Restoring Rusty

[greg64]

I've had a wide band on my truck for about 6 years. I'm using the Innovate LC-1. Once you have this new information, you'll never go back. If you feel a stumble, you can quickly look at the gauge and see 18:1; no wonder. And, like Greg, my truck sees big changes in elevation, and you can jet the carb correctly for where the truck is being used. And when I'm heavy towing, I make darn sure the ratio doesn't get lean under power.

I have an analog gauge with 270 degrees of sweep. I think this displays the information better than digital numbers because we're not talking about a super-steady reading. But being able to see both banks on a v8 would be good too. I might buy one of those for my suburban, as it has the dash hole ready for the gauge (told you I could never go back).

Also consider that with a dual plane intake on a sbc, the carb is *not* feeding the left bank and the right bank separately. So the dual O2 gauge is still a blend of the total carb.

[cnorth]

Originally Posted by greg64

I've had a wide band on my truck for about 6 years. I'm using the Innovate LC-1. Once you have this new information, you'll never go back. If you feel a stumble, you can quickly look at the gauge and see 18:1; no wonder. And, like Greg, my truck sees big changes in elevation, and you can jet the carb correctly for where the truck is being used. And when I'm heavy towing, I make darn sure the ratio doesn't get lean under power.

I have an analog gauge with 270 degrees of sweep. I think this displays the information better than digital numbers because we're not talking about a super-steady reading. But being able to see both banks on a v8 would be good too. I might buy one of those for my suburban, as it has the dash hole ready for the gauge (told you I could never go back).

Also consider that with a dual plane intake on a sbc, the carb is *not* feeding the left bank and the right bank separately. So the dual O2 gauge is still a blend of the total carb.

So when you see the ratio change are you able to adjust from the cab?

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by cnorth

So when you see the ratio change are you able to adjust from the cab?

Depends, on cars with carburetors no, but these gauges are popular on Throttle Bodied cars, ie modern cars, in which case you could get geeky and have a passenger with a laptop tap in to the ECU (the car computer block box) with an ODBII connector, gosh I thought I left all this geeky stuff behind me when I got rid of the Corrado, or the car computer makes thousandths of adjustments as you drive automagically for you, that type of thing

[Gregski]

unhappy with the RUST-OLEUM Undercoating on the inner fender I decided to give the 3M product a shot

results = better, but not great, as you can see it sputtered some bigger drops here and there rather than being nice and uniform spatter, anyway I will try the SEM Undercoating 39523 next, its all about the learning process

had to use the entire can which is a good single coat, cost was around $10 bucks

[Gregski]

a little before and after off the driver side inner fender, should be going back on maniana after the undercoating dries

[Gregski]

check out what I picked up on eBay back in February but was holdin' out on you, a gauge cluster with a Tachometer - $80 bucks I think, score, it even came with a wiring harness, however no small fuel gauge and the circuit board is toast

[cnorth]

Originally Posted by Gregski

check out what I picked up on eBay back in February but was holdin' out on your, a gauge cluster with a Tachometer - $80 bucks I think, score, it even came with a wiring harness, however no small fuel gauge and the circuit board is toast

It's amazing the deals you find, I would love a tach.

Do you if the small gas gauge will support duel tanks

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by cnorth

It's amazing the deals you find...

Lets not pop the champagne just yet, we have no idea if any of this actually works, I bought it as is, and we already know the circuit board is toast and a new one is going to set me back $70 bucks

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by cnorth

Do you [know] if the small gas gauge will support duel tanks

I'm sorry I do not, I purposely bought a truck with one tank (LOL), simple is better

[Titomars]

Originally Posted by cnorth

It's amazing the deals you find, I would love a tach.

Do you if the small gas gauge will support duel tanks

yes it will. The gauge does not care how many tanks it is hooked through. The switching is at the tank selector switch.

[cnorth]

Originally Posted by Titomars

yes it will. The gauge does not care how many tanks it is hooked through. The switching is at the tank selector switch.

Thanks I kinda figured that but wasn't sure, it's a future project waaaaay down the road.

[69heavychevy]

Could you post pics of your x pipe set up. I'm interested in doing a similar set up but concerned with clearance/routing issues. Thanks in advanced.

[hatzie]

Originally Posted by Titomars

yes it will. The gauge does not care how many tanks it is hooked through. The switching is at the tank selector switch.

