Problems with precision felt and scrapers

[Big70]

So I installed precision felt and scrapers to my door windows and for some reason the scrapers are not consistently going up with the window and down with the window parts of the rubber will go and parts will stay down with rolling up the window. Has anybody ever had this kind of problem? How do I Fix this problem or is this going to change as they get older and get warn in?

[GMCPaul]

There is a metal strap that connects the top of outer door skin to top of inner door skin to hold the 2 sections the correct distance apart, this strap is directly under the vent window assembly at rear just forward of the division bar. This strap rusts and breaks and then from opening and closing vent windows the inner and outer door skins tend to get spread further apart over time. This strap will need to be repaired to have them the correct distance apart.
Paul Jr @ GMCPauls

[MDPotter]

You're not the only one to have issues with the outer window scrapers. If I understand what you're saying, parts of it are folded under and other parts laying nice and flat against the glass? I don't know how to fix that. I ended up buying glue-on scrapers that are much more substantial and I'm happy with them.

[bigmac73]

MDPotter
do you have the part info for the glue on scrapers?

[MDPotter]

Originally Posted by bigmac73

MDPotter
do you have the part info for the glue on scrapers?

Here is where I got them: https://www.fatfendergarage.com/prod...ndow-seal-kit/

And here is a thread I posted about them: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=800290

A little pricey for two strips of rubber, but I like them.

[Big70]

Originally Posted by MDPotter

Here is where I got them: https://www.fatfendergarage.com/prod...ndow-seal-kit/

And here is a thread I posted about them: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=800290

A little pricey for two strips of rubber, but I like them.

Wow that’s so funny I was just watching their video on their gluons and was thinking about pulling the trigger and buying some but was worried I would just get the same results. Yes MD you did understand me right the rubber part of the scraper will lay flat on certain parts and then other parts it’ll stay down. Just not consistent. Do you think if I bought the gluons I would not have this problem?

[MDPotter]

Originally Posted by Big70

Wow that’s so funny I was just watching their video on their gluons and was thinking about pulling the trigger and buying some but was worried I would just get the same results. Yes MD you did understand me right the rubber part of the scraper will lay flat on certain parts and then other parts it’ll stay down. Just not consistent. Do you think if I bought the gluons I would not have this problem?

The glue-ons definitely don't have the same issue, nice and straight all the way across. I'm a little leery of the glue-on method, but they seem pretty stuck. If you get them, it's best if you find something (like a piece of small hose) to stick in the window opening with the window down to keep pressure on the gluing surface so it stays put as it dries. It didn't dry that fast when I put them on, but it was also about 45 degrees. Now that it's warmer the glue might set up a lot faster. Two people can probably hold it for a minute or two and be okay in the warm weather.

[Big70]

Originally Posted by MDPotter

The glue-ons definitely don't have the same issue, nice and straight all the way across. I'm a little leery of the glue-on method, but they seem pretty stuck. If you get them, it's best if you find something (like a piece of small hose) to stick in the window opening with the window down to keep pressure on the gluing surface so it stays put as it dries. It didn't dry that fast when I put them on, but it was also about 45 degrees. Now that it's warmer the glue might set up a lot faster. Two people can probably hold it for a minute or two and be okay in the warm weather.

It’s funny that you brought that up because I was thinking about buying those months ago and I guess I should’ve started with those. You wouldn’t happen to know how they re-pair the door when it separates because I think one of my doors might’ve separated a little bit. it seems like there’s no room to get in there to fix that.

[MDPotter]

You mean the opening for the glass is wider than it's supposed to be?

Like Paul Jr mentioned, there is a joint between the inner shell and outer shell. It is hard to get to with the wing window in place. I put new skins on my doors and that's a spot that I welded together. Other than that, the width of that opening is set by the structure of the inner and outer skin.

I replaced the outer skin on my doors and I can tell you more about that process if that's what you're looking for.

[Big70]

Originally Posted by MDPotter

You mean the opening for the glass is wider than it's supposed to be?

Like Paul Jr mentioned, there is a joint between the inner shell and outer shell. It is hard to get to with the wing window in place. I put new skins on my doors and that's a spot that I welded together. Other than that, the width of that opening is set by the structure of the inner and outer skin.

I replaced the outer skin on my doors and I can tell you more about that process if that's what you're looking for.

You kinda answered my question... I guess the only way you fix it is if you pull the outer skin off to get to it to fix the gap

[Pearly72]

I just put the complete set on my truck last month. After slight trimming of the part to get it in, it did the same thing you described. I don't know if it'll work for you, but I put a heat gun on the rubber (a few passes just to warm it up). I rolled the window up and down a few times and left it. I've driven it about 15 times since then and used the window. Doesn't do it anymore. This was only on the driver side... the passenger side did it the first few times, but then was good to go. Maybe these have to break in a little?

