FITECH EFI 600 Basic and Command center intall with pics, factory tank

[steveo3318]

I had the plate on my carb setup for heat soak. I knew the efi didn't need it but knowing the ecm is on the tb I figured it wouldn't hurt to keep the heat off. Plus all my linkages where set up with the spacer so I figured why not. Not real reasoning behind it other than those and I like the taller carb look.

Now the single or dual intake is a hard one and prob best answered by someone else. Mine is an older Holley that is completely open right to the tb. In other words no divider. I feel like the dual plane is best suited for my needs for low end torque considering it's a truck and not a race car and rarely sees 6500 Rpms. But it does pull hard to 6500. I also feel that the open plenum is the main reason I didn't hurt two cylinders when that injector stopped firing. In a single plane it would of starved those two cylinders even at idle where my truck ran fine at idle and low Rpms. Again this is just opinions.

[snj8198]

Thank you for the info. I'm currently installing the same system on my 489 and am using an Eddie Air Gap dual plane which FITech assures me that the efi will work fine with. During my research I found some instances of the dual plane intake divider and port walls blocked the spray pattern resulting in some stumbling and performance issues. I think it's best that I just perform the install as is with the dual plane and deal with any issues later if they come up.

[steveo3318]

Yes the system is pretty robust in making its own corrective measures. If you feel one bank is leaner than the other just order a second o2 bung and swap the sensor and see if it changes any. Or run a seperate o2 sensor on the other bank like I do anyway to make comparisons. I do wish fitech would of made the system with two o2 sensors that averaged the data in logic yet still have seperate read outs.

[AnotherWs6]

Agreed that a 2 O2 sensor system would be much better. I have to assume this was not done due to cost and complexity. This is not a multiport system so think about it..... If it is reading that one side is spot on while the other side is lean and it is averaging the two readings it is going to sense a mild lean condition. Then it is going to compensate by adding more fuel. Then it is going to see that lean bank get corrected while the bank that was running good already goes rich, which is going to want to make it pull fuel and then you're back where you started.

snj8198 - An open spacer may help mitigate problems. Also, grinding down the divider or both. You're messing with how your manifold was originally designed to work, but it may be worth it. Aside from stumbling, etc issues, I like the fact that the system was able to compensate when steveo lost an injector. Depending which bank it was on he could have easily lost a motor if his intake was completely divided.

[steveo3318]

I program for a living. Building the average block logic and viewing the 2o2 sensors separately would not of been hard at all considering the other logic and pids the system already has. Build a parameter to use one or two o2s and build another side loop watching differential of the two. If they get to far apart throw a code and start checking sensors then injectors and on and on. You could essentially use it like a multiport adding fuel to either bank that needed it just not each cylinder. That on the other hand would be duplicating the first control of the o2 and making them seperate yet work in conjunction for overall outcome. Lol

[AnotherWs6]

But you would have to ensure that there were separate banks to begin with. Which means that all the people with single plane manifolds are out. It would be limited to divided dual planes. How else would you create separate banks? And now the "you can throw this on anything with a carb easily" goes out the window. Cost and complexity, cost and complexity. I'm sure they weighed the options.

[steveo3318]

I agree completely. But I think it would only work on single planes. Not dual. A dual feeds both banks from each side. A single feeds one bank from one side. Is that correct???

[AnotherWs6]

My understanding has always been that a dual feeds from the opposite side of the bank which would mean that it would only work on duals. A single plane is essentially an open plenum. The dual planes cross over the engine in order to lengthen the runner. Long, narrow runners = low end torque. Short, wide runners (direct shot at heads) = high rpm power.

The picture of this Edelbrock Super Victor illustrates the idea well. Each cylinder is being fed with the shortest path to the carb as possible. No twists and turns, crossing over etc. Now what would happen if you put a divider right down the middle of that thing to create two banks?

