1949 Chevy with S10 swap. Beginner build with ambition!

[gigamanx]

Wow what a crazy couple of days. Earlier today, I had all but given up on the truck and started thinking of how much I could sell off to make up some of my expenses. I know, dark days. My mind ached from researching transmission types, used vs refurb, craigslist specials, bellhousing types for various years, so much stuff I've basically figured out the most complicated part of any car is probably that little auto trans sitting under our cab. I had realized with the engine and trans situation I still had another few thousand to go before I'd even get a usable power plant. Pretty much blowing my budget out of a reasonable place to make any progress for the next 6 months.

And there, in my darkest moments, the truck gods shone down. I got a call from a local mechanic/trans place after trying to source one close enough for my to drive, therefore cutting down shipping costs. The guy had just pulled a 700r4 from a corvette that was getting an LS3 upgrade. He knew the owner, knew it shifted well, and was happy to offer it for a measly $250.

1 hour later...


thank you lord of steel and oil. Still a few outstanding questions though. I need a tailhousing for it and it looks like my S10 tail shaft is about 3/4" longer. I also need a torque converter but have no idea what a good one is for our trucks.

Today was a good day

[OutlawDrifter]

Sometimes things just go ok like that. Glad it worked out.

[joedoh]

nice score. you can tell its a vette trans by a big V cast in the bellhousing, it uses a different valve body.

the tailshaft is shorter, like you have found, because the vette doesnt need any slip for the driveshaft yoke to move in and out as the rear suspension moves up and down, because the C4 vette has an IRS with a solidly mounted pumpkin that doesnt move. the vette tailshaft wont have a place for a normal mounting pad on it, it has a mount on the side that goes to a beam that goes all the way back to the pumpkin.

if it were me, I would use a vette tailshaft and just fab a lower mount to a poly bushing. I dont think using a truck tailshaft will allow the rear seal to, seal. if you know someone who can do welding on cast aluminum you could maybe shorten a truck tailshaft.

never give up. thats puffin talk.

[gigamanx]

Originally Posted by joedoh

nice score. you can tell its a vette trans by a big V cast in the bellhousing, it uses a different valve body.

the tailshaft is shorter, like you have found, because the vette doesnt need any slip for the driveshaft yoke to move in and out as the rear suspension moves up and down, because the C4 vette has an IRS with a solidly mounted pumpkin that doesnt move. the vette tailshaft wont have a place for a normal mounting pad on it, it has a mount on the side that goes to a beam that goes all the way back to the pumpkin.

if it were me, I would use a vette tailshaft and just fab a lower mount to a poly bushing. I dont think using a truck tailshaft will allow the rear seal to, seal. if you know someone who can do welding on cast aluminum you could maybe shorten a truck tailshaft.

never give up. thats puffin talk.

So if I'm understanding correctly, I need to find the right short shaft tail housing for a vette. Currently having issues with finding that in searches. I don't mind fabbing a mount if there are holes somewhere to bolt to. Fabrication seems like the least of my problems haha.

so a yoke on the end of the tailshaft and then I can put any drive shaft onto that I suppose? Not sure if you meant I need the rear end and pumpkin for a vette aswell.

[joedoh]

Originally Posted by gigamanx

So if I'm understanding correctly, I need to find the right short shaft tail housing for a vette. Currently having issues with finding that in searches. I don't mind fabbing a mount if there are holes somewhere to bolt to. Fabrication seems like the least of my problems haha.

so a yoke on the end of the tailshaft and then I can put any drive shaft onto that I suppose? Not sure if you meant I need the rear end and pumpkin for a vette aswell.

the corvette has an independent rear end, the pumpkin is solidly mounted and does not move, the wheels side of the rear move up and down independently of each other. I suppose you could put in a corvette IRS, but it would be a lot of extra work and that isnt really what I was saying haha.

most times people dont use vette transmissions because they need to fab the mounts. you were already fabbing a mount, so 6 of one half dozen of the other. your current driveshaft yoke should slide right in, you just need a vette tailhsaft and a mounting plan

[99 to Life]

quick search on ebay, 42$ free shipping. I'd hop on it. maybe make sure it would work, sure it would but I didn't read into it.

Nice info joedoh, never knew that about the vette. The trans should give your engine another couple hundred horse though

[gigamanx]

Originally Posted by 99 to Life

quick search on ebay, 42$ free shipping. I'd hop on it. maybe make sure it would work, sure it would but I didn't read into it.

