Make it handle

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Hey rob I just got some qa1 balljoints and 3" drop spindles in the mail and my energy suspension bushing kit. I have a flip kit on order and going to order some bilstien shocks next week. Right now I have the a arm crosspins re drilled 3/4 to move the lower arm forward to add more caster and a one ton sway bar up front that I'm going to add a Hiem link and bushing setup to instead of the bushing mounted to arm setup. Also thinking of running the top ball joint stud longer to help aid in caster gain. What do you think of this setup? The rear is next months focus
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[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

Hey rob I just got some qa1 balljoints and 3" drop spindles in the mail and my energy suspension bushing kit. I have a flip kit on order and going to order some bilstien shocks next week. Right now I have the a arm crosspins re drilled 3/4 to move the lower arm forward to add more caster and a one ton sway bar up front that I'm going to add a Hiem link and bushing setup to instead of the bushing mounted to arm setup. Also thinking of running the top ball joint stud longer to help aid in caster gain. What do you think of this setup? The rear is next months focus

Have a link on how you intend to do this?
Also, I believe the tall upper BJ aids the camber curve in certain applications vs caster gain.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Sorry I meant Aid in camber gain. My bad

I don't have a link. Cause it's in my head but what I'm thinking is drilling through the ends of the swaybar and adding an adjustable rod end and just use one of the lower arm holes for the old bushing bracket to mount a through rod with urethane bushing on either side. This way since a sway bar mOves in an arc as the front susp moves up and down there is movement instead of resistance with the sock setup. This should allow the front not to feel so stiff when urethane bushings are added
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[Grimee]

Originally Posted by robnolimit

Yes I have. Thjere will be one. I have the tentative dates, but I don't have the OK to tell everybody. I think by the end of the month, only 10 days, the news will be out.

How's you'r new project comin?

the new project is moving slow I cant seem to decide which way to go with it and we are still not completely finished with the Tahoe. we are puttin it on the scales later this week so I can get the corner weights and see where we are at I want to put a bigger bar in the front. I also want to see how the weight moved around doing the motor swap

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

Sorry I meant Aid in camber gain. My bad

I don't have a link. Cause it's in my head but what I'm thinking is drilling through the ends of the swaybar and adding an adjustable rod end and just use one of the lower arm holes for the old bushing bracket to mount a through rod with urethane bushing on either side. This way since a sway bar mOves in an arc as the front susp moves up and down there is movement instead of resistance with the sock setup. This should allow the front not to feel so stiff when urethane bushings are added
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Yes, the taller ball joints will add some camber gain. Sounds like a good plan. You can drill and thread the end of the bar, but remember it's tempered. You can also cut about 1" off of the end of the bar and weld a tab up on the end. The piviting link is a good idea.

[aggie91]

Originally Posted by robnolimit

Sounds cool, and thanks, BTW, nice place to live.
, Another note on leafs. The WIDTH of a leaf can make a big difference. '54 and earlier chevys, and '47 and back fords use a 1 3/4" wide leaf. Through the 50's it was 2", then 2 1/4", and in the late 60's, 2 1/2". Some newer trucks have 3" or 3 1/2". The wider springs have less side flex, and usually a smoother ride, fewer leafs are required. Changing you leaf set up from 'truck' style, Axle under and shackle going up, to a 'car' style, Axle over, and shackle going up, can really improve the ride, but it drops the load capacity. Many, many people 'flip' the axle, which drops the truck, but almost nobody flips the shackle. Yes, that will lift the truck a bit, appx. 1 1/2", but the ride is way better.

I know this is back tracking a bit, but I did the rear shakle/hanger flip on my son's '82. We are not done and it is not on the ground yet, but my priliminary measurements with how I did the flip put the spring piviot of the shakle at about the same measurement from the floor (actually about 1/8" lower) There are pictures on my son's build thread. We did do a notch on the frame for other reasons and the floor of the bed will be raised 4". That still puts one of the floor cross supports just kissing the hanger...

[robnolimit]

I took a look, and it looks good. Are you flipping the axle? If so, and if you don't want the full 6" drop of the flipped axle, you can drop the shackle hanger a bit. Every inch you drop the shackle will raise the truck 1/2".

[aggie91]

Originally Posted by robnolimit

I took a look, and it looks good. Are you flipping the axle? If so, and if you don't want the full 6" drop of the flipped axle, you can drop the shackle hanger a bit. Every inch you drop the shackle will raise the truck 1/2".

Thanks, Rob. We are flipping the axle. We want it low so we may even end up with a block between the axle and the leaves. We will wait till we get the truck back together before tear down for paint to make that decision.

