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03-03-2015, 02:31 AM | #1 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
I just went out and looked at mine, and the larger line is definitely on the smaller reservoir.
GREGSKI: I think that Autozone unit will work fine, as long as you understand that the lines are going to switch front/back on the MC, so the larger line will now go on the back, in order to keep the larger line on the smaller reservoir. No biggie: they will only attach one way.
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
03-03-2015, 02:48 AM | #2 | |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Quote:
Delco Moraine is one way Bendix is the other way The lines would be reversed to match the cylinder. Both of these were used. I would assume this was a supply thing on the assembly line. Mine the small reservoir is in the rear next to the booster. With a 454 I definitely have JB5
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1977 Chevrolet C/10 Silverado. Step-Side, Factory 454, TH400, 3.73 Posi 12 Bolt. 1975 Chevrolet El Camino. 350, TH400, 3.08 Posi 10 Bolt. |
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03-03-2015, 02:57 AM | #3 | |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
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I have a 350 but I'm JB5 too, but that's because of the higher GVWR on the K trucks.
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
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03-03-2015, 02:08 AM | #4 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Now going back and looking at your pics, you have different sized lines, but they are off the front of the master cylinder, which I think now should be to the fronts.
I'm confused. Discs as they wear use a lot of fluid. Got that. The actual flow to and from the rears as you apply and release the brakes is higher, because the disc pistons hardly move in and out at all, whereas the rear pistons do. Got that. Larger reservoir is for the fronts, so as they wear and the pistons move out and the calipers have to fill up with fluid, they don't suck the reservoir dry. Got that. But your setup looks confused. Or is it just me? Does your proportioning valve have a colored stripe on it? That is a GM identifier for which one it is. I think you should also track down which lines go where. Getting this right is important.
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
03-03-2015, 02:29 AM | #5 | |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Quote:
Actually a caliper piston requires less pressure to provide the same clamping force of a wheel cylinder. So with the same pressure as drums it equals more clamping force. But it does actually travel about the same as a wheel cylinder. caliper pistons on a floating caliper are required to back off (zero pressure) the caliper needs room to float. So there is actually a slight air gap between pad and rotor. A wheel cylinder by design are required to be tight against the shoe or too much fluid is required via pedal travel to get them in an applied state. this is accomplished via a residual valve usually in the master cylinder. it keeps the drum line charged with a 2 to 4 lb residual line pressure to keep those wheel cylinders charged so when applied they don't move as much as you may think. drum brakes in good order will use about the same fluid volume as discs in good order.
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1977 Chevrolet C/10 Silverado. Step-Side, Factory 454, TH400, 3.73 Posi 12 Bolt. 1975 Chevrolet El Camino. 350, TH400, 3.08 Posi 10 Bolt. |
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03-03-2015, 02:38 AM | #6 | |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Quote:
BTW, I do think you are right that the line sizes are just to make it easy to get them hooked up right. Like using different electrical connectors. I think either size line is sufficient for either set, it's just to keep them straight.
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
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03-03-2015, 03:30 AM | #7 | |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
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1977 Chevrolet C/10 Silverado. Step-Side, Factory 454, TH400, 3.73 Posi 12 Bolt. 1975 Chevrolet El Camino. 350, TH400, 3.08 Posi 10 Bolt. |
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03-03-2015, 02:26 AM | #8 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Looking at this replacement proportioning valve, the larger fittings are for the rears.
http://www.carolinaclassictrucks.com...rtioning-valve I think the lines may have been reversed on gregskis to match the reversed reservoirs. Or maybe it doesn't matter which reservoir is where, as long as the lines are hooked up correctly, and since they're different sixes, that's hard to bugger up.
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
03-03-2015, 02:55 AM | #9 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Very cool work. Have I followed from the beginning. Move on
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03-03-2015, 03:03 AM | #10 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
So GREGSKI, the bottom line is that:
1) that Autozone part will work fine. 2) the brake lines are going to reverse to fit the other-way-around layout of the master cylinder. 3) you have a brake fluid leak in your rear brakes somewhere, leading to the empty reservoir. Note my previous comments about rubber age-hardening and shrinking. I would replace the rear brake cylinders on general principles.