Nice info joedoh, never knew that about the vette. The trans should give your engine another couple hundred horse though

Thanks for searching! I scoured craigslist and ebay. Here's the difference...twice the price and side mount bolt holes. Notice the missing flange on the end to make it shorter.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/162596173062

[OutlawDrifter]

Originally Posted by 99 to Life

The trans should give your engine another couple hundred horse though

Off topic, but thought I would share a little humor. Back before the LS craze, every custom car or pickup seemed to have a Corvette 327/350, and every other SBC for sale was "out of a Corvette". If you went by the averages I saw in ads, there isn't a single Corvette out there with it's original engine!

[gigamanx]

A tiny bit of gas and a few wires hooked up to the ignition switch. Oh man it was nice to hear the roar for a few seconds. Now to finish up the engine build knowing its going to run fine with the conversion from TBI back to carbureted.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDZxpoH_5DU

Funny amateur story...I wired up the HEI in a circle starting from cylinder 1, 2, 3, 4, 5...etc. I didn't look up if there was a firing order. I just assumed, that's how engines work. Turns out, there was a specific order to plug in the sparkies...lol, I felt pretty stupid wondering why it was backfiring

[49chevy3100]

Great progress and a lot of good info with great pictures.

[LCA1971]

Very nice work. Lots of good info, I'll be starting one real soon.

[gigamanx]

Originally Posted by LCA1971

Very nice work. Lots of good info, I'll be starting one real soon.

Looking forward to seeing pictures! This board is a gold mine and pretty much any question I have had can be found by searching or just by asking. What are your plans?

[LCA1971]

I'm going to go a little bit different route. Instead of a 117.9" WB S10, I'm using a 108.3" WB S10 and bobbing the rear bed. Moving the rear axle CL fwd 5 to 8 inch's. Unless it's been tried and there's a reason for not doing it! I think shorting the rear bed will look cool and I've got a V8 converted SWB S10 already!!! LS 5.3 for the power plant with a TH350(for now, it's what I have in the S10), 8.8 rear end and bagged! I'm bring the S10 home this weekend from a buddies house and I'll start getting it ready. I'll start posting picks as soon as I can! Can't wait! Chris

[gigamanx]

Originally Posted by LCA1971

I'm going to go a little bit different route. Instead of a 117.9" WB S10, I'm using a 108.3" WB S10 and bobbing the rear bed. Moving the rear axle CL fwd 5 to 8 inch's. Unless it's been tried and there's a reason for not doing it! I think shorting the rear bed will look cool and I've got a V8 converted SWB S10 already!!! LS 5.3 for the power plant with a TH350(for now, it's what I have in the S10), 8.8 rear end and bagged! I'm bring the S10 home this weekend from a buddies house and I'll start getting it ready. I'll start posting picks as soon as I can! Can't wait! Chris

Its personal preference, that's what is cool about these builds. You can do it how you want. Personally, I think the rear bed is a nice proportion to the front end of the AD truck. I have seen people extend the frame out to make up the difference on the 108.3" wheelbase, but it gets extended under the cab support area not the rear of the frame.

[joedoh]

there is actually a super easy way to cut the last 11 inches off the rear of an S10 shortbed frame, flip those pieces over, then move the perches back 8 inches and you end up with a 116 wheelbase which is what the AD trucks are. gives a free 1" drop too.

the pics have been lost to the photobucket debacle, but its as easily done as it sounds. props to 62chevyII for showing us.

[rusty76]

Late to this thread but I am in for the ride. Really cool to you doing and dealing with the unknown knowns. Cool. I also added this one to the low buck build threads http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=581873

[gigamanx]

New welder showing up in the workshop this week. I finally bit the bullet and got a Hobart 190. Just need to figure out how use the dryer outlet. Dryer is about 40ft away, so I also need an extension cord. I've heard 50ft is a lot for the 220v/30A needs.

In other news, I got the engine cleaned up and ready to install. Transmission is mated up with a GM22TOW torque converter and the 700r4 corvette transmission. Everything seems to have lined up. Great video on how to properly measure the torque converter on install is here:

Prestige Motorsports: PROPER TRANSMISSION/TORQUE CONVERTER INSTALLATION

Now looking at mounting the transmission. Any thoughts on doing this style with the trans hanging down from the support as opposed to sitting on top of the support cross member? I like the idea for replacing and working on the transmission. I wouldn't have to remove the cross member. It may need an additional C bracket on one side just to slip the trans into. I'm a bit worried on how much pressure those two bolts would be under...

http://1929fordhotrod.com/johnsblog/...sion-mounting/

[gigamanx]

I can see the garage floor again! Clean up weekend and I slid the engine back into the frame. Still working on where things will ultimately sit. Need to do the trans cross member. For now, my big question for the group is where is my engine mount supposed to, around about, end up? Is it behind the stock S10 mount point or in front? I have two different kinds of transdapt mount adapters to try. I just don't know what its supposed to look like





I think it's supposed to look like this...

