help (with a lot of venting) - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

cali_surfer · 03-23-2002, 05:18 PM

I'm having a bad weekend..... well week actually. I can't get my motor to stay running. Here's some history. I spent just about 2 years doing bodywork, chassis work, etc. without driving my truck (69 chev LWB) and I rarely ran the motor. The problem I'm having now is starting to seriously frustrate me, almost to the point of breaking down and just having it towed somewhere for someone else to deal with. This is serious because I've always done everything myself, me and my friend built the motor.

Whats happening is the motor is hard to start and VERY rich. I'm running an Edelbrock carb. Before I started my restoration the motor ran extremely well, just a tad bit rich at idle because I had to fatten it up a bit due to the cam, 234 duration @ .050". Now when I try to start it its like raw fuel being dumped in. So, I took the Edelbrock off, pulled off the top, cleaned everything with carb cleaner, adjusted the floats per the instruction manual, set the idle screws 2 turns out for a base line, and bolted it back on. I checked out my fuel filter and the gas looked kinda funky, so I drained the tank and put on a new filter. I also put on a new set of spark plugs, R45XLS.. as I'm running Edelbrock RPM heads (the bosch plugs that were on there were totally fouled). I ran out of time that day because it started to rain, so I waited a day to try to start it. Set the choke, and it fired right up. It ran for about 30 seconds until I noticed that my braided fuel line was leaking. Shut it down and dealt with that. I tried to start it again it did the same thing before I took the carb off. It was running so rich that it was smoking out of my dual exhaust. The passenger bank (#2468) seemed richer than driver bank. I couldnt get it running again even with choke shut. Pulled the plugs off again and they were dripping with fuel, but also had a mixture of black carbon lookin stuff. The odor was a mixture of both fuel and oil.

This leads me to where I am now. Its weird though, I want to think its a carburetor problem since its rich. But those Edelbrocks are so simple. I know my wires are good, I checked the resistance on each, they range from 950-1700 ohms (Accel 8.8s). I know the coil is getting power since it has run before, I'm assuming that the HEI module is fine since its run before? I set the timing to 10 degrees advance at idle when I got it running the first time. This is just driving me crazy. I really dont have the money to pay for anything mechanical since I'm trying to buy some new wheels and tires to get this 3 year old project finished, but it has to be road worthy before it gets the new rollers. I'm debating on whether I should pull off the intake and heads to see what kind of condition my cylinders/pistons are in. I'm sure sitting for over a year without being run wasn't good for it, but I didnt think it would cause any damage.

Anyone have anything to say that would make me feel better?? I have so much f#$%&*! cash in this truck I cant let a stupid problem like this get me down. I just want to drive it again!!!

ebfabman · 03-23-2002, 06:50 PM

You got fuel delivery problems. sounds like the needle/seat isn't sealing or you got the float set to high.

No way your plugs should have raw fuel on them. You should be able to figure this out on your own ( with the help of some board members)

Don't give up til its fixed, we will all be here for a while.

67 LWB · 03-23-2002, 07:08 PM

I had the same problem with my q-jet that my neighbor rebuilt for me. what happen was the float assembly came with two springs and one of them had fallen down between the needle and seat so the gas just kept coming in and flooding it. check for a little piece of dirt or something in there. DONT GIVE UP! I know what you mean about getting so pissed off you just want to call a scrap yard to come get the truck. I had to change out the crank and oil pump with the engine still in the truck and by my self. (That was not fun!) good luck
Devin

------------------
'67 C10 LWB FLEETSIDE, WEAK 305 UNTIL I CAN GET THE 400SB REBUILT, TH400, 3.73 REAR

SALEM, OREGON

http://www.freephoto-i.net/browse.ph...e=DCP_0003.JPG

sam's 72 · 03-23-2002, 07:14 PM

When you pulled the filter, you said the fuel look funky, then you drained the tank, and started over new again, only to find out you got the same problem. I would start back at the tank again, get it as clean as you can, gas turns to varnish after a long period of time then when you put new gas in, you get these small partical look dibre floating around, I would clean the tank the best you can, then get air, disconnect the fuel line at the carb, and at the tank and blow it out with compressed air, once this is done, then go into the carb, and check what ebfabman said, since you started it back up, I would check the filter again. I had this same problem one time with a boat. friend of mine bought a boat that sat for a year or so and this is what we did to get it running, it would be easy if you could get the tank out, but that is a job in itself.
Good luck
Sam

cali_surfer · 03-23-2002, 09:14 PM

The float isn't set too high.... I pulled them down some. I had never adjusted them before because when i built the motor and was driving the truck around.... about 3 years ago... the thing ran perfect. The level was at about 5/16-3/8"... so I pulled it down to 7/16" like Edelbrock wants. So do you think I should siphon the gas out again and try cleaning the tank? Also, what about the floats themselves.... from sitting for like a year in gas, would that cause them to develop a hole? This is just a hypothetical situation though, because when I pulled it off both floats sounded normal and didnt feel any heavier.

ebfabman · 03-23-2002, 09:28 PM

I would take another look at the needle/seat make sure its not damaged or got junk in it. make sure you have good filtration. I have "doubled up" on the filters as a short term "fix" when I knew there was junk in the tank.

cali_surfer · 03-24-2002, 09:28 AM

TTT

**68 Stepside** · 03-24-2002, 08:22 PM

I noticed you said it wouldn't start even with the choke ON after it ran the first time....if it's flooding out, you don't wanna use the choke, b/c it just richens the mixture even more.....

just a little tid bit....