[GASoline71]

Originally Posted by GMCPaul

There is a metal strap that connects the top of outer door skin to top of inner door skin to hold the 2 sections the correct distance apart, this strap is directly under the vent window assembly at rear just forward of the division bar. This strap rusts and breaks and then from opening and closing vent windows the inner and outer door skins tend to get spread further apart over time. This strap will need to be repaired to have them the correct distance apart.
Paul Jr @ GMCPauls

Yep... then in 1972 GM put a screw in the door under the wing window to help hold the window opening at the proper gap.

Gary

[Big70]

Originally Posted by GASoline71

Yep... then in 1972 GM put a screw in the door under the wing window to help hold the window opening at the proper gap.

Gary

So the only way to fix my doors on the 70 is to pull the skin off? 72 doors will bolt right up on my 70 right?? I always thought the 72 door panels were nicer anyways..

[sprint_9]

Ive got a 72 with really nice original doors, with the screw in and clamping tight on the vent window. In my opinion the Precision scrapers are total junk and not worth wasting any money on. The inner felts aren't much better but are at least in the ball park.

[Big70]

Originally Posted by sprint_9

Ive got a 72 with really nice original doors, with the screw in and clamping tight on the vent window. In my opinion the Precision scrapers are total junk and not worth wasting any money on. The inner felts aren't much better but are at least in the ball park.

What Do you recommend? Fat fenders scrapers? Plus I think I'm going to start looking for 72 doors.

[GMCPaul]

We've been installing these for well over 25 years without these issues. The Precision rubber beltline glass scrapper is a consistent width from front to back so contact to glass by rubber should be the same from front to back if its not then the gap isn't consistent, the same is true for the inner felt flocked beltlines. Things you should check besides strap under vent assembly is the door glass opening a consistent width from front to rear of the opening, if not this needs corrected. When installing you should also examine the metal that the beltline fastens onto that the clips go through small holes on. More often than not you'll find that when you removed the old beltlines most aren't aware of how to properly insert a small blade trim tool into the clip to unfasten it to remove the old beltline without distorting the metal hole area the clip fastens into into on the inner and outer door edge where they fasten, this distortion from bends in that area can push or pull beltlines in or outward, most just pry the old beltlines off and it results in distorted mounting tab holes. Another item to check also is the angle that the metal lip / metal flange that protrudes down into door that these fasten to and rest against when installed, these quite often get bent inward or outward slightly and if that angles off you have issues with the beltline. What is the most common cause of this is again prying beltlines off to replace with new, although we have also seen the old door glass sash rusty and swollen which caused it to catch old beltlines when windows rolled up completely causing them to try to pry beltlines off they catch so badly on them.
Paul Jr @ GMCPauls

[toolboxchev]

I'll say this, even I am guilty of trashing a vendor. Napa is my hatred. Now with that in mind if we keep trashing vendors they will just stop supplying us with parts.

I suggest that you give Precision a call. You would be surprised at their response if your civil. I have had dealings with them and I will tell you what. Their customer service is outstanding, hands down. They are a premium vendor for the products we need. Now if only GM did a better job to begin with they would not be selling any products.

Every time you pull a wing window out it will bend the metal outward and there you have it.

Take a good look at what GMCPauls has to say and see if, in detail that would be the issues your dealing with. These are 50 year old vehicles to begin with, they were not made with the precision of today's products. Even the 72's with the screw by the vent window to address this is not perfect by any means.

So what are you truly after anyways? Killing another company and the loss of more jobs?

I buy lifetime warranty parts from Napa, they fail, all the time. Napa will replace it, yet I gotta do the work. That is the only part I do not like.

Grateful to be alive another day. nuff said

[sprint_9]

To be clear I never trashed Precision as a company, only this one particular part.

I bought just about everything Precision sells for our trucks, and that was bought through GMCPaul. All that stuff was absolutely awesome as has been Paul's service. This has nothing to do with either of them as a company, but with a part I feel is inferior when compared to everything else they sell.

I've measured my doors and looked them over and they dont work. Maybe stock was like this and didn't work, I don't remember.

[toolboxchev]

Well I will also add I am not trying to trash on any one particular poster. Like I said I am guilty of not having happy parts also.

Give Precision a call, and ask for Jeff. He has been a 110 percent stand up guy for me.

It was my fault, and he backed me on it. All due to one little detail missed. Too me that is hands down outstanding service.

[HO455]

Having found a problem with the Precision window seals during my Burban's paint job, I can testify that they are very concerned that their products work correctly. As previously posted give them a call.
I have to agree with GMC Paul. The front products from Precision that I installed all worked good. The small problems that I experienced were from installation errors on my part. Not knowing to verify the frame components were straight, true and very clean was the root of my problems. I had to weld 2 of the 4 straps that have been mentioned before everything worked correctly. By the time I got to the 4th door I had figured everything out.
One thing to remember with the wipers/scrapers is that they were never designed to keep water out of the door like on new cars. Only any debris that might clog the door drains.

[toolboxchev]

And on another note, I had just ordered some electrical from GMCPauls on the 4th.

It got here today, ACROSS THE US! Freakin Wow! Let us keep America Truckin!

