The Official John Lee Jr Thread

[Sharps40]

Speakin of tool boxes.....them on the stepsides stepside look cool. Do they still make stuff like that or do ya have to go scrounging?

[TJ's Chevy]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

Speakin of tool boxes.....them on the stepsides stepside look cool. Do they still make stuff like that or do ya have to go scrounging?

You'd probably have to search the USA for one....I don't see many of those little tool boxes on the sidesteps on these trucks. Looks like most of them were mainly on the longbeds. Seems like youda be searchin fer a needle in a haystack to find one of them tool boxes! lol. I've been wantin one for mine to. I am thinking of making one.

[Sharps40]

Maybe I'll make one and spot weld it with the arc welder and hangers.

[TJ's Chevy]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

Maybe I'll make one and spot weld it with the arc welder and hangers.

That sounds good! YOU make it...I'll buy it from ya! Just kidding.

[Sharps40]

18.8 mpg on today's run with the most recent settings. About 18 corrected for speedometer errors.

Another tweak and a fresh tank and try again.

[Sharps40]

Today is the one year anniversary of the Death of Ol John Lee. Folded and squashed in a full on frontal assault by Unlicensed, Uninsured, UnCitizens.

Long Live Ol John Lee, he's out there rollin as a part of 15 other trucks now, including John Lee Jr!

[TJ's Chevy]

Originally Posted by Sharps40

Today is the one year anniversary of the Death of Ol John Lee. Folded and squashed in a full on frontal assault by Unlicensed, Uninsured, UnCitizens.

Long Live Ol John Lee, he's out there rollin as a part of 15 other trucks now, including John Lee Jr!

Uh...Pardon me if I am wrong...but are you sayin that Jonh JR is rollin as part a 15 other trucks as well??? I ain't quite gettin somethin here....

[Sharps40]

Yep. Ol John Lee got parted out like an organ donor.

[Sharps40]

Well, the Stovebolts air cleaner served well. A paper element under a spun aluminum dome originally, then trimmed so the element was exposed....here's how I've run it on John Lee for a good lil while now.



And it looks okay...just a bit out of place......and a dirty paper element, not to mention small surface area for air to come in.....

Heres a Specter, filter top, in Blue no less. I know which one I like better.....good thing the 9" Specter has a 5 1/8" base opening....perfect fit on the Stovebolts weber air cleaner adapter......No more changing filters for me and .... its Blue!




Hmmmmm....whats that sucking noise unner my hood when I slam in the secondary? Oh yeah, a Weber DGEV that breaths easier!

[TJ's Chevy]

Good work! I am gonna change to a 14 inch air cleaner one day..but for now the 10 inch works fine....even though its probably makin it a pain fer the monster carb underneath to breath. lol.

[Sharps40]

I like it...its the same color as the truck and the motor and the Blu Goo that holds it all together. John Lee, singin the blues.

[Sharps40]

I think tomorrow morning Garmin is gonna tell me if my math is any good.

The tranny came with a 9 tooth speedo drive gear and a 20 tooth driven gear. With 3.73 out back it left me showin 70 mph on the dial and actually moving 55 mph.

So, I modified a 24 tooth gear (cause there ain't no 25 tooth gears to be had on the whole planet for a GM T5) but that wasn't real satisfactory.

I calculated I needed 25 teeth to correct the speedo about 25 to 28% slower so it would read accurate. 24 teeth nearly did the trick.....leaving my speedo reading about 7% faster than I was really going.....but the gear had to be reduced in diameter (there are three sizes depending on the drive gear and my drive gear needs the smallest size but the 24 and 25 tooth driven gears are the larger ones!) and the teeth recut deeper by hand...a lot of work and still pretty off. The math, in this case, works out to a bit more than 5% reduction in speedometer indication for each tooth added to the driven gear.

Running a true 60 mph registered as 64 to 65 mph on my speedo.