[KQQL IT]

Ive been wondering what a 4X4 front hanger and longer shackle would do to the I/C ? At least make the cal trac bar more parallel to the ground....
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[robnolimit]

[QUOTE=KQQL IT;5207009]Ive been wondering what a 4X4 front hanger and longer shackle would do to the I/C ? At least make the cal trac bar more parallel to the ground....
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Hmmm, probably not the destred effect. IC is related to the CG, so the longer mounts would raise the CG, unless you re-arc the springs. TheCal-Tracks work by reducing the spring wrap, and moving the IC back to the spot where they contact the spring. Being level doesn't really change this.

[robnolimit]

For those interested in a track day, there is an event March 29th, a thursday, at A.M.P. in Riverside, ca. This is a one day Time Attack (autocross) event hosted by No Limit and Drive Magazine. Check out www.socalchallenge.com come on out and have some fun. - open to all years cars and trucks.

[KQQL IT]

I was thinking lower the front spring hanger and raise the rear.
wont change the ride height.
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[Grimee]

Rob
PM sent

[Greywolf200]

Hello Rob, I'm looking to buy a pair of 2" lowering blocks for the rear axle and a pair of urethane bushings for a stock 1 1/4" sway bar. I going to cut a couple of coils from a pair of 1T coils to lower the front. Will flipping the trailing arm mounts be worthwhile with the two inch drop? Who can I contact about the parts?

Thanks for all the help,

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by Greywolf200

Hello Rob, I'm looking to buy a pair of 2" lowering blocks for the rear axle and a pair of urethane bushings for a stock 1 1/4" sway bar. I going to cut a couple of coils from a pair of 1T coils to lower the front. Will flipping the trailing arm mounts be worthwhile with the two inch drop? Who can I contact about the parts?

Thanks for all the help,

sorry for the delay. We have the 2" blocks, get the urathane from summit or energy suspension. Yes, it's worthwhile to raise the mounts.

[robnolimit]

Back to it. lets talk about basic aproach. there are two schools of thought. 1) Soft spring, big bar, low roll center. 2) Stiff spring, small bar, high roll center. Both can work, but you need all three together to make things work. I tend to go for the soft spring set up. This tends to work a bit better with heavier vehicles. If we were building light weight stuff, like a porsche or a miata, I'd go for the stiff spring set up.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

So if your on the subject of springs, you say making lead springs consistent with Teflon coating and strips. Now I'm wondering about mono leafs?? They have a softer and predictable spring rate. I Know they are more prone to axle wrap though so maybe pair with a Caltracbar? Or do Caltracs stiffen the spring too?
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[robnolimit]

I'd rather put teflon liner in a multi leaf pack, than run a mono leaf. Most mono leafs are too stiff. Multi leafs are very tune-able. you can pull leafs, and or cut and shorten them to your taste. A good trick is to keep the front side of the leaf pack full, with all the leafs stock, and use spring straps, and then cut and shorten the rear portion of the leafs to tune the spring rate.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

I see. Good to know. So if you do tuning to your spring packs then it would also be a good idea to have adjustable shocks too I would imagine.

So lighter springs in the rear and front With bigger sway bars and a high roll center. Say a 5-7 drop on a square body would have a high roll center. Or is it lowering that makes the roll center real low?
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[Greywolf200]

Originally Posted by robnolimit

sorry for the delay. We have the 2" blocks, get the urathane from summit or energy suspension. Yes, it's worthwhile to raise the mounts.

Thanks for getting back, I realize you've been a little busy creating a world class ride.

[69gmcc10]

Rob, I have a 69 log bed and I am lowering it 2 inches with blocks, would flipping the triling arm bracket still be a good idea on the longer wheelbase?

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by 69gmcc10

Rob, I have a 69 log bed and I am lowering it 2 inches with blocks, would flipping the triling arm bracket still be a good idea on the longer wheelbase?

Yep, still a good idea.

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

I see. Good to know. So if you do tuning to your spring packs then it would also be a good idea to have adjustable shocks too I would imagine.

So lighter springs in the rear and front With bigger sway bars and a high roll center. Say a 5-7 drop on a square body would have a high roll center. Or is it lowering that makes the roll center real low?
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Lowering the truck lowers the CG for sure, and "may" lower the RC, depending on how it was lowered.

[duallyjams]

On the subject of leaf springs on different years having different width what about different length and what is prefer to work best.

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by duallyjams

On the subject of leaf springs on different years having different width what about different length and what is prefer to work best.

I'd say the 88-98 1/2t is probably the best, but I'm not sure it's worth swapping onto other chassis, unless you have them laying around. Some Mopar E body leafs are short on the front side (sort of stiff, less axle wrap) and long on the back side (softer effective spring rate). These are popular with oval track and drag racers still. - But, they are kinda long on the back side, and may hang out under the truck bed. Leafs can be very usable, but will never equal a link suspension for performance (as long as you toss the $$ part out)