Shop Truck refurb, code name Chaser

[joe231]

cool!

[spudz]

Originally Posted by RandyP

I was thinking the same, except maybe setting the idle just a touch higher instead. I dunno, gonna put a few 100 miles on it and maybe take it back to the guy and let him check it all again, and go from there.

to test my theory, draw a line on the distributer base and intake with a sharpie so you can set it back just like it was if needed. Loosed the bolt, crank it up and advance it till you hear the idle come up a little. tighten the bolt and drive... if its worse you can always go back to the marked spot. I think its too low because you say its sluggish off the line and the low idle.

[JohnC]

Originally Posted by RandyP

A few things I miss already between the 87 and my 05. Remote entry and auto headlamps. Call me spoiled, but I'm so used to having them it seems like roughing it putting the key in the door to unlock it or pulling the headlamp switch and more importantly, pushing it back in! I walked out of Atwoods with a big on my face tonight after leaving my lamps on while getting dog food.

Those are two things you get spoiled to real fast.

Glad to hear it's running a little better, hopefully you will get all the bugs worked out soon.

[RandyP]

Did not drive it home last night, the wife was complaining about it waking the kid up in the morning when I left for work at 6am.

I did notice today, they have added a new paragraph on the engine description for the crate engine we installed.

This engine is not intended for vehicles with fuel injection. This engine is designed for carburated applications prior to 1985. This 350 is GM Performance Parts value-leading crate engine, with 290 horsepower @ 5100 RPM, and 326 ft/lbs of torque @ 3750 RPM on 87 octane fuel. Its power will provide great durability with a 4-bolt mains, PM steel rods, and strong cast aluminum pistons. The camshaft has .450" intake and .460" exhaust lift with hydraulic flat tappets. The cast iron cylinder heads have 1.94" intake and 1.50" exhaust valves with 76 cc combustion chamber. The heads have the conventional 12-bolt intake manifold attaching design used from 1955 through late 1980. This 350 engine is not intended for marine use, and should be used in 1979 or earlier pre-emissions street vehicles or any off-road usage.

[joe231]

I'm pretty sure that disclaimer is due to legalities concerning emissions.
You aren't allowed to put an older engine into a newer vehicle. Luckily we don't have to worry about that here in Ok, yet....
Posted via Mobile Device

[RandyP]

See, I'm thinking since 86 and up require the ECM to properly manage the engine blah blah blah.

I'd still like to know why they say we can not just change the intake, put on an old school vacuum advance distributor, ditch all the of the electronics and ECM (could remove MAP sensor then I think?) and pretend it's a 1975 model under the hood. But, I've had more than one person (who is way smarter than me) say the vacuum issue would still be there and cause it to not run correctly.



I suppose tossing on the original TBI is our next step, still gonna drive it a while though and be certain.

[GmtGmt]

hmm isnt it the cam thats the problem since its not making enought vacuum?

[RandyP]

Yes it is. But I am not interested in tearing a new motor down and replacing a cam.

[justpball]

hey randy you can use paint thiner and take the gray off the bezels and then just leave the black on the grill, here is what mine looks like done like that...

[joe231]

I still don't believe vacuum is your problem. Where is the map vacuum line hooked up?

And I don't have a clue what those guys are smoking. This isn't a very radical cam, you can hook up a vacuum gauge and see if maybe you have a valvetrain issue.

If you swap out the intake and run a carb with a vacuum advanced distributor, you won't have an ECM or any of the related sensors.
Thats a step backwards IMO though.

I wish I were closer, I'd get to the bottom of your problem.
Posted via Mobile Device

[RandyP]

I know justpball, I like the charcoal in there though. I am interested in what you have for park lamps though, looks like LED?

Joe, it's settled then. I'll load up these parts you need and come see you next weekend and you'll fix it up. Mask your truck off and I'll shoot it while you do mechanical.

All I know is everyone (guys here in the TBI thread, guy at tbichips and the guys at the GM dealership) says that this engine with this cam and heads does not create the vacuum needed for TBI/MAP/ECM to work correctly.

I've owned several 86 C10's and 85/86 El Camino/Monte Carlos, always had new crate engines dropped in them. First thing I'd buy was a new intake, carb and HEI vacuum advance distributor. Yes it was going backwards in a sense, but it seemed to work so much better, especially the truck I put the 350/350 crate engine with aluminum heads. I miss that truck, it was an 86, which was sort of a year "on its own" for some reason engine wise.

[joe231]

Sounds like a plan!
I need to swap doors before paint though
Posted via Mobile Device

[RandyP]

Good news, drove it around today, took it to my boys birthday party at the park, went out for a drive on the highway and such. Ran out pretty good, without the A/C on it idled away at stop signs etc.

Bad news, she stopped running about 2 miles from the house. It just started acting like it was starving for fuel, stuttering and finally died going about 75mph. Got to the shoulder, cussed it and then cussed it some more. Finally got it to start after cranking and cranking and cranking and giving it peddle. Only thing is it would barely run if I kept feathering the gas, 10mph was about top end, talk about severe limp home mode. Got it back to the shop, thank goodness someone was there with an overhead door open. I was able to get it in the building, and there sits. Won't even try to fire over now.

