Bagged Dually Questions

[monte0185]

Ok I bought a lowered dually and has a static 5/7 drop. Well i think 5/7 anyway.. The front seems a bit low to me but no more then my C10 that was 5/5. The rear is my main concern. It needs bigger tires to begin with but I think its sitting a bit high and needs a little more drop. Now heres where my questions come in. Im wanting to pull a 5th wheel/ gooseneck camper or a car trailer with who knows on it. Ive pulled everything from big to small on it. lol. So my question is Ive read I dont want to Cnotch it with pulling loads so i dont think i can get any lower. I have no desire to lower it to the ground!! However I was wondering if its possible to pull what i want to with something like a 4bar bag setup and if i can will i still have to notch the frame? The look im looking for is a little less rake and tuck the rear tires a bit. If the look is not possible without compromising load/towing capability please say so. Ill try to get some pics of whats under there at the moment when its daylight out. Been getting home after dark lately.

[lolife99]

I assume it doesn't have a flip kit?
Just a shackle hanger drop.
It might be 5" drop up front,... but the rear doesn't look like 7" of drop.

[lolife99]

Ridetech makes a nice HD 4-link for the C30 trucks.
http://www.ridetech.com/store/universal-hd-4-link.html

And a 73-91 C30 specific panhard bar:
http://www.ridetech.com/store/1973-1...nhard-bar.html

[monte0185]

I honestly havent looked. I know the C notches are laying in the floor board. I got it home this weekend and it rained after that and i havent been getting home until dark. I will look tonight however.

[monte0185]

Originally Posted by lolife99

Ridetech makes a nice HD 4-link for the C30 trucks.
http://www.ridetech.com/store/universal-hd-4-link.html

And a 73-91 C30 specific panhard bar:
http://www.ridetech.com/store/1973-1...nhard-bar.html

I ran across these in another post last night but for this setup will I have to C notch the frame or cut the bed at all?

[lolife99]

You can either go low or not.
I'd say you are at your non-c-notch level right now.
Even a simple flip kit requires a c-notch and most add help bags to tow.

Look around on www.duallyscene.com.
You can build a notch plenty heavy to allow you to tow,... but I think that will require cutting the bed floor.
I don't think you can have it both ways.

[monte0185]

Originally Posted by lolife99

You can either go low or not.
I'd say you are at your non-c-notch level right now.
Even a simple flip kit requires a c-notch and most add help bags to tow.

Look around on www.duallyscene.com.
You can build a notch plenty heavy to allow you to tow,... but I think that will require cutting the bed floor.
I don't think you can have it both ways.

The ones that came with the truck Are pretty thick and dont require bed cutting so think im covered there. I was thinking if you only cut the notch section out then welded the frame to the piece thats going in place that should provide the same strength as the frame still being there cause its all tied together. Think that is something a shop will have to do for me. Im a good welder but i dont have the equipment for anything that thick. Im going to take some pics tonight so Ill have a better idea of whats going on. Ill take pics of the C notches i have as well.

[78maliburat]

If the rear is flipped the rear will hit the bottom of the bed floor before it touches the top of the notch ..................... At least on my truck,,,therye are to many variables between vehicles shackle height / how many leafs in stack / overload or not ....

[monte0185]

Originally Posted by 78maliburat

If the rear is flipped the rear will hit the bottom of the bed floor before it touches the top of the notch ..................... At least on my truck,,,therye are to many variables between vehicles shackle height / how many leafs in stack / overload or not ....

Yeah that wouldnt be a good thing. I wish I was off work so i could snap a couple pics but i could swear it was flipped already but i only glanced real quick at it and was really only looking to see how much room between the axle and the frame there was. Oh well couple more hours and ill be off. LOL

[rs72z]

I bet it doesn't have a flip now. When mine had a flip it was tucking the rear tire a couple of inches.

[78maliburat]

Monte0185 you have a pm

[monte0185]

Originally Posted by 78maliburat

Monte0185 you have a pm

Got it. sent you one back. Thanks for the pics. I was curious about how many leaves everyone was running.

[78maliburat]

BOTH FLIPPED

[russellh575]

78maliburat what size tires are you running?

[monte0185]

Originally Posted by russellh575

78maliburat what size tires are you running?

