Radio speaker questions

[Russell Ashley]

I am considering this speaker and housing from LMC and wondering if anyone has used one like it. I'm also wondering how difficult it will be to get the wires up to it. I'll also be using kick panel speakers as my tank is still in the cab and there's not much room any place else for speakers.

http://www.lmctruck.com/icatalog/ca/full.aspx?Page=56

[57chevyman]

i have 38-8512 dual front speaker installed in my truck with a retrosound radio. luckily for me the wiring was already in the pillar, so I didn't have to run the speaker wire. The dual 4" speakers are better than nothing, but its all about the treble, no bass lol

I installed a compact kenwood ksc-sw11 powered subwoofer under the seat on the passenger side and it sounds so good, I never bothered to look into kickpanel speakers.



heres a link for the subwoofer...
http://www.amazon.com/Kenwood-KSC-SW11-Compact-Enc...

[Russell Ashley]

That's the same radio I have. I really don't expect too much out of that top front mounted speaker as it's too small but seems like it would be about the best place for a speaker in these trucks. Between the wind noise and my poor hearing it would probably suffice for me. I'm concerned about getting the wires up to it though.
Just curious, is there anyone on the forum that has actually fished the wires up to one of these speakers?

[CMFT]

I'm not at home right now, so I can't pull my speaker housing to measure the speakers. But can anyone tell me if they are 3.5" or 4" speakers in the housing above the windshield?

[58CameoAZ]

Originally Posted by Russell Ashley

That's the same radio I have. I really don't expect too much out of that top front mounted speaker as it's too small but seems like it would be about the best place for a speaker in these trucks. Between the wind noise and my poor hearing it would probably suffice for me. I'm concerned about getting the wires up to it though.
Just curious, is there anyone on the forum that has actually fished the wires up to one of these speakers?

Russel
I have not fished the wires to the speaker but have done the dome light and what i ended up doing was tying a small lead fishing weight to a piece of fishing line and dropping it down threw the hole for the sun visor and then down threw
the pillar
i would think you could fish the wire both ways down and then over to the middle speaker location
I know that it would be easier then fishing the wire all the way from the visor location and then to the dome light that i ended up doing
I remember it took awhile before i could get it all the way over to the dome light location
Good Luck
Allen

[CMFT]

Got home and confirmed that the speakers are 3.5". You can buy some good quality 3.5" speakers for cheaper that the ones listed on LMC. I ordered a set of Kicker's today.

[57chevyman]

Originally Posted by CMFT

Got home and confirmed that the speakers are 3.5". You can buy some good quality 3.5" speakers for cheaper that the ones listed on LMC. I ordered a set of Kicker's today.

yeah I was guessing 4". I was close lol. I highly recommend the under-seat kenwood subwoofer. for around 150 bucks, it makes a huge difference. it was very easy to hook up using the rca outputs from the radio.

[Russell Ashley]

I ordered the chrome speaker housing for the top front from LMC but didn't order the speakers as I want to get some better ones. I was a little worried about getting the wires up to the speakers but realized that most of the radios that came in these trucks were installed by the dealer so that tells me it's definitely possible.

[CMFT]

I ordered a pair of Kicker 40CS354 3.5" 90-watt (each) 2-way speakers on Ebay. Paid $36.99 with free shipping. The Custom Autosound speakers that were in my housing didn't sound good at all, and I'm pretty sure that is what comes in the $39.99 set that LMC sells. I'll have to figure a way to mount the Kicker's, as they don't come with the black insert like the LMC ones, but it won't be that big of a challenge.

The Kicker's won't have to be all that great to be better than the ones I have now, so I'm confident I'll be happy.

[OrrieG]

When I pulled my new dome lighting I just ran relative stiff 16 ga wire up the a pillar from the bottom to use as a pull wire. Took a few minutes to find the right path, but not that big of a deal, used a hooked coat hanger to grab it after it cleared the pillar.

[Dan in Pasadena]

Are you guys all talking about a PAIRof little speakers in one of those chrome square boxes centered above the windshield? I never "got" those except for AM radio. Why NOT use high quality kick panel speakers? That's what I've always planned to do and now that Frank posted that under seat Kenwood unit I think that would make a great compliment to a good pair in the kick panels.

[Russell Ashley]

I will get two good speakers to mount in the box above the windshield, but I did "wimp" out and order a set of Custom Autosound kick panels with speakers. Granted, four inch speakers aren't going to provide the sound that a real audio-phile would be satisfied with but I think having good speakers in the front box should help. That's how I'm going to start out and if I'm not satisfied with the results I can add the subwoofer.

[57chevyman]

It's like night and day when you add the subwoofer. It has a remote volume control so you can add just enough bass to make it sound good.

[CMFT]

Dan,

Yes, we're talking about those tiny speakers in the chrome housing by the rear view mirror. I am running an LS motor and my computer is mounted in the driver's kick panel, so I don't have the liberty of space for kick panel speakers. To supplement, I'll be running a pair of JL Audio 6x9's in each corner behind the seat and plan to add a sub at some point in the future. I may go with the sub that has been linked in this thread (or similar), or a shallow mount 10" sub, but I haven't figured that out yet. I think the small speakers will be a good addition to the system once it's complete.

Originally Posted by Dan in Pasadena

Are you guys all talking about a PAIRof little speakers in one of those chrome square boxes centered above the windshield? I never "got" those except for AM radio. Why NOT use high quality kick panel speakers? That's what I've always planned to do and now that Frank posted that under seat Kenwood unit I think that would make a great compliment to a good pair in the kick panels.