Jumped in my 05 and came home. Guess I'll try to get it the 1/2 mile down to the dealership on Monday, with the old TBI in the front seat, and see what the guy says is wrong with it now.

[RandyP]

Do the TBI/EFI trucks have less spark than normal? My tech started looking it over this morning, verified it was getting a spray of gas (check), verified it was getting spark (was getting spark, not what he is used to seeing though he said, like it was weak), verified the coil pack was working (switched it out with another, same issue).
For some reason, we switched tanks and it started hitting. Sprayed some fluid in the TBI and it fired up and ran. Switched tanks again and it still ran. Now I'm wondering fuel filter (got one coming) or possibly the new tank selector switch is not that good (O'Reilly special). I know without a fuel selector switch in place, the truck will not run, just not sure what was causing it to be in severe limp home mode and then to not start at all. I suppose a clogged fuel filter could be the issue though, but I did see it spraying fuel when we were cranking it and it would not even try to fire over. Maybe it was not getting enough fuel or something, who knows.
Guess I'll toss the new fuel filter on it and put the old tank switch in the glove box with a small screw driver, just in case. If it does it again try replacing the switch and see if I can save a tow bill.

I'm just glad it did it 2 miles from the shop verses on the turnpike between Tulsa and OKC or something. Count your blessings, right?

[Jonboy]

Fuel pump in that tank could be laying down, too. I think the newer distributor should be putting out the same spark as an HEI, or hotter. If you could check fuel pressure if it dies out again will give you a place to start. That, ot maybe a bad connection at either the tank or switching valve?

[RandyP]

I had first thought fuel pump, but this thing has a fuel pump in each tank so switching tanks would have fixed it right away. So I dunno, but with a lot of the junk O'Reillys sells, I'm almost thinking this BWD aftermarket tank selector switch might be bad. Or I really did have a pretty severe clog in the filter. Or a combo of things and the stars were misaligned. Or the gremlin from someones suburban up in the Kansas City area (no names! ) ran away and found me.

[joe231]

Blame it on Michael!
That's funny right there!
Posted via Mobile Device

[joe231]

so, any update?

[RandyP]

Has been starting every morning and moving itself outside, but will die out at an idle after just a few minutes. Yesterday they put a new fuel filter on it, will see if that helps any or not. It's still up on the rack where they changed it out, have not had a reason to move it yet. Noticed a cracked valve cover (hair line, but cracked), dealer won't do squat about it, they can't even figure out what valve covers are on this engine (great collision parts guy, not a heavy line guy though). I am investigating aftermarket solutions right now for new valve covers though. Now I'm wondering if I actually need a cover with an oil fill hole and a vent hole. The vent that goes from the valve cover to the TBI right under the air cleaner, not sure I really need that? Is that not just a recirculation vent to try and get the engine to burn stuff up before it goes out the tail pipe?

So that's where we are. I don't want to drive it any length until I get the valve cover issue handled. I'm really afraid though I have nasty gas tanks. The fuel filter was nasty that they removed, lots of black fluid. I can just imagine what the pick up sock looks like.

[joe231]

As long as you are running a PCV, that extra vent isn't needed. I have been doing some reading on tbichips.com and they say to get rid of that spacer under the breather and put a open element 14"x3" air filter to improve air flow and seat of the pants performance. The way it's set up stock kills flow and forces all the air to flow straight down from above the injectors disrupting flow....I think
I might try it out.
Posted via Mobile Device

[RandyP]

Really on the filter? I've never liked the idea of the engine getting the intake air from under the hood, always kept the stock duct work so it gets what I would consider more fresh/cooler air.
I might take that spacer and go have the machine shop make me a solid ring without the vent tube built in to it.

Now to find some killer looking covers with CHEVROLET embossed on them. Maybe in a nice red or orange.

Really not looking forward to dropping the tanks though. Think I seen a cleaning kit somewhere that gets them refurbed inside more or less. Clean them out and then has some stuff that recoats the inside.

[joe231]

Yeah
They said the stock snorkel is restrictive for a 4 cylinder, let alone a v-8. The best way to go is an aftermarket dual snorkel with fresh air tubes but even an open element getting hot underhood air is a vast improvement.
Posted via Mobile Device

[RandyP]

Well after seeing some of these prices on valve covers.... *damn*

Not in my budget right now sadly. Guess I'll go shopping at O'Reilly or Advanced for a cheaper set of something with no name on them. Maybe I can get a set that I can paint with our automotive stuff and shoot them red.

[RandyP]

Forgot to mention I scored a tailgate yesterday. My junk iron man came carrying it in. He got it gave to him somewhere and knew I had one of these trucks, so he brought it to me, no charge.

Also, my motorcycle guy told me yesterday he was doing a quicky sticky complete for a friend on a jeep. I walk in to work this morning and found this in my paint booth.

[joe231]

Nice Jeep!

"quickie sticky"
That just sounds dirty

Nice score on the gate
Posted via Mobile Device