68

Longhorn Man · 03-24-2002, 08:26 PM

Good point, throttle to the floor with out pumping will help on a flooded engine.

------------------
'69 G.M.C. 350/350. Trying to clean up the left over damage from the Dope-Smokin-Old-Man
I've been dubbed the Longhorn Freak/Fanatic/Expert, I just hope I can live up to it.
Need to pick up the one ton Longhorn with a PONTIAC 350/350soon.
Thanks every one!

Check out The Longhorn Webite.
If you need a pic posted, E-mail me at longhornmail@yahoo.com
Andy, in Columbus Ohio

Brad69 · 03-24-2002, 08:34 PM

You didn't by any chance put in a new "high flow" fuel pump during the rebuild did you? Just a thought, but the fuel pump pressure could be overdriving the springs. Otherwise the problem is somewhere in the carb bowl.

cali_surfer · 03-24-2002, 09:04 PM

Thanx for the responses everyone. The problem is now fixed!

ebfabman · 03-24-2002, 09:06 PM

Well you gonna tell us what ya did?

03-23-2002, 05:18 PM	#1
cali_surfer Registered User Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Chico, CA Posts: 1,136	help (with a lot of venting) I'm having a bad weekend..... well week actually. I can't get my motor to stay running. Here's some history. I spent just about 2 years doing bodywork, chassis work, etc. without driving my truck (69 chev LWB) and I rarely ran the motor. The problem I'm having now is starting to seriously frustrate me, almost to the point of breaking down and just having it towed somewhere for someone else to deal with. This is serious because I've always done everything myself, me and my friend built the motor. Whats happening is the motor is hard to start and VERY rich. I'm running an Edelbrock carb. Before I started my restoration the motor ran extremely well, just a tad bit rich at idle because I had to fatten it up a bit due to the cam, 234 duration @ .050". Now when I try to start it its like raw fuel being dumped in. So, I took the Edelbrock off, pulled off the top, cleaned everything with carb cleaner, adjusted the floats per the instruction manual, set the idle screws 2 turns out for a base line, and bolted it back on. I checked out my fuel filter and the gas looked kinda funky, so I drained the tank and put on a new filter. I also put on a new set of spark plugs, R45XLS.. as I'm running Edelbrock RPM heads (the bosch plugs that were on there were totally fouled). I ran out of time that day because it started to rain, so I waited a day to try to start it. Set the choke, and it fired right up. It ran for about 30 seconds until I noticed that my braided fuel line was leaking. Shut it down and dealt with that. I tried to start it again it did the same thing before I took the carb off. It was running so rich that it was smoking out of my dual exhaust. The passenger bank (#2468) seemed richer than driver bank. I couldnt get it running again even with choke shut. Pulled the plugs off again and they were dripping with fuel, but also had a mixture of black carbon lookin stuff. The odor was a mixture of both fuel and oil. This leads me to where I am now. Its weird though, I want to think its a carburetor problem since its rich. But those Edelbrocks are so simple. I know my wires are good, I checked the resistance on each, they range from 950-1700 ohms (Accel 8.8s). I know the coil is getting power since it has run before, I'm assuming that the HEI module is fine since its run before? I set the timing to 10 degrees advance at idle when I got it running the first time. This is just driving me crazy. I really dont have the money to pay for anything mechanical since I'm trying to buy some new wheels and tires to get this 3 year old project finished, but it has to be road worthy before it gets the new rollers. I'm debating on whether I should pull off the intake and heads to see what kind of condition my cylinders/pistons are in. I'm sure sitting for over a year without being run wasn't good for it, but I didnt think it would cause any damage. Anyone have anything to say that would make me feel better?? I have so much f#$%&*! cash in this truck I cant let a stupid problem like this get me down. I just want to drive it again!!! __________________ My engine is stock... trust me ;o)

03-23-2002, 07:08 PM	#3
67 LWB Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: COLORADO SPRINGS Posts: 102	I had the same problem with my q-jet that my neighbor rebuilt for me. what happen was the float assembly came with two springs and one of them had fallen down between the needle and seat so the gas just kept coming in and flooding it. check for a little piece of dirt or something in there. DONT GIVE UP! I know what you mean about getting so pissed off you just want to call a scrap yard to come get the truck. I had to change out the crank and oil pump with the engine still in the truck and by my self. (That was not fun!) good luck Devin ------------------ '67 C10 LWB FLEETSIDE, WEAK 305 UNTIL I CAN GET THE 400SB REBUILT, TH400, 3.73 REAR SALEM, OREGON http://www.freephoto-i.net/browse.ph...e=DCP_0003.JPG __________________ '67 C10 LWB FLEETSIDE, WEAK 305 , TH400, 3.73 REAR COLORADO SPRINGS, CO.

