think I've decided on a suspension plan.....

[moregrip]

My idea is to have a nicely drop DD with a good ride quality while getting rid of all the old worn out suspension/steering parts.

the plan

Western Chassis Rear flip kit/no C-notch
Western Chassis rear shock extenders
DJM 3" front Upper and Lower Control Arms
Moog Coil springs (stock replacement) (will fine tune ride height by cutting coils as needed)
Stock length Bilstien Shocks all four corners
Stock 1 1/4 front sway bar/Urethane Bushings
Stock rear leaf springs/shackles with Urethane bushings/teflon lined

Moog steering components
McGaughys front wheel/brake rebuild kit


please critique

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Avoid drop arms like the plague and do spindles instead. Leave the leaf spring bushings rubber otherwise you introduce bind on corners.

Depending on how low you go stock length bilsteins may not work. They didn't for my truck as I had to use van shocks from the same year vans. The fronts I'm unsure of, haven't tried stock bilsteins up front

If you want you can get new coil springs up front just don't cut them for the first week till they settle down a little.

Djm spindles seem ok but I wouldn't buy anything else from them again.

I imagine your doing the popular 5-7/6 drop?

Djm arms don't correct geometry. Just look cool and are like stock arms with low spring pockets.
Posted via Mobile Device

[lolife99]

X2^^^
Good advice!

[wraprail]

I agree with insidious, you may not be able to use stock length shocks up front with the DJM lowers. If you did use the stock lowers with a stock spring (or close to stock) and a 3" drop spindle then I think you could use a stock length front shock. Plus, with a drop spindle you have more suspension travel and less metal hanging down to catch a speed bump, (as insidious pointed out) as you do with the lowered lower control arms. I think most everyone that is lowered has some type of drop spindle. Plus Plus if you go with a large wheel (18" or 20" even better) you avoid the danger associated with having any part of the truck below the bottom of the wheel rim which is common when using 15" wheels and drop spindles (and illegal in many states including california)
OK I said enough...

One more thing, if you do a flip kit I would consider a bolt in c-notch. While they are a pain to install compared to everything else, that little bit of added travel will make a big difference in ride quality if you haul or tow anything at all.
ok i'm finished...

[Tx Firefighter]

I'm running 3 inch spindles and one full coil cut off of used springs. All with stock front shocks. As a 250 pound corn fed guy, I can't bounce the front hard enough to bottom out the shocks. There's plenty of length to spare. My tires are short and they will hit the inner fender well before the shocks bottom.
Posted via Mobile Device

[ghettoluxury]

I have done a flip kit on my stepside with no notch and it sucks. The axle hits the frame a lot, even with new shocks. Once I blow the truck apart I will be adding a notch, so just give that some thought.

[Sodell]

^^^^ X3, use drop spindles.....

[Sodell]

Check out Project Platinum C10, I don't think he liked the arms he bought.

[moregrip]

Are DJM 3" drop spindles any worse than the others?

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by Tx Firefighter

I'm running 3 inch spindles and one full coil cut off of used springs. All with stock front shocks. As a 250 pound corn fed guy, I can't bounce the front hard enough to bottom out the shocks. There's plenty of length to spare. My tires are short and they will hit the inner fender well before the shocks bottom.
Posted via Mobile Device

which 3" spindles are you using?

[moregrip]

based on your wisdom, here is the revised plan:

Western Chassis Rear flip kit with C-notch
Western Chassis rear shock extenders
DJM 3" Drop spindles
CPP upper/lower control arms
Moog Coil springs (stock replacement) (will fine tune ride height by cutting coils as needed)
Stock length Bilstien Shocks all four corners
Aftermarket 1 1/4 front sway bar/Urethane Bushings
Stock rear leaf springs/shackles with Urethane bushings and teflon lined

Moog steering components
McGaughys front wheel/brake rebuild kit

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Don't forget van shocks for the rear. I'm running those with shock extenders right now with no c notch and it will get me just an inch past the frame if I notched. I'm dropped 8 inches in the back.

Why do you want aftermarket control arms? Affordable ones just armrest able to do what we want them to and the others are just expensive. You can move the lower 3/4 of an inch forward to gain castor and it will handle better than most bolt on stuff

Keep the inner sway bar bushing urethane and the outside rubber. The sway bar will bind with urethane ends as well
Posted via Mobile Device

[Sodell]

I am running same set up in front as TX firefighter. I replaced the entire front suspension and used new stock front shocks with no problems, rides great. I did have a slight problem with the DJM spindles and had to shave of a bit to get the calipers to fit, just fyi. Others on here are pretty adamant about spending the extra $100 on better drop spindles.

[CSGAS]

If you plan to do anything Street/Strip or anything performance related, you'll get more results you'll like out of Cal-Tracs on the rear leafs instead of poly bushings.