The gauge is the same regardless of the number of tanks. I drew up a wiring diagram for someone that wanted to use three tanks. I believe it took 2 switches and 2 valves.

You may be interested to know... The basic damped air core movement is the same on all three small can gauges and for that matter the big fuel gauge. The parts that change are the bias resistor, bias resistor stud location, graphics, and faceplates. EXCEPT the 73-75 ammeter...
The small and large fuel gauges use the same bias resistor on the same studs.
You should be able to re-purpose one of the other gauges to fill the lower left hole using a set of gauge overlays and the correct bias resistor on the correct studs. It depends on whether you can find one of the three that has the correct mounting hole locations on the sheet metal face.

73-80 switch the sender through the dash switch.

81-91 use a motorized valve to switch the fuel flow. That valve has a switch to handle the gauge senders as well.

[Gregski]

I have discovered that if you want to keep the stock look the hardest thing to get is the blueish/greenish plastic housing for the gauges, there is a difference between the one without a tach and one with

In my case I am not just replacing a 1974 no tach cluster with a 1974 cluster with a tach, I wasn't able to find one of the same year

I recon I have picked up at least a 1978 gauge cluster as that may have been the first year of the electronic oil pressure gauge, which it has

below I highlight the physical differences in the gauge housing cluster thingie

Top Pic - 1974 no Tachometer, Ammeter, Mechanical Oil Pressure (manual transmission)

Bottom Pic - 1978 with Tachometer, Voltmeter, Electric Oil Pressure (bottom also happened to be automatic trans)

[Gregski]

One thing that surprised me is that the Tachometer is not like the other gauges, ie two or three studs sticking out of the back. The Tachometer comes with an appendage, it has a different form factor

I guess I just expected the tach to look like a speedometer, especially having seen all the modern aftermarket ones where they look like matching beer cans, know what I mean

[Gregski]

dang forgot I had all these drama build up pictures of the new (used) gauge clusters arrival, LOL...

[Gregski]

ok so the Tachometer has a square butt, so why can't we just cut a square hole in our non tach housings and call it good?

Great question, and it's not like the Greg hasn't thought of it, he's been itching to put his dremel to good use, LOL

It seems like someone at GM was tasked with making these cluster not interchengeable and has succeeded, you see we would also have to cut the printer circuit board and that's where things get a bit hairy since the Tach would go where the large Fuel Gauge lives

here are the backs cloaked with their respected circuit boards for comparison

so put those propane torches down and slowly back away folks... jk

[Gregski]

say what do we have here?

did my baby brother finally drop off my Christmas present?

Why yes he did, and just in time for my Birthday, LOL

but Greg aint it May, why yes it is, apparently you don't have a younger sibling, LOL

gotta love that LMC packaging

[Gregski]

now we thought you was painting all your brown interior black with that special interior upholstery spray paint?

well I was trying it out, but the visors were too far gone and broken, take a look

[Gregski]

here are the old ones and the new ones side by side, I recon I will have to reuse and paint the pivot sticks since Santa didn't bring me those and I don't have another 5 months to wait, JK

[Gregski]

the new printer circuit board arrived today from LMC truck $84 bucks delivered ~ expensive if you ax me, but we like to try and do things right before going Comando, meaning I considered wiring things up directly minus the circuit board, but decided we would make that our Plan B

special thanks to US Postal Service for putting in that air vent hole in the box to ensure this electronic component is properly ventilated - LOL

[Gregski]

and here they are side by side (ok top n bottom) for comparison, you get the idea

now keep in mind this is a comparison of the old '78 board and the new '78 board (my original '74 is still in the truck we will take a look at it later)

[hatzie]

They're performing black magic. Plating copper on plastic.
It's done with either metallic ink or vacuum deposition and a thermal laminator. Either way it's not easy and takes some pretty expensive specialized tools along with the skilled people to set em up.
$84 is pretty good.
How does the plate thickness at the contact connection points compare to the original GM part?

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by hatzie

How does the plate thickness at the contact connection points compare to the original GM part?

Actually feels about the same, we'll see how well it works.

[Gregski]

dang it the local junk yards are having a 50% off sale yesterday and today but I'm not sure I'll be able to make it out there, sure could use a better radiator support