truck doesn't start

[theredmeadow]

its a 70 c10 5.7l 350 regular/stock carb?
it's cranking but not turning over at all. it's been starting since yesterday and even last night but it's been having more and more trouble starting lately. cranking a lot just to start. its warming up here and shouldn't be a problem. well i noticed something weird about the choke? am I missing parts? here are pics of the carb? is there a missing spring on the choke? are there any pics you guys can post of what it's supposed to look like?
this is my daily driver so I need to get it up asap. you guys are geniuses so I know u can see the error.

[litew8]

"it's been starting since yesterday and even last night but it's been having more and more trouble starting lately."
idk about the choke, but unless it popped off for no good reason... Check for vacuum leaks maybe, some of that looks aged.

[cdowns]

clean up your points and set your gap then try it

[litew8]

Looking again, I now see where you think a spring is missing, where it connected. Maybe that's right. You don't see anything laying on top of the manifold? Google your carb for pics.

[theredmeadow]

Originally Posted by cdowns

clean up your points and set your gap then try it

what do you mean points?

[litew8]

Bruce88 wrote up some info.



If applicable:

Replacing Contact Breaker Points - YouTube

[TheSeeker]

The points under the distributor cap. They get corroded and worn out/burnt. A good working set is reliable, but tricky to set proper gap etc. Most guys I know run an HEI or pertronix type kit to do away with the points and condenser.

[theredmeadow]

Originally Posted by TheSeeker

The points under the distributor cap. They get corroded and worn out/burnt. A good working set is reliable, but tricky to set proper gap etc. Most guys I know run an HEI or pertronix type kit to do away with the points and condenser.

Could that be where a little smoke is coming out? Every time I try to start there's a little smoke coming from the engine, kinda in that area. I couldn't pinpoint it. It's not a lot but just a trace of white smoke.

[litew8]

doubt it

Do you have spark? Have you checked? Do you know how to check?

[LockDoc]

-
I don't think you can hook the hot wire from the electric choke to the coil. It may be shorting out your coil....

LockDoc

[litew8]

Oh, I hadn't even noticed that wire.

"What you do not want to do under ANY circumstances is take power from you coil or main distributor feed."
"It would be best to run a new wire into the car and plug it onto one of the accessory blades on the fuseblock where you see “IGN FUSED”. "
http://www.americanautowire.com/view...ed-to-do-this/



Maybe your coil or choke is fried now? You might have more than one issue going on there.

[RichardJ]

In the third photo, your finger is pointing to a rubber cap. That is the float bowl vent and shouldn't have a rubber cap. It should have a rubber hose that goes to the Charcoal Canister EVAP. Just below your finger in that picture there is a short arm hanging down with a small hole in it. There should be a rod that connects from there to another arm on the back of the electric choke. Without that rod, the choke isn't and hasn't been working so the 12volt connection can and should be removed from the coil and a better 12volt source can be located.

If you intend to be your own mechanic, you must have the proper tools. You need a dwell meter and you need a timing light. That isn't a debate and don't listen to anyone that tells you other wise.

You can adjust the ignition points with feeler gauges, but any explanation over the internet, even with Utube generally meets with failure 95% of the time. Point adjustment with feeler gauges is best with a hands-on demonstration. Adjusting the dwell with a meter is faster, easier and more accurate. Used dwell meters often sell for $10-15
Anytime you adjust the points, you MUST reset the ignition timing afterwards.

In your first photo, directly behind your knuckle is a metal window on the side of the distributor cap . You slide that window up for access to the points. You connect the dwell meter to the coil posts and adjust the dwell with an Allen wrench.


If you adjust the points with a feeler gauge or if you get an HEI distributor, you still need a timing light.

[theredmeadow]

Thanks Rich. This is a typical example of what the PO left me with. This isn't the first and definitely not the last time I'll find some half finished. I'm new to all this and I've been slowly trying to piece it all back together. So far it hasn't been too bad. All that being said, Rich, could this all be causing part of my problem? Can this really help out my truck once it's fixed?

Originally Posted by RichardJ

In the third photo, your finger is pointing to a rubber cap. That is the float bowl vent and shouldn't have a rubber cap. It should have a rubber hose that goes to the Charcoal Canister EVAP. Just below your finger in that picture there is a short arm hanging down with a small hole in it. There should be a rod that connects from there to another arm on the back of the electric choke. Without that rod, the choke isn't and hasn't been working so the 12volt connection can and should be removed from the coil and a better 12volt source can be located.

If you intend to be your own mechanic, you must have the proper tools. You need a dwell meter and you need a timing light. That isn't a debate and don't listen to anyone that tells you other wise.

You can adjust the ignition points with feeler gauges, but any explanation over the internet, even with Utube generally meets with failure 95% of the time. Point adjustment with feeler gauges is best with a hands-on demonstration. Adjusting the dwell with a meter is faster, easier and more accurate. Used dwell meters often sell for $10-15
Anytime you adjust the points, you MUST reset the ignition timing afterwards.

In your first photo, directly behind your knuckle is a metal window on the side of the distributor cap . You slide that window up for access to the points. You connect the dwell meter to the coil posts and adjust the dwell with an Allen wrench.


If you adjust the points with a feeler gauge or if you get an HEI distributor, you still need a timing light.