So, because the bullet leaked, still, even with goo cause ya can't goo the inner seal....and because it was still off quite a bit at the speeds I'm driving these days with the new tranny.....I ordered a ratio reducer.

26.7% reduction which I think is also called a .7333333 or some such by the label on the side.

Got it all in....new bullet with oring, which still wobbles in the hole cause the hole is egged out....so I gooed the new bullet in place. But at least it has a new inner seal and that fits good on the driven gear.

I put the original 20 tooth small diameter driven gear in the bullet....it should run smooth and long on the 9 tooth drive. Its teeth and diameter are a much better fit.

Snugged the ratio reducer onto the bullet....rerouted the 83" cable (the 72 chevy 4WD cable is used for the T5 swap and its dayum near too long!) for smoother bends and hooked it to the ratio reducer.

I ain't brave enough to test drive it tonight. If I'm wrong, expensive mistake and I'll be up all night cursin. But if my math was right and everything works, the smooth running well fitting 20 tooth driven gear will drive the cable 27ish% slower giving me a truer indication of mph at the speedometer.

I sure hope so.....

[Sharps40]

Looks like my math was pretty good.....The speedometer corrects (with the instock 27.3% ratio reducer) to within about 2 or 3 mph against the GPS. It appears I am actually going about 62ish per Mistress Garman when my speedo needle is bouncing around the 60ish mark.

So, the speedo now reads a touch slower than I am actually going. Not bad and certaintly better than the 6ish mph higher than actual speed that I was getting before....

So....I'm going to drive it for a while, watching Mistress Garman untill I am confident that I have the new numbers figured right.

And, perhaps, if I can find one cheep, I'll try a 19 tooth driven gear. Math indicates that with the ratio reducer installed this should get me spot on (within a few tenths of a percent). Course, its hard to tell how perfect is perfect with an old and somewhat bouncy needle!

Its hard to make fine adjustments with such coarse gears. Guess thats why a lot of em have much higher tooth counts these days.

[Sharps40]

So, New engine, would not run well below 18 degrees BTDC and I did not know my mechanical curve in the dizzy nor the vacuum advance rating. Fortunatly, I got some good advice here and figgured those out....18 mechanical + 10 on vacuum advance. That particular thread didn't go well, was particularly frustrating for lack of documented/actionable data points for a stock motor with minnor reliability upgrades and I deleted the info and will attempt to clarify how I located what I believe to be a safe and adaquate engine tune here.

I started over several weeks by driving on hi test only and examining all functions in the engine as time and work allowed. Its a daily driver and as such a tune what ya got proposition.

The first fix implemented was to return to stock jetting on the Weber....The first engine ran well there with both points and electronic dizzys and I knew it was adaquatly rich to keep me out of trouble.

I then corrected the pcv system with a new valve installed with the arrow pointing to the source...no more uncontrolled vacuum hole there....still wouldn't run well below 18 BTDC initial.

I corrected smaller leaks at the 3, 4 runner and at the adapter to manifold junction. Now it would run well at 16 BTDC...tweaked the jetting IAW Mr. Langdons recommendations. (Factory idle circuit jet, slightly leaner on the main, much richer on the secondary)...engine ran great, thought I was done.

But, I was at 16 BTDC and "knew" the factory inital was 4 BTDC. I never considered that 4 was for points.......still didn't know if an HEI was different and didn't know the mechanical or vacuum advance.

Followed some advice, between the frustrating moments and mapped out my Dizzy, finding it brings 18 degrees mechanical to the table and the vacuum can brings another 10 degrees.

Considering how well it was running as newly rejetted (18 + mpg smooth and powerful) I was still concerned about being at 16 to 18 BTDC.

So, I lowered the initial advance in increments. First 14 BTDC, ran better and it stopped kicking back against the starter as it would occasionally do on hot restarts at 18 BTDC.

Then tried 9 BTDC (Still didn't know there was a difference in factory inital timing between points in the 60s and electronic in the late 70s) and it ran great but was weaker at low speeds, especially cold.