03-23-2002, 07:14 PM	#4
sam's 72 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Pasadena, Texas, USA Posts: 1,005	When you pulled the filter, you said the fuel look funky, then you drained the tank, and started over new again, only to find out you got the same problem. I would start back at the tank again, get it as clean as you can, gas turns to varnish after a long period of time then when you put new gas in, you get these small partical look dibre floating around, I would clean the tank the best you can, then get air, disconnect the fuel line at the carb, and at the tank and blow it out with compressed air, once this is done, then go into the carb, and check what ebfabman said, since you started it back up, I would check the filter again. I had this same problem one time with a boat. friend of mine bought a boat that sat for a year or so and this is what we did to get it running, it would be easy if you could get the tank out, but that is a job in itself. Good luck Sam __________________ 72 LWB chevy truck. Pasadena, Texas

03-23-2002, 09:14 PM	#5
cali_surfer Registered User Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Chico, CA Posts: 1,136	The float isn't set too high.... I pulled them down some. I had never adjusted them before because when i built the motor and was driving the truck around.... about 3 years ago... the thing ran perfect. The level was at about 5/16-3/8"... so I pulled it down to 7/16" like Edelbrock wants. So do you think I should siphon the gas out again and try cleaning the tank? Also, what about the floats themselves.... from sitting for like a year in gas, would that cause them to develop a hole? This is just a hypothetical situation though, because when I pulled it off both floats sounded normal and didnt feel any heavier. __________________ My engine is stock... trust me ;o)

03-24-2002, 09:28 AM	#7
cali_surfer Registered User Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Chico, CA Posts: 1,136	TTT __________________ My engine is stock... trust me ;o)

03-23-2002, 06:50 PM	#2
ebfabman Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Concord, NC Posts: 2,489	You got fuel delivery problems. sounds like the needle/seat isn't sealing or you got the float set to high. No way your plugs should have raw fuel on them. You should be able to figure this out on your own ( with the help of some board members) Don't give up til its fixed, we will all be here for a while.

03-23-2002, 09:28 PM	#6
ebfabman Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Concord, NC Posts: 2,489	I would take another look at the needle/seat make sure its not damaged or got junk in it. make sure you have good filtration. I have "doubled up" on the filters as a short term "fix" when I knew there was junk in the tank.

03-24-2002, 08:22 PM	#8
68 Stepside huh? Join Date: May 2000 Location: Washington, Illinois Posts: 5,692	I noticed you said it wouldn't start even with the choke ON after it ran the first time....if it's flooding out, you don't wanna use the choke, b/c it just richens the mixture even more..... just a little tid bit.... 68 __________________ Someday when I'm lonely, Wishing you weren't so far away, Then I will remember Things we said today. RIP El Jay

03-24-2002, 08:26 PM	#9
Longhorn Man its all about the +6 inches Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Hilliard Ohio Posts: 2,693	Good point, throttle to the floor with out pumping will help on a flooded engine. ------------------ '69 G.M.C. 350/350. Trying to clean up the left over damage from the Dope-Smokin-Old-Man I've been dubbed the Longhorn Freak/Fanatic/Expert, I just hope I can live up to it. Need to pick up the one ton Longhorn with a PONTIAC 350/350soon. Thanks every one! Check out The Longhorn Webite. If you need a pic posted, E-mail me at longhornmail@yahoo.com Andy, in Columbus Ohio

03-24-2002, 08:34 PM	#10
Brad69 Crash Test Dummy Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Wilton, Ca. USA Posts: 201	You didn't by any chance put in a new "high flow" fuel pump during the rebuild did you? Just a thought, but the fuel pump pressure could be overdriving the springs. Otherwise the problem is somewhere in the carb bowl. __________________ The more hair i lose, the more head i get. Build Sheet: 1969 C-10 short fleet Constructed by taking a 3/4 ton rolling frame from one truck, adding a rust free AC Cab from another, then a bed from another, 1/2 ton front suspension & brakes from another,add in one Goodwrench crate 350, painted DuPont Arctic White,and driven daily.

03-24-2002, 09:04 PM	#11
cali_surfer Registered User Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Chico, CA Posts: 1,136	Thanx for the responses everyone. The problem is now fixed! __________________ My engine is stock... trust me ;o)

03-24-2002, 09:06 PM	#12
ebfabman Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Concord, NC Posts: 2,489	Well you gonna tell us what ya did?



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