[57taskforce]

Originally Posted by Big70

So the only way to fix my doors on the 70 is to pull the skin off? 72 doors will bolt right up on my 70 right?? I always thought the 72 door panels were nicer anyways..

If the bracket that ties the door skins together by the vent window is cracked like most of them are, you can weld it back up with out taking the skin off. I’ve done several of them.

[Big70]

Originally Posted by GMCPaul

We've been installing these for well over 25 years without these issues. The Precision rubber beltline glass scrapper is a consistent width from front to back so contact to glass by rubber should be the same from front to back if its not then the gap isn't consistent, the same is true for the inner felt flocked beltlines. Things you should check besides strap under vent assembly is the door glass opening a consistent width from front to rear of the opening, if not this needs corrected. When installing you should also examine the metal that the beltline fastens onto that the clips go through small holes on. More often than not you'll find that when you removed the old beltlines most aren't aware of how to properly insert a small blade trim tool into the clip to unfasten it to remove the old beltline without distorting the metal hole area the clip fastens into into on the inner and outer door edge where they fasten, this distortion from bends in that area can push or pull beltlines in or outward, most just pry the old beltlines off and it results in distorted mounting tab holes. Another item to check also is the angle that the metal lip / metal flange that protrudes down into door that these fasten to and rest against when installed, these quite often get bent inward or outward slightly and if that angles off you have issues with the beltline. What is the most common cause of this is again prying beltlines off to replace with new, although we have also seen the old door glass sash rusty and swollen which caused it to catch old beltlines when windows rolled up completely causing them to try to pry beltlines off they catch so badly on them.
Paul Jr @ GMCPauls

I'm not bashing the company I knew I had a problem and I did figure it was not the scrapers fault and did not know what to do. So I measured my gap and it is wider by 1/8 inch at the vent side as opposed to the back side of the door and same on both doors. I think I'm going to hunt down some 72 doors and throw them on my truck. I've learned in the years the part I'm installing is not always the problem and that I'm working on 50 year old equipment.

[heskahoka]

Originally Posted by GMCPaul

We've been installing these for well over 25 years without these issues. The Precision rubber beltline glass scrapper is a consistent width from front to back so contact to glass by rubber should be the same from front to back if its not then the gap isn't consistent, the same is true for the inner felt flocked beltlines. Things you should check besides strap under vent assembly is the door glass opening a consistent width from front to rear of the opening, if not this needs corrected. When installing you should also examine the metal that the beltline fastens onto that the clips go through small holes on. More often than not you'll find that when you removed the old beltlines most aren't aware of how to properly insert a small blade trim tool into the clip to unfasten it to remove the old beltline without distorting the metal hole area the clip fastens into into on the inner and outer door edge where they fasten, this distortion from bends in that area can push or pull beltlines in or outward, most just pry the old beltlines off and it results in distorted mounting tab holes. Another item to check also is the angle that the metal lip / metal flange that protrudes down into door that these fasten to and rest against when installed, these quite often get bent inward or outward slightly and if that angles off you have issues with the beltline. What is the most common cause of this is again prying beltlines off to replace with new, although we have also seen the old door glass sash rusty and swollen which caused it to catch old beltlines when windows rolled up completely causing them to try to pry beltlines off they catch so badly on them.
Paul Jr @ GMCPauls

I am going to work on my door channel rubber and felt pretty soon, so I took the liberty of re-writing the instructions above from Paul Jr. to make it more clear in my mind.
I am better with words than mechanical. Paul, I hope you don't mind.

From above:
We've been installing these for well over 25 years without these issues.

The Precision rubber beltline glass scraper is a consistent width from front to back so contact of glass with the rubber should be the same from front to back. If it is not, then the door gap isn't consistent.

The same is true for the inner felt flocked beltlines.

Things you should check:

1. The strap under the vent assembly. (Not covered here.)

2. Is the door glass opening a width consistent from front to rear? If not, this needs to be corrected.

3. When installing, you should examine the metal that the beltline fastens onto. The clips go through small holes. More often than not, when removing the old beltlines, some distortion may have occurred. Most folks aren't aware, but you should insert a small blade trim tool into the clip to unfasten the old beltline without distorting the hole that the new beltline clip fastens into. On the inner and outer door edge where they fasten, this distortion from the bends in that area can push or pull beltlines in or outward. A lot of people just pry the old beltlines off and it distorts mounting tab holes.

4. Another item to check also is the angle that the metal lip / metal flange that protrudes down into door that these new beltlines fasten to. These quite often get bent inward or outward slightly. If the angles are off you have issues with the beltline.

5. Again, the most common cause of this issue is prying (manhandling) beltlines off to replace with new. (See item 3 above).

6. Sometimes, we have seen the old door glass sash rusty and swollen. This rusty, swollen condition causes it to catch old beltlines when the window is rolled up completely causing them to pry beltlines off since they catch them so badly.


-M

[firedemon]

what is the door glass sash I need to do these seals soon