Then went to 4 BTDC, the factory points initial advance recommendaton for many 250s thru the early 70s. Ran okay but was weak across the entire rpm range and sucked fuel like a BarPig on cheep wine every Payday Saturday Night.

So....now suspecting a range of 9 to 14 was more correct for the engine as currently outfitted I reset to 10 BTDC. (10 initial + 18 mechanical + 10 vacuum brought 38 degrees total to the table and it was comeing all in by 3000 rpm as indicated by movement of the marks on the balancer under the timing light....figgured this out with a bit more advice after weeding back thru a rather frustrating thread on engine tuning.) The truck ran great here.

How wonderful it was to finally receive confirmation from a member in the form of a photo (from a haynes manual) of the timing specifications for a Chevy truck 250 with a stock GM HEI.....factory recommendaton for my late 70s engine and similar era HEI was in fact 10 degrees BTDC! Now we're getting somewhere, actionable and documented information for a daily driver stocker with HEI, confirmation, not frustration, not remachine to race engine set up, not timing is easy so close the hood and enjoy the ride....

Comfortable now, I increased the timing a small step.....9 to 14 seemed about right from driving and performance, 10 was factory and drove/felt well, so I selected 12 degrees BTDC. Went out for a drive. Made it to 80+ mph before I backed off. Couldn't get it to ping. The engine seemed alive...pulling hard on the main and harder on the secondary in all gears and without rattle, clatter or any hesitation. Plugs, though hard to read, showed some indications of tanning up and none of the black or silver flecks that I am told are a sign of detonation.

So I have set my engine 12 initial + 18 mechanical + 10 vacuum advance for a total timing of 40 by 3000 rpm. With the T5 transmission, I tach 2800 rpm at 75 mph. Its unlikely I'll ever break 3000 rpm. It appears we are going to remain in the 18 mpg range for this set up.

I'm about 200 miles down the road now on this setting...plugs still look fine and I am pleased with the performance and fuel mileage.

[1963c-10]

Bowtie bits can rebuild your speedometer for you. Pretty good turn around time also. I've had a few done by them.

[TJ's Chevy]

My speedometer bounces up to 90 mph when I am at 70! LOL!

[Sharps40]

Originally Posted by 1963c-10

Bowtie bits can rebuild your speedometer for you. Pretty good turn around time also. I've had a few done by them.

I've actually been thinkin of updating the dash....not sure yet...gotta get a sliding window and floor mat first. When I do, I'll have to choose between cable, electronic or gps speedos....so many choices and I didn't win the lottery yet!

[1963c-10]

Theres a sliding window on the classifieds Rich.

[Sharps40]

Its too big! Nice price though and looks in great shape.

[Sharps40]

I have setteled on engine timing for my new late 70s stock 250 reman with similar era GM HEI and Weber DGEV. The first motor suffered cracked pistons from too much initial timing and way too lean on the jetting in the carb. In addition, it had a massive vacuum leak in the form of a defective and upside down PCV valve. We compensated for the leak at idle with a large idle circuit jet but it still left the engine way too lean at critial moment. I did not recognize detonation, nor hear it but looking back I did see the black and silver flecks on the plugs are an indication of detonation in an engine. Lesson Learned.

[Sharps40]

With luck, I can get my fuel lines replaced this weekend and insulated and an oil change. Hopefully then I can close the hood for a few weeks and focus on finishing up the rebuild of the rear suspension.

[TJ's Chevy]

I run 92 octane in my truck. Mainly because of the large carb and really hot spark, 65000 volts needs lots of octane to burn. Lol.

[Sharps40]

Dropped in a 19 tooth driven gear today and road with Missy Garman. With the ratio adapter looks like the ol speedo is close enough to dead on that I finally will be readin accurate speed and miles. Math works even though the spedo shop said it couldnt be done by checkin gear counts an usin a ratio calculator. Ha!

[TJ's Chevy]

Well at least yer truck ain't sheriff bait any more.

[Sharps40]

What is sheriff bait?