[joedoh]

I cleaned the garage this weekend too! it was so nice the first half of the day I just kept working outside.

Originally Posted by gigamanx

I think it's supposed to look like this...

no. it only looks like that installed in an s10. in an AD you need to move the motor BACK. some people just use the V8 mount with no adapter. that moves the engine back about 4 inches.

the V6 mounts on the 2.8 and 4.3 are in the middle of the block to allow for exhaust manifold clearance. but if you put a V8 in an s10, the motor mount is about 4 inches further forward on the V8, so transdapt makes those adapters to hold the v8 in the same place (with respect to the firewall) as the V6 was.

you want to move the engine back. so some people have flipped the mounts so that it moves the V8 even firther back, and used the adjustment of the slotted bolts to end up with a 7-8" rear move (4 inches from installing the V8, 3-4 inches from the flipped mounts).

this is all about clearance to the radiator, I moved my 4.3 8 inches back last time and just cleared the radiator with the mechanical fan.

[joedoh]

a good reference is this picture, your lower crank pulley needs to be just in front of the front crossmember (about even with that skid plate tongue sticking out) if you have any hope to get a radiator in the AD.

[HUSSEY]

As joedoe said above, "so some people have flipped the mounts so that it moves the V8 even further back", I'm some people and that's what I did with a little clarification...you can't flip the adapters on the block or it will hit the fuel pump mount but you can mount them on the chassis and swap them side to side then bolt your rubber mounts on the block. Pictures are easier to understand, see below...

These were when I was mocking mine up. I ended up cutting the top bolt hole of the adapter mount off. You'll also have to slot the bolt holes on the drivers side of the frame mount bolt holes...why they didn't make it the same side to side baffles me...you can use the 2.8 mount as a template...better understood when you go to do it.

The pic below is the position I ended up with, with the bolt in the middle of the slot. Back just a little bit further would have been nice but in this position the trans dipstick tube is "just" clearing the firewall and I have is two fingers between the firewall the the back of the passangers side valve cover. The electric fan clears in the front but I did have to do some searching for a fan that was thin enough to fit.

I have some more description here along with the PN for the rubber mounts I used:

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...9&postcount=24

[HUSSEY]

What it looks like today after being trimmed...

[gigamanx]

Originally Posted by HUSSEY

What it looks like today after being trimmed...

Ok I hear what you guys were saying. I'm all done and it did hit the fuel pump tab, but since my engine doesn't need it I chopped it off

[url=https://flic.kr/p/Xxj7rf]

Fit like a glove and it looks like its pretty much giving me the same amount of space your setup does...seems like plenty of room up front



Transmission seems kind of high though although I haven't checked angles yet to see where its supposed to sit. Right now its actually on top of a 2x4

[99 to Life]

to do trans its best to be at your ride height. Take an angle finder and put it ontop of your intake, come down to about 3* see where that puts you. Take the angle finder and put it on your tailshaft if say that's 5* down then point your rear end up about 5*. that a good rule of thumb and starting point. Some guys do it diff or have diff numbers. Leaf springs set up vs coil over etc etc is going to have a diff magic number. But at any rate, you want some engine degree down and that will dictate you trans. Your rear end is dictated by your trans angle. Ideally you want the trans and rear end to add to zero. I'd just make a frame mounted trans xmember.

[gigamanx]

Originally Posted by 99 to Life

to do trans its best to be at your ride height. Take an angle finder and put it ontop of your intake, come down to about 3* see where that puts you. Take the angle finder and put it on your tailshaft if say that's 5* down then point your rear end up about 5*. that a good rule of thumb and starting point. Some guys do it diff or have diff numbers. Leaf springs set up vs coil over etc etc is going to have a diff magic number. But at any rate, you want some engine degree down and that will dictate you trans. Your rear end is dictated by your trans angle. Ideally you want the trans and rear end to add to zero. I'd just make a frame mounted trans xmember.

ok, I did some research and now understand what you're saying haha. Since the rear end hasn't been touched in the S10, I'll take the angle from that and translate it to the transmission. I also need to look into a driveshaft but haven't measured yet. Since I'm running the shorter Corvette transmission, I can't just google that one haha.