Let's Build A 1 Ton Crew Cab 4x4

[y5mgisi]

Honestly, I just would put it together without the sway bar and then just try and find some random unit that will work. With those Springs, you really won't need a sway bar unless you start towing.

[NastyBuzzard]

Originally Posted by y5mgisi

Honestly, I just would put it together without the sway bar and then just try and find some random unit that will work. With those Springs, you really won't need a sway bar unless you start towing.

But towing is what I am building the truck for.. That's why I want the diesel.

[NastyBuzzard]

I found my solution for the sway bar. I just removed the sway bar mount from the cross member and moved it back in the frame to where it will be usable. Only issue now is I will have to use spacers under the front cross member to make up for the material I removed or modify it a tad. This will work I think though.





I am also trying to determine what my final height might be. To accommodate for the frame differences between 2wd and 4wd I lowered the front spring's rear shackle by 1" lower than the 4x4 version, this of course threw off my pinion angle. Come to find out though that it wasn't enough. So last night I just decided to make some quick shackles to try and fix it some.

The stock shackles has holes spaces 4" apart, I moved it to 5" but that may be too much.





This of course made my pinion angle worse. I may make another hole at 4.5" and see what that is like but some how I have to move the front mount for the front leaf spring down the same I have moved the rear. So I may have to detach the hanger from the body mount and space it down 1"-2" to match what the rear is.

Fun fun, just showing what little progress I made last night.

If the truck gets too high I may have to go for a smaller lift spring, like 2.5" or so. I really don't want 6" of lift, I know that may sound weird but I am building it to be practical, it probably won't see any intentional off road use.

[daddyjeep]

"It won't see and intentional off road use". That is an interesting comment. Do I want to know how you accidentally get into an off road situation.

[NastyBuzzard]

Originally Posted by y5mgisi

I think you can just fix your pinion angle with shims under the leafs. If you want to run those Springs and end up at only 4" lift, you'll have to clearance the frame for the shackle.

I think you are right, that is an option. Definitely an option still to clearance frame. Just have to have mig setup at the house.

Originally Posted by daddyjeep

"It won't see and intentional off road use". That is an interesting comment. Do I want to know how you accidentally get into an off road situation.

When I say intentional I mean like if I go out in a pasture to pick up a vehicle or have to drive through a field our into the woods. I live out in the country, there is no telling what I may come across. I just don't plan to run off into a mud hole on a dirt road or go ride trails with it.

[NastyBuzzard]

I made links for the PS side and made a hole at 4.5" and at 5" this time. I definitely like the gap at the frame this time. At first when I bolted it up I was shocked how much better the 4.5" made the shackle angle.





However, then I took it out of 4.5 and made it 5" like the passenger side and shackle angle didn't change... Ugh. What the hell.

EDIT: I guess looking at it closer it isn't that far off I guess.

[y5mgisi]

It's not optimal, but it will work just fine.

[NastyBuzzard]

I am hoping to mess with it more when I get weight on it, for now I just didn't want it to be touching the frame. Still a long way to go that is for sure. I am just ready to have the frame modifications I need to do, done.

I really want to roll it outside and clean it all off as well. I need to clean the frame and cab as well as clean the mess it has made in the shop.

Last night I also started working on assembling the 355 engine that came out of it, I may just go ahead and put it up for sale so I won't be tempted to slap it back together as gas engine.

Edit: Also I tried "Flexing" the suspension some last night with my small aluminum jack, springs were not giving at all and as soon as the tire got off the ground the jack broke and it slammed down. I moved my big jack under it and tried again and got it way up and spring still would not give at all. I started putting a crap ton of weight on the front end but ran out of time in the shop.

[deejaaa1]

the 6.2 will bolt up but the pipe fitting is smaller than the 6.5. my 6.5 has donuts and the 6.2 didn't or maybe it was the other way around.
how many miles on the 6.5? might just be an issue with the PMD.
love the GMT400 HD's. esp crewcabs.
you're inspiring me to jump on mine and get it back on the road.

[NastyBuzzard]

Feels good to inspire someone and give them a little motivation for their own project.

Are you talking about the exhaust manifolds?