[litew8]

I doubt you have the charcoal canister, thus why that port is plugged. Do you know what one looks like? Have you read the other comments? Good luck.

[theredmeadow]

is there a way to find out what carb I even have? I can't see any markings on it.

[70SBC10BOB]

You are missing the choke actuation rod.

Look at the pics at this site. You can see the rod coming from your round black choke housing and goes to the bracket towards the rear of the carb.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j...98397554363167

No choke, it will be hard to start and drive until warm.
Sorry I could not just post the pic. I am computer challenged!

Hope this helps.

[theredmeadow]

with all these parts missing, is it possible to just buy the missing parts? also, for now should I just disconnect the red wire since it could be causing problems?

[litew8]

Yes, disconnect that wire from the coil (will = no choke).

If it doesn't fire at all: Check and ensure you have spark and go from there. It'd help if you had another person helping. Checking for spark: Unplug one of the wires from a spark plug. Stick a screw driver in the plug wire making contact with the wire inside. Try and lay the screwdriver in the plug wire near metal (not touching the metal) -leaving 1/16 of an inch or so away. Do not touch the screw driver! and have someone turn the truck over. While it's being turned over, look (do not touch) at the screw driver and see if you notice spark jumping from the screwdriver to the metal. If yes, you got spark, if no - you'll need to look further and figure out why (e.g. points/distributor comments above and or coil).

Check the carb for any set of numbers, then add the word 'carb' and google it. Example 65432 carb - see what shows up. Once you determine the carb name/type, do a google image search and see what happens. I don't know if you can buy the missing parts individually or not. You could maybe find one in a local salvage yard.

Hope this helps, I know what it's like to not have wheels.

[70SBC10BOB]

Your carb appears to be a later aftermarket Cart AFB or an early Edelbrock. I think they bought the design from Carter.

I would think the choke rod should be still attached to the back of the choke housing (the black thing that the red wire attaches to). If that's the case, I think it attaches with a hairpin clip.

Reconnect and move on.

[theredmeadow]

Ok I did the screwdriver test and there's no spark. Where I should I start? Whats next?

Originally Posted by litew8

Yes, disconnect that wire from the coil (will = no choke).

If it doesn't fire at all: Check and ensure you have spark and go from there. It'd help if you had another person helping. Checking for spark: Unplug one of the wires from a spark plug. Stick a screw driver in the plug wire making contact with the wire inside. Try and lay the screwdriver in the plug wire near metal (not touching the metal) -leaving 1/16 of an inch or so away. Do not touch the screw driver! and have someone turn the truck over. While it's being turned over, look (do not touch) at the screw driver and see if you notice spark jumping from the screwdriver to the metal. If yes, you got spark, if no - you'll need to look further and figure out why (e.g. points/distributor comments above and or coil).

Check the carb for any set of numbers, then add the word 'carb' and google it. Example 65432 carb - see what shows up. Once you determine the carb name/type, do a google image search and see what happens. I don't know if you can buy the missing parts individually or not. You could maybe find one in a local salvage yard.

Hope this helps, I know what it's like to not have wheels.

[theredmeadow]

I didn't disconnect the choke hot wire from the coil yet either. Think that would make any difference??

[litew8]

I'd retest and ensure there isn't spark. Having the screw driver too far away from metal would result in the spark being unable to jump if it were present. It has to be fairly close but not touching. If it still tested no spark, I'd check the distributor cap for wear and or replace it were obvious, then points, then coil. If you have the tools to test the coil, you could do that right away just to eliminate it. Not sure what tool that'd be though. Maybe others could provide other/better options.

Why not disconnect that wire to the choke? It's not linked, it isn't going to work anyway - if it works at all.

[theredmeadow]

I redid the test and put the two pieces of metals as close without touching. no spark. i removed the cap and it looks like a new cap, no bad corrosions and everything inside looks shiny new.

I didn't disconnect it because I didn't have my little sockets on hand.

Originally Posted by litew8

I'd retest and ensure there isn't spark. Having the screw driver too far away from metal would result in the spark being unable to jump if it were present. It has to be fairly close but not touching. If it still tested no spark, I'd check the distributor cap for wear and or replace it were obvious, then points, then coil. If you have the tools to test the coil, you could do that right away just to eliminate it. Not sure what tool that'd be though. Maybe others could provide other/better options.

Why not disconnect that wire to the choke? It's not linked, it isn't going to work anyway - if it works at all.

[theredmeadow]

can I do the same spark test with the wire from the coil??

[VetteVet]

One of the most common misconceptions about the electric choke is that it make the choke work. In fact it does just the opposite. The choke is really the plate in the top of the carburetor that closes when the accelerator is depressed when the engine is cold.

The black circular device is really a heater that releases the tension on the choke plate and allows it to open as the engine warms up. If the red wire is disconnected the choke plate will stay closed longer and cause the engine to run rich or flood out and stall.

You need to have key on hot wire to the electric choke heater but it should not come off of the coil ignition wire. I agree with what everybody else has said about this.

If you are not getting ignition spark from the distributor then everything else is moot. You need to resolve this first and then worry about the choke.

My recommendation is for you to find someone who is knowledgeable to teach you all this with hands on training.