You can also make adjustments to the rear by removing (or adding) leafs to the pack.

Every suspension package should start with the point where the tire meets the road. Even if you are planning on using stock steel rims, determine what size, offset, etc they will be & how tall your tires will be. then determine the components that you have listed. Your recommendations may change if, for example, you have to move the wheel mounting surface in or out.

[lilpoindexter]

I have a flip kit on the back, with the metal bump stops removed, and a little mushroom bump stop bolted in...i may have bottomed out the rear once or twice, but that was for not using common sense when driving. I don't quite have the heart to cut the frame for notches, and i haven't needed to.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by lilpoindexter

I have a flip kit on the back, with the metal bump stops removed, and a little mushroom bump stop bolted in...i may have bottomed out the rear once or twice, but that was for not using common sense when driving. I don't quite have the heart to cut the frame for notches, and i haven't needed to.

Mines been the same. Having new shocks helped a lot.
Posted via Mobile Device

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

Depending on how low you go stock length bilsteins may not work. They didn't for my truck as I had to use van shocks from the same year vans. The fronts I'm unsure of, haven't tried stock bilsteins up front

I imagine your doing the popular 5-7/6 drop?
Posted via Mobile Device

What was the issue with the stock length rear shocks?

My goal is to get in the 3/5 to 4/6 range.

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by CSGAS

If you plan to do anything Street/Strip or anything performance related, you'll get more results you'll like out of Cal-Tracs on the rear leafs instead of poly bushings.

You can also make adjustments to the rear by removing (or adding) leafs to the pack.

Every suspension package should start with the point where the tire meets the road. Even if you are planning on using stock steel rims, determine what size, offset, etc they will be & how tall your tires will be. then determine the components that you have listed. Your recommendations may change if, for example, you have to move the wheel mounting surface in or out.

I've run Caltracs before and while the performance was great, they were to noisy for a DD to my ear. I'm looking for other options but that's more of an "in the future" issue for my needs.

[Rich84]

I have 3" djm drop spindles, stock shocks with 1.5" drop springs..Rides great..1 1/16 junkyard swaybar ($20) with black poly bushings made a huge difference.

Flip kit in the rear with no notch and no bumpstops. New leafs and drop shocks. Never bottomed out. Even driving carefully with an 800lbs. load. I think part of the reason some people say you need a notch is because they have worn leafs.

[kevinr1970]

Originally Posted by Rich84

I think part of the reason some people say you need a notch is because they have worn leafs.

I certainly wouldn't argue the point about worn springs
But when I converted my crew to a short bed, using the rear half of a 1/2 ton frame, I could stand on the frame rails and bounce up and down and make solid contact between axle and frame.
If I were to replace the springs, I would end up doing something to bring it back down to where it is now, like shackles?

I know it is apples and oranges, but I was told the same thing on my '06 GMC swb when doing hangars/shackles (4"), but it took all of about 3 days before I got so fed up with it hitting the frame I stopped driving it until I got it notched.

[kevinr1970]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

Keep the inner sway bar bushing urethane and the outside rubber. The sway bar will bind with urethane ends as well

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

Leave the leaf spring bushings rubber otherwise you introduce bind on corners.

Can you elaborate on this?
Not arguing, just wanting to understand.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by moregrip

What was the issue with the stock length rear shocks?

My goal is to get in the 3/5 to 4/6 range.

Stock length would bottom out and if I did a notch the notch would be useless the van shocks are the same just a shorter body
Posted via Mobile Device

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by kevinr1970

Can you elaborate on this?
Not arguing, just wanting to understand.

Best way I can explain. If you took say a three inch string and pined it on one side and moved the other side up and down you basicly get an arc. If you look at your truck from the side your swaybar does the same thing, swings in an arc as the control arm moves up and down. I you look how the ends are on a factory swaybar they resist this up and down movement and urethane is much worse. It basicly takes some efficiency away from the sway bar and makes a rough ride

As for urethane in the leaf springs and such they move side to side in a small arc as well. Urethane makes them not want to articulate and makes a stiffer ride yet.
Posted via Mobile Device

[moregrip]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

Stock length would bottom out and if I did a notch the notch would be useless the van shocks are the same just a shorter body
Posted via Mobile Device

Any idea what the van shocks measured full open end to end?

[moregrip]

Hopefully getting closer, please critique Version 3:

McGaughys 4/6 lowering kit
Porterbuilt 1" forward lower control arms/Stock upper control arms
Stock rear leaf springs/shackles with Urethane bushings/teflon lined

Moog steering components
McGaughys front wheel/brake rebuild kit

still shopping for shocks..............McGaughys specs a 13.5" front shock and a 18.5" rear shock for their kit.