I think the engine had less than 200K but it wasn't low mileage or anything. We tried to get it to fire up, it turned over great! I unplugged the glow plugs and pulled the fuse and shot some starter fluid in and it acted like it wanted to fire up but after enough cranking over the starter made a little grinding noise so we stopped and I just went ahead and pulled it.

[NastyBuzzard]

I pulled the engine back off the frame to do some checking and what not.



I also removed most of the TBI harness that will be coming off at some point.



I need to clean and paint the firewall black. What is the best thing to use on the firewall that grease/oil wont stick to? I thought about under coating it or a type of rhino liner, something that will also maybe deter a little heat? I just don't want to spray paint it but I am not set up to do a legit paint job yet either.

[deejaaa1]

Originally Posted by NastyBuzzard

Feels good to inspire someone and give them a little motivation for their own project.

Are you talking about the exhaust manifolds? yes. esp where the pipe bolts to it.

...shot some starter fluid in and it acted like it wanted to fire up but after enough cranking over....

I would not use starting fluid on a diesel. lots of warning about it but I'm guilty also. I use WD40 instead now.
make sure you install the rear brace on the starter when you get it replaced. broken cast iron mount ruined the engine that was in the truck when I bought it. reason it only cost 700.00.

[NastyBuzzard]

I thought WD40 has changed and isn't flammable and wont work anymore, that is why I tried starting fluid. Overall I only used maybe 2- 1 sec squirts. The discouragement is when people spray the heck out of it or leave glow plugs wired up. I think. Still learning.

I saw someone who was successful in using the 6.5 ds manifold so may still try it, it wouldn't fit b/c it still had a cut piece of the down pipe attached to it.

Starter brace? I will look into it. Starter looks perfectly fine though, the flywheel was a tad chewed up but starter still looks fine. Engine still turns over nicely as well.

Only discouragement I have is that I can't seem to find anyone who has kept the electrical pump in the swap or all of the wiring. Most just convert to the early 90's 6.5 mechanical pump, which isn't something I particularly want to do.

[Dieselwrencher]

I will not use wd40 in a cummins. They tend to want to run away on it. Ether with upper end lube helps. But I agree, usually the disclaimer is for the people that want to drown them with it and things go boom. The biggest issue is people don't think of the grid heaters and glow plugs will ignite the ether and that can be seriously not good. Nice score on the 6.5 too!

[NastyBuzzard]

Thanks! I think it was a good deal as well!

I used the starting fluid with the upper cylinder lube. For some reason I thought back in the day you could get some that wasn't 100% ether and was a little less harmful.

Oh well, I have high hopes for the engine. PMD is in stock location so I'm hoping it just went out. I also took manifolds off and looked down inside and it looked good. I plan to do a compression test at some point.

[NastyBuzzard]

Started tinkering with the engine last night. I am trying to learn as much as I can about these diesels. First I wanted to make sure I didn't miss a remote mounted PMD.

I didn't, it was right where the factory put it, and was covered up by a rats nest! I don't know fellas but I think that may have been the problem!



Pulled the filter to check it..



Next I pulled the intake cover.



I also pulled the thermostat housing, I guess that is what you would call it and I looked down in the heads and down in the water pump and even in the opening where a "350 timing chain normally is." It looks ridiculously clean inside. The turbo was even really tight with no side to side or forward to back play.

I may get it where I can pull valve covers and drop oil pan and if everything looks good, slap it back together and see about getting it to run.

I will need to replace glow plugs, I wish I had an easy way of getting the injectors checked. Fingers crossed I won't have to throw money at this thing!

Also considering PMD relocate of course, as well as the newer style dual thermostat housing and any other little tricks I can throw at it that won't break the bank.

[MTCK]

Was there a year the 6.5 came with a mechanical injection pump? We have had lots of those for work trucks and you need to keep a pocket of those PMD's handy. Even remote mounted we had lots of problems.

[NastyBuzzard]

Yeah 92&93 came with mechanical as far as I know.

Apparently just remote mounting the pmd isn't enough it also needs a heat extractor or "cooler." Also helps to put it where the air will be blowing on it.

[deejaaa1]

here's a link to the brace. it's an important piece, if it's been removed, something will break:
https://www.google.com/search?q=1996...Es83QNLduRM%3A
my 92 is mechanical. a little power loss didn't matter compared to simplicity.