[_Ogre]

[OrrieG]

Here's mine, set up for 5" speakers. Also putting 5x9 in the corner behind the seat. Subwoofer is a contigency.

[tmoble]

Orrie, what seat do you have in your truck? Looks good, has belts. Maybe I should go run through your build thread.

[OrrieG]

07 Yukon third row, I liked the flip easy removable feature and buildt in belts. There is also a third lap belt. Look earlier in my build thread has detail on the mounting. They are not as plush as the driver seat and I haven't rode for any distance, but I've been told I can be a hard-a** so probably ok.

[CMFT]

These Kicker's are too deep. I didn't think to check depth when I ordered them, dumb on my behalf. You need a speaker with a depth of roughly 1.75" or less. Found a pair of Kenwood's at 1.5" top mount depth, so I'll try those next.

Originally Posted by CMFT

I ordered a pair of Kicker 40CS354 3.5" 90-watt (each) 2-way speakers on Ebay. Paid $36.99 with free shipping. The Custom Autosound speakers that were in my housing didn't sound good at all, and I'm pretty sure that is what comes in the $39.99 set that LMC sells. I'll have to figure a way to mount the Kicker's, as they don't come with the black insert like the LMC ones, but it won't be that big of a challenge.

The Kicker's won't have to be all that great to be better than the ones I have now, so I'm confident I'll be happy.

[Russell Ashley]

Originally Posted by CMFT

These Kicker's are too deep. I didn't think to check depth when I ordered them, dumb on my behalf. You need a speaker with a depth of roughly 1.75" or less. Found a pair of Kenwood's at 1.5" top mount depth, so I'll try those next.

Thanks for posting that info. I haven't gotten the housing yet and was wondering how tall the speakers could be.

[joedoh]

the secret to getting any kind of sound from a speaker is the baffle, and an enclosure is even better. I was a car audio installer for year, once I saw a guy use a KFC bucket for an 8" woofer and it sure sounded better than just sitting in the hatchback.

it has to do with the way a speaker makes sound, moving a cone back and forth propagates a sound wave. both the front and rear of a speaker make identical sound waves, unfortunately the rear wave is exactly 180 degrees out of phase from the front. since identical sound waves 180 degrees out of phase from each other CANCEL one another, you lose most of the sound energy (not all, more on that in a second). This is the principle that almost all active noise cancellation is based on, a mic listens to ambient noise and adds an identical wave 180 degrees out of phase to the playback. you dont hear the added wave because the original wave cancels it, and vice versa.

Cancellation without a baffle or enclosure is most noticeable at lower frequencies because they are omni directional, meaning every which way at once. Higher frequencies tend to be very directional, and so that means it is harder for the back wave to get around and cancel the front. So now you know why a speaker playing in open air sounds so tinny.

if you cant get a full enclosure around the speakers, at least make sure the front wave is separated from the back, which means as much distance as you can before any gaps that will allow the sound wave to cancel. If you use that mounting plate with the two speakers in it, get some closed cell foam tape and make sure it is sealed to the dash if possible.

I also would recommend these, xtc baffles, on smaller speakers.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-xeLwgU6...3-4-depth.html

what also works is if you buy a nice tupperware and spend time sealing the speaker(s) into it. dont forget wire!

for larger speakers, the xtc baffles can limit bass response, so an add on sub like the one 57 chevyman posted is a good idea. I am a big fan of getting the front speakers playing loudly and clearly with baffles and then putting a nice pair of 6x9s in some boxes under the seat (facing forward), you should be able to rock it pretty loud from just head unit power. With all the metal reflective surfaces it will be tough to do anything "audiophile" in it.

kick panel speakers work well and sound great because you are equalizing the path lengths a sound wave has to travel. With those two dash speakers in the center, there is almost no stereo separation. with later trucks and speakers in the corners of the dash , the path length from the drivers side speaker is more than half as short as the passenger, so you "hear" the drivers side information sooner than the passenger. with kick panel speakers you have made it more like 4/5ths the distance between each so you get a nice stage as long as you keep the tweeter (directional high frequency!) point at you.

once we experimented with a pair of speakers mounted slightly in front of the seat pointing at the windshield. Other than being blocked mostly by the driver and passenger legs, it had really good stage.

[Russell Ashley]

Just thought I'd open this back up now that I have installed my speakers and show what I had to do to get them installed. I was sure that I wanted to use the original style top front speaker but couldn't find any speakers that were shallow enough to fit entirely into it, so I ordered the two speaker set that LMC sells that is made to fit the housing, but they are too tall for it too. There doesn't seem to be any other choice but to cut the cab header if you want to use the original style speaker enclosure. It worried me to do it but these pics show what I had to do. As the saying goes, measure multiple times, cut once:


I use a length of number ten wire to fish down through the A pillar from the sun visor hole and pulled the speaker wires up with it. It was easy to get the wires from the visor hole to the center hole.

There is a notch in the housing that fits over the mirror bracket so the location is fixed. The mirror seems to be a little off center as the left visor is closer but it had to go there.



I also used the Custom Autosound kick panel speakers. The left side was not bad but the right side would not fit between the VA a/c unit so I had to trim quite a bit off of the top rear of it. It doesn't show as the a/c unit hides the part where I trimmed it.



I was hesitant to cut the cab header that much but now that it is done I'm glad I took the chance. It sounds better than I expected.

The holes gave me a good window into the cab, and I was happy to see that my cab is virtually rust free in the top.

[roger55]

[Russell Ashley]

I have used those Pioneer speakers before, but my gas tank is still in my cab so had to do something else this time. Your truck looks great.

[joedoh]

looks great!