wheel hop

[fink64]

i have a 64 c10 with a 9 inch ford rearend it has mickey thompson s 31x16.5x15 on it it wheel hops real bad just wondering what the best traction bar for this set up would be i know they come in differnt lenghts and didnt really know which brand would fit best or maybe some one has a better solution to the wheel hop. thanks

[fink64]

sorry i didnt mention that i have coil springs

[MOTOIMPAIRED]

Check your pinion angle, that could cause wheel hop...

[1Bad62Pro/Street]

Do you have a picture of your rear setup?

Competition Engineering : Tech Articles
HOW "WHEEL HOP" OCCURS
Rear Axle Housing Rotation Without Traction Control:

http://www.competitionengineering.co...es/chassis.asp

http://www.competitionengineering.co...s/chassis2.asp

http://www.competitionengineering.co...s/chassis3.asp








http://www.competitionengineering.com/default.asp

Ladder Bar system & Test Drive [S3-Ep.5-4] ...

[Captainfab]

If you have trailing arms and coils springs, a traction bar isn't going to do any more for you than the trailing arm already is.

I agree with checking the pinion angle, but from what I've read here in the "Racing and High Performance" section, a better shock should help. It seems that a Rancho 9000 adjustable shock is the prefered choice.

[LT1 Burb]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

If you have trailing arms and coils springs, a traction bar isn't going to do any more for you than the trailing arm already is..

Agreed, the trailing arm is the biggest traction bar setup you can get already.

[joedoh]

probably need some weight back there, thats a big tire and its going to need a lot of either weight transfer or directly acting weight to keep it planted.

[fink64]

heres some pics.thanks for all the advice. the video on the ladder bars was great do you think they would work for me with the coil springs and the trailing arms?and yes i know i have a break line leaking.going to go fix that right now.and the dust long gravel driveway. not lol

[ChrisDollins]

I've never raced a c-10 but on my f-body, relocation brackets helped. What the problem is, is the angle of tge arms are too shallow. Suspension hooks better when they angle up to the front. The stronger the angle on my car, the better it hooked. Maybe a bracket on the frame mount where the arms mount and raise it up a little. And pinion angle is a must to get right.

Chris
Posted via Mobile Device

[1Bad62Pro/Street]

fink64,

My questions would be what are you using your truck for?
What is your engine, trans and your rear end gear ratio?
Your rear end suspension set up needs to match all of that.
In drag racing power/torque produced by your engine must take a direct path to "planting" the tires and "launching" your truck forward. Any power that gets absorbed by the chassis and suspension is power that can’t be used to get you to the finish line as quickly as possible.
On my truck at one time I was going to have a 4-Link on my truck. Then I changed my mind and was thinking about Ladder Bars with Housing Floaters. Then me and my dad talked about rear coil overs and I liked it. So that's what we did. My dad actually thought up and made my rear end suspension.

350 cu in/TH350 400HP +/- a hair
Mustang II IFS Suspension with 2.00" Billet Aluminum Wheel Spacers.
'58 Ford Wagon 9” Rear End
(Non Narrowed) (Axle Length 57.25 inches) (3.70 Gear)
Wheelbase has been extended to 117".
Front wheels: Weld Racing Draglite 90-Series Wheel 15 x 7
Rear wheels: Weld Racing Draglite 90-Series Wheel 15 x 12
Front tires: Falken Visa 912 Tires - 758 P215/65R15 96H
Rear tires: Mickey Thompson Sportsman Pro Tire, 29x15.50-15LT

[fink64]

Originally Posted by 1Bad62Pro/Street

fink64,

My questions would be what are you using your truck for?
What is your engine, trans and your rear end gear ratio?
Your rear end suspension set up needs to match all of that.
In drag racing power/torque produced by your engine must take a direct path to "planting" the tires and "launching" your truck forward. Any power that gets absorbed by the chassis and suspension is power that can’t be used to get you to the finish line as quickly as possible.
On my truck at one time I was going to have a 4-Link on my truck. Then I changed my mind and was thinking about Ladder Bars with Housing Floaters. Then me and my dad talked about rear coil overs and I liked it. So that's what we did. My dad actually thought up and made my rear end suspension.