[snj8198]

snj8198 - An open spacer may help mitigate problems. Also, grinding down the divider or both. You're messing with how your manifold was originally designed to work, but it may be worth it.

Thanks, the Edelbrock RPM air gap does have the divider ground down about 3/4". I have the same 1" spacer as Steveo as well to play with.

I think for starters it will be a good idea to get the system mounted, running, and get some miles on it to see if any problems arise before making modifications if any are necessary.

Thanks for the info guys, all good stuff. Should be up and going in a couple days.

[steveo3318]

Ahh. I smell what your stepping in. The only way it would work correctly is a single plane with a divider. A dual plane still feeds both banks off one side

[AnotherWs6]

Gotcha. I was halfway close with my dual plane thought process, lol. So divided single plane. And that means a newly designed intake manifold, which begins the whole cost increase thing. Plus the extra O2 and wiring. More complex programming. FItech's niche seems to be simple/easy, inexpensive, no major mods needed.

That being said, monitoring and tuning based off of one bank is leaving a major hole unplugged. But if everything is working correctly it SHOULD work just fine.

[steveo3318]

Yes we were both half way there. Maybe we should build our own system with an intake. Lol.

To solve the single bank o2 hole you can always do what I am doing. I am running a seperate afr gauge on that other bank. All I am doing is using it to make comparisons against the fitech. They stay fairly close to each other. Now if I have an injector fail I should see the bank it failed on. it's just a cheap innovative gauge and o2 I have had for years that I used to tune my carbs. I keep it hid under the dash until I want to make comparisons I just pull it out.

[AnotherWs6]

Lol.

What you're doing makes sense, especially if you have the extra gauge and sensor laying around. I bought a new carb 6 months ago and then ordered a pair of 02 sensors and gauges along with a bunch of other stuff 6 weeks ago. THEN I came across Fitech. For the price of all this stuff I could have fuel injection???? I sent it all back thinking I can put that money towards the FI and sell the carb afterwards. That's how I came across your thread, researching. But I'm not totally convinced now, going to wait a while and see. In the mean time I got my $700 back for that stuff, it just felt like I would regret installing it after seeing this. We shall see.

[steveo3318]

I am not unhappy with the product by any means. My truck runs and cruises better than it ever has. Cold starts are a dream. Hot starts also. I just had one of the first runs with glitches in it. I have recently been adjusting my afr on cruise and I am seeing a good increase in mpg. It's a very good system.

[AnotherWs6]

I don't doubt that it's a good system when all is working. Reliability is a huge factor for me and I have read a decent amount about problems, especially with the fuel command center. And the FCC is one of the things that I really like about it, it truly makes this a simple install in the sense that you don't have to redo fuel systems, modify/change tanks.

I don't just pleasure cruise my truck. I commute in it and would like to start towing our camper with it. I also sit in a lot of traffic, so if the FCC doesn't like heat and it's 90 out while I've been doing literally 4mph for 45 minutes which happens sometimes........ Just makes me a little nervous.

Pop the hood after a good drive on a summer day and it is HOT under there. Feels like an oven, LOL. I don't think these trucks breath very well underhood.

[steveo3318]

Ahh I am picking up what your laying down now. When my pump got to hot I sit in one spot over an hr at idle with the ac on. Funny thing was the pump didn't die right there. It let me take off and get a mile down the rd and died. Now it came back on after 30 minutes cool down. Fitech did send me a brand new replacement which I have yet to install because after I told them what happened they told me the fuel pump idle parameter to lower because I am using the FCC and not an inline pump. The system comes set up for an inline with fuel returns. After I changed this I let the truck idle in the shop for an hr then drove it. Absolutely no issue on the same pump that crapped out the first time. So I am keeping the one they sent as a spare. Also they now have many many notes referencing to change that setting if you use a FCC. My 67 is my driver. I only have a company truck. I drive it everywhere and pull with it. I am not trying to sell you. Just giving you my experience with them.

