 5.9 CR to put in my 76 and run EFI Live. I'm just lacking a rebuild kit and I have to decide if I want to buy new injectors now or run the ones I have. I don't like gambling so it might be a bit before I can finish that engine for it. Anyhow, congrats on getting to drive it to work! Once you start playing with the IP, it will make it a lot more fun to drive!

[COS399]

Glad to hear your finally getting to drive it. I had to change the gear ratio in mine because it would only go above 65 mph when you were headed down a hill.