[NastyBuzzard]

I'll make sure it is there. I wish I had the 93/94 parts available to play with. It was crazy hard finding what I did find.

[NastyBuzzard]

I am kind of shocked how clean this thing is coming apart for me to check it out.

These gaskets look nearly brand new.



I vacuumed out some leaves and left overs of a rats nest that was around the pmd.




Pulled the valve cover off as well... Still looking good in my opinion.



I finally had some free time to go to my local junkyard where he has a lot of squares but normally charges out the roof prices.

He has a crap ton of transfer cases, I went digging. I think I may have even struck a deal with him to trade a 32 spline tcase for one I had spare from ls swap from a 2001 Silverado. However, I want to make sure I get the right t case, apart from looking at the tag and the normal identifiers I am not sure how to be 100% sure they are for a square. I found several 32 spline 208's and 32 spline 241. Of course I would prefer the 241 b/c of electronic speedo but how do I know 100% sure that it is passenger side drop and will work? Also I noticed a lot of the "hubs" that the drive shaft would bolt to vary, I saw some with a spot for u bolts, some with a 4 bolt circle pattern and some that looked like could be 6 bolt pattern. I go back on Friday to make a deal.



I also found me some pedals that I have to go back and pull. Hydroboost and Hydraulic clutch.





Another thing I need to figure out is drive shafts. Front and rear. I had the Th400 where it used the u bolts to bolt to the rear of trans, now I will have a slip yolk as far as rear driveshaft is concerned. I will need to modify and shorten it anyways. I would love to get rid of the 2 piece, I swear I saw someone was able to use some ford driveshaft or something at one point.

As far as front driveshaft, how many different types are there? Are they specific for the Dana 60 or will one for Dana 44 work? This is one I have that looks like it would bolt to the 208 or 241 tcase, I swear they used to extend a bit longer than in the pic though.



Oh yeah, bad news $ wise... I got a call from machine shop the day I was supposed to pick up my LS1 telling me it will need to be bored.. There goes an extra $600 probably. I did pull the trans am out the shop and clean it though in preparation to be hauled to my buddies.

[NastyBuzzard]

Even more bad news $ wise. Machine shop cant find pistons that are 3.903 or 3.905 that are hypereutectic, only 3.908 which is max overbore for the LS1. I don't want to go max overbore when it only needs .005, so far my only choice is to buy forged pistons or go .010 over I haven't decided yet.

On another note, the owner of this truck is going on a cruise this Friday and wanted some gambling money. He told me if I could give him some cash by Thursday that he would knock $150 off what I owed him so now the truck is paid off and I have the title . So that was nice.

[NorCalAnthony]

Bummer about not being able to find the HE pistons. Probe makes some 3.902 forged pistons for around $100 more than what Summit lists the stock replacement HE pistons for http://www.ws6project.com/user_stor/...oducts_id=4272

Another thing you might want to ask the machine shop about is the rods. Most of the aftermarket/replacement bolts will oval the rods and require a rehoning and oversized bearings. My local machine shops were wanting $175-200 to install ARP rod bolts and do a rehone/recondition on the old rods. For less than $100 more you can get Eagle or Scat I-Beams with ARP bolts included http://www.ws6project.com/user_stor/...index-1-4a.php

Yeah there are better options out there if you want to spend the extra $$$ but as long as you aren't going over 500ish HP the budget stuff should work just fine and not cost much more than HE pistons with reworked factory rods.

[jott_06]

I'm the guy that used the Ford driveshaft in my 4x4 conversion. Technically any driveshaft of the correct length will work if you can find the right U-joints for it. As far as your engine mount pads, I would try to do a little more massaging on them on that top flange to get it to sit flat on the frame. It looks like there is a gap between the frame and flange. Or maybe put a body shim in the gap.

[NastyBuzzard]

I hope so, I am working on getting my transfer case this weekend then I can see about what crossmember I will have to use. Then I can sit it all in and measure the length of shaft I will need and go to the junkyard and start measuring.

I am still not sure what trans/tcase xmember I need to use though, I plan to use either Np208 or Np241 but do I need a th400 or sm465 or does it matter? I know there are several types.