[AnotherWs6]

That's good, pertinent information. I wonder if that was the cause of some of the other heat related issues I have seen referenced. Appreciated.

[steveo3318]

It seemed to be an ongoing issue that they felt was a big enough problem to start tagging the FCCs with a "this fuel idle parameter must be changed to -40 if the FCC is used". A lot of the problems are installer inflicted. Had a guy some how get my number and begged me to come find the problem on his system. After 20 minutes with a meter it was fixed. He ran the ignition source wire to an accessory plug which actually drops all power while starting. He couldn't get it to start without spitting and sputtering requiring a lot of throttle lol. Moved the wire and presto. Happiest guy in the world.

[AnotherWs6]

Very good information about the FCC. Sounds like the products were released with out having everything 100% nailed down which is understandable. Although when we, as consumers, spend money like what these cost we expect pretty much perfection. But these things are all designed by humans and we all make mistakes.

I am certainly leaning very heavily towards it. I posted a link to your thread on LS1tech.com on a thread I started inquiring about this stuff.

You say you're starting to see an improvement in MPG. What are you pulling down now? What about before? I'm pretty much spot on 10mpg right now in my Suburban. Gas is 3 bucks per gallon and I drive several hundred miles a week. It wouldn't take long to actually start saving money if I could improve a a few MPG. Hell, 13 would be OK. I can barely get that in my Silverado which is my other driver.

[steveo3318]

Keep in mind my truck is a factory 3 on the tree with a Borg Warner overdrive. I have 373 gears and in overdrive I am pulling 75 at about 2200 Rpms or so. When I had the quick fuel 750 on I was averaging 12 to 13 but I can't keep my foot out of it on take off. With the fitech I started seeing 15 to 16 immediately. Still playing at take off. I don't have any hard data on it since I have started raising the afr values in cruise but I do know this. My truck at cruise was running 13.5 afr "their safe default afr" and was running extremely low vacuum. Like 8-10. In other words staying loaded up. I change it to 17 and it ran like crap at cruise so I started backing it down. 16 afr in my 3000kpa parameter puts me about 15.4 real data at 75 mph. This raised my vacuum to 17-18. Since vacuum is a direct reflection of fuel consumption I will say it's better but I won't know how much until I fill up again. Also this may be my mind playing tricks but I swear the needle doesn't drop as fast on road trips. And it cruises a lot smoother with the higher afr. I am sure you have but for anyone messing with afr please please read up on it before you start changing parameters. You can and will kill your motor if you don't understand them.

[AnotherWs6]

I have a decent grasp on AFR's. Sounds like you're on the right track.

How does the system recognize that you are "cruising"?? From the TPS? TPS combined with RPM?

[steveo3318]

From what I can tell length of time at certain Rpms. I am not sure on that one. They won't let me have the software tool to look that deep. That's why if your actual cruise rpm is lower than their 3000kpa cruise set point you have to overshoot your set points.

3000kpa set to 16 = 15.4 afr for me at 2200. If I run the truck up to 3000rpms the 16 afr set point will kick in and run my truck at 16afr but it has to sense it's in cruise "closed throttle" and a time limit go by. Does that make sense?

[AnotherWs6]

Kind of. But what does 3000kpa mean?

I am imagining that it has some sort of acceleration mode as well as a WOT mode? or is it just accel and cruise?

[steveo3318]

3000kpa is the cruise afr parameter. It has 3 parameters plus you can get into the closed and open loop afr parameters

[Orange Crate]

Interesting stuff,thanks for the write up Steveo. I "play around" with FI myself, read your entire post and found the 3000kpa parameter curious. If it is vacuum (or pressure) that equals about 888 inches of mercury, now that's high pressure! So anyway, just wondering how Fitech uses that function if you care to elaborate anymore. I searched their web site but they aren't going into too much detail there.

Originally Posted by steveo3318

3000kpa is the cruise afr parameter. It has 3 parameters plus you can get into the closed and open loop afr parameters