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
03-03-2015, 04:14 AM | #11 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Yeah, so I don't think we're really much in disagreement any more. Now that I did some reading and got some misconceptions on my end straightened out. I never said drum brakes outperformed disks. Fade resistance alone due to better cooling is a big deal in favor of disk brakes. ABS is nice. So is traction control on a FWD car. Front disks with rear drums is very popular with manufacturers, because drums are cheaper due to not requiring a separate parking brake mechanism. And I should have said factory-supplied disk brakes are ALMOST always power.
Here's where we may differ a bit. I agree with this: "Discs require more effort at the pedal because leading shoe technology is a sort of assist from the very design. Where as discs are pure simple clamping force." But I think drums also require less line pressure under heavy braking. One of the jobs of the combination valve is to hold back the brake pressure to the rears to keep them from locking up once line pressure gets high enough for the leading shoes to start to pull themselves in, while continuing to give full pressure to the front disks. So we may still disagree a bit there. Doesn't matter. Neither of us designs brake systems for a living. Anyway, I think we have things figured out for gregski to proceed, which is the goal! And I was on the wrong track, so I thank you for stepping in there before I stepped in it any further. Oh, here's one of those Mopar hemi cars with factory four-corner manual drums. Yikes. Just don't try to stop it a second time for several minutes.... http://www.rkmotorscharlotte.com/sal...Cuda/133019#!/
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
03-03-2015, 11:37 AM | #12 | |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Quote:
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1977 Chevrolet C/10 Silverado. Step-Side, Factory 454, TH400, 3.73 Posi 12 Bolt. 1975 Chevrolet El Camino. 350, TH400, 3.08 Posi 10 Bolt. |
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03-03-2015, 09:02 PM | #13 | |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Quote:
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03-03-2015, 09:19 PM | #14 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Geez, a nice car to be sure, but 250 grand? No car is worth that to me.
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Greg 64 GMC Suburban - 283, NV3500, 14 bolt 77 C10 swb - 292, SM465, 12 bolt |
03-03-2015, 10:36 PM | #15 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Especially when it sold new for around $5,000 to $6,000....
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1977 Chevrolet C/10 Silverado. Step-Side, Factory 454, TH400, 3.73 Posi 12 Bolt. 1975 Chevrolet El Camino. 350, TH400, 3.08 Posi 10 Bolt. |
03-03-2015, 04:16 AM | #16 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
OK, gresgski, we now return you to your regularly scheduled programming.
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
03-03-2015, 02:34 PM | #17 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
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03-03-2015, 09:24 AM | #18 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Good Lord. That was intense.
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03-03-2015, 09:10 PM | #19 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
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03-03-2015, 09:20 PM | #20 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Them's fightin' words!
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Greg 64 GMC Suburban - 283, NV3500, 14 bolt 77 C10 swb - 292, SM465, 12 bolt |
03-03-2015, 05:45 PM | #21 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Just think I've got manual brakes on my '76.....
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http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=581873 The low buck build threads. Check'em out! http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=666022 My build thread Crossmembers CC |
03-03-2015, 08:39 PM | #22 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Loving the thread Gregski! I have done many of the tasks you are doing thru the years but its always good to see them again. Your attention to detail, pictures, and wit are very entertaining and helpful to many I am sure.
Last edited by Jake Wade; 03-03-2015 at 08:48 PM. |
03-04-2015, 12:13 AM | #23 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
Mecum recently sold an original, low-mileage Dodge Daytona hemi for $900,000.
David Spade bought it. <church lady voice> Isn't that special? </clv>
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Rich Weyand 1978 K10 RCSB DD. |
03-04-2015, 12:16 AM | #24 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
who is David Spade??
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1977 Chevrolet C/10 Silverado. Step-Side, Factory 454, TH400, 3.73 Posi 12 Bolt. 1975 Chevrolet El Camino. 350, TH400, 3.08 Posi 10 Bolt. |
03-04-2015, 12:34 AM | #25 |
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Re: Restoring Rusty
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