350 cu in/TH350 400HP +/- a hair
Mustang II IFS Suspension with 2.00" Billet Aluminum Wheel Spacers.
'58 Ford Wagon 9” Rear End
(Non Narrowed) (Axle Length 57.25 inches) (3.70 Gear)
Wheelbase has been extended to 117".
Front wheels: Weld Racing Draglite 90-Series Wheel 15 x 7
Rear wheels: Weld Racing Draglite 90-Series Wheel 15 x 12
Front tires: Falken Visa 912 Tires - 758 P215/65R15 96H
Rear tires: Mickey Thompson Sportsman Pro Tire, 29x15.50-15LT

i have a 350 bored 40 over with a th400 trans i dont know the gear ratio i bought it with that rear end in it already and the guy had no info for me. i mainly drive it on weekends but we have a track opening next yesr about 30 miles away wouldnt mind running it there a little and i hit the local car shows when i can. after looking at your set up i think it might be time to pull it all out and start over. thanks your truck is looking awsome.

[koda360]

As stated above, with the trailing arm/ coil spring set up, there is no axle wrap like in a leaf spring set up. There is no traction aid you can add to fix wheel hop on the trailing arm set up.
Your wheel hop is most likely because the truck hooks up too good, and there's no weight in back to hold it on the ground.
You could go down a tire size or two, or try some adjustable shocks, like stated above, but the coil over set up, like "1bad62" has, is gonna be your best bet with trailing arms.
Ladder bars won't do any more for you than the trailing arms you already have, other than adding some adjustment to pinion angle ("IF" you delete the trailing arms), but if your gonna go as far as to put ladder bars in it, you might as well go to a four link (not a four bar) set up, and have several adjustments.
Of course, you could just ease into the loud pedal, slightly harder each time, until you find the point where it starts to hop... Even the fastest drag cars don't start off the line with the pedal to the wood...

[awbrown]

I agree with Captfab , better adjustable shocks and relocate them so they are straight up and down , not angled , so that they actually do something ... mounting at an angle reduces the effect of the shock...

[theastronaut]

Robnolimit posted this chart over in the suspension forum about shock angles. Like mentioned before, as much as they're laid down they're not working effectivly.

Shock Angle - Dampening Effectiveness

0* 100%
10* 96%
15* 93%
20* 89%
25* 82%
30* 75%
35* 66%
40* 59%
45* 50%


Another thing that will help is raising the front trailing arm mounting points. You can cut/drill the rivets out of the stock mounts and bolt them back on upside down with grade 8 bolts. This loads the tires more.

[1Bad62Pro/Street]

Here is some more reading info on the subject:

http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tec...e/viewall.html

http://www.rodandcustommagazine.com/...g/viewall.html

http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/t...p_suspensions/

http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...e/viewall.html

[fink64]

Originally Posted by theastronaut

Robnolimit posted this chart over in the suspension forum about shock angles. Like mentioned before, as much as they're laid down they're not working effectivly.

Shock Angle - Dampening Effectiveness

0* 100%
10* 96%
15* 93%
20* 89%
25* 82%
30* 75%
35* 66%
40* 59%
45* 50%


Another thing that will help is raising the front trailing arm mounting points. You can cut/drill the rivets out of the stock mounts and bolt them back on upside down with grade 8 bolts. This loads the tires more.

thanks for the trailing arm pics thats something i can try right away.with out losing the rest of the summer and then this winter i can change my shock location.

[fink64]

thanks to every one for the input if theres any more advice anyone one would like to give please do i need all the help i can get.

[chevy_mike]

Another thing to keep in mind, the frames on these trucks are kind of flexy. When the rear is hooking up, it could be creating some frame flex that loads and unloads and creating the hop. Trying the other ideas might help fix it but you might need to stiffen up the frame some. I would try the easy stuff first but keep this in the back of your mind.

Good luck

[theastronaut]

I'll second the thought that frame flex could be part of the problem. The frames are very prone to torsional twisting; bad enough that I'm going in and making X braces for my truck's frame. You didnt mdntion how much hp/tq the engine is making, possibly enough to distort the frame when launching? You could try welding the crossmembers in solid as they are only riveted in from the factory. Adding gussets to the crossmember-to-frame areas will help as well. C channels aren't very strong against twisting forces though, so extra bracing is a good idea.


Another thing- what condition are your trailing arm, shock, and panhard bushings in? Are the newer, or do they have any wear on them?



This is the bracing that I'm building for my '66. There will be another matching X brace for the bottom half of the frame rails, and the two will be tied together with more tubing to make the frame stiffer.There will be a second set of X braces under the cab as well. I doubt you'll need to go to this extreme to get rid of the wheel hop though.




You can see just how bad the frame flexes with just one rear air bag pumped up. Notice that the front crossmember is still sitting level!


Posted via Mobile Device

[Captainfab]

There is quite a bit of helpful info on getting these trucks to hook and launch, over in the 'Racing and High Performance' section. There are several members that hang out over there that race the '60-'72 trucks.

[fink64]

got my new coil springs this weekend at a swapmeet.