Curious about that myself.

[78maliburat]

Ill post it in the am

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by monte0185

The ones that came with the truck Are pretty thick and dont require bed cutting so think im covered there. I was thinking if you only cut the notch section out then welded the frame to the piece thats going in place that should provide the same strength as the frame still being there cause its all tied together. Think that is something a shop will have to do for me. Im a good welder but i dont have the equipment for anything that thick. Im going to take some pics tonight so Ill have a better idea of whats going on. Ill take pics of the C notches i have as well.

From my understanding, the statement in bold print above is not correct.

The only company that I could find that made .250" thick C30 specific c-notches was Western Chassis. I ordered their notches when I measured my dually & was planning to install a flip kit. Then, I learned some good info concerning notched frame strength & realized the c-notches from WC were not up to my standards of use (maintaining or increasing OE structural strength). At < 2" of rail height in the 'notched' section, that's @ least a 60% reduction in rail strength (height = strength)! Boxing that section does not restore the strength anywhere near that same percentage.

We calculated the 'strength' of some notches I was building/working on for my 'Recycle' project. These were C10 notches that I based off of the material dimensions of those WC C30 notches I had purchased (and these supposedly were HD notches). To my dismay (& shock), the frame strength was 16% of the original un-cut rail. Also.... If I recall correctly, that 16% was with the frame boxed using .250" plate. To make matters worse for my (or anybodys) dually application, that did not account for the spring mounting points being in front of & behind the rear axle centerline 2' because on a truck-arm set-up everything is mounted in front of the rear axle C/L.

The only fix was a solid frame or making the notched section taller. For my C10, I opted to increase the height of the frame equal to what I removed & I boxed it as well yeilding more strength vs OE (disclaimer: Analysis calculated a stronger rail but subjective assesment would/should be based on the welder/fabricators ability). For my dually, I went straight to boxed-in step notches & cut them to fit my application.

For your dually..... step notch or the OE strength will be compromised. Lots of guys might be running a c-notched set-up that has 'worked just fine', but that doesn't make it right or safe. In the end, the owner is accountable if something fails.

Other info you might want.....
RideTech told me a c-notch was not required for their previously available bolt-in 73-91 C30 HD AirBar kit. Their intent was to never exceed the OE rails limitations. I'm not sure what they recommend now on the universal 'HD weld-in kit'.

Related notch strength tech.... http://www.67-72chevytrucks.com/vboa...d.php?t=457037

[monte0185]

Well it appears the rear has not been flipped like we suspected. Looks like leaves were removed and helper bags installed. I guess I could add a leaf spring extender on the rear or whatever that bracket is that lifts the spring up close to the bed. Anyway here are some pics.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by monte0185

Well it appears the rear has not been flipped like we suspected. Looks like leaves were removed and helper bags installed. I guess I could add a leaf spring extender on the rear or whatever that bracket is that lifts the spring up close to the bed. Anyway here are some pics.

Rear shackle.

[monte0185]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

Rear shackle.

Yeah that's it!!! Had a brain fart there for awhile. Anyway here is the C notch I have and Im in agreement with the strength thing. I don't want to cut it if I don't have to that's why I was considering the ridetech drop later on. Not sure if it would need notched or not though.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by monte0185

Yeah that's it!!! Had a brain fart there for awhile. Anyway here is the C notch I have and Im in agreement with the strength thing. I don't want to cut it if I don't have to that's why I was considering the ridetech drop later on. Not sure if it would need notched or not though.

That looks like a c-notch for an 88-98 truck. Definitely doesn't look like the one for my 89.

[lolife99]

SCOTI is correct,...
http://www.belltech.com/c-section-kit-13.html

[lolife99]

Western Chassis C30 c-notch,...
http://westernchassisinc.com/73-91-c...ction-c-notch/

[monte0185]

Originally Posted by lolife99

SCOTI is correct,...
http://www.belltech.com/c-section-kit-13.html

Well awesome!!! Guess thats goin on the chopping block. lol Wasn't planning on using it anyway if I could help it.

So what does everyone suggest for lowering it a bit more and do you think the helper bags it has will be ok for towing a 5th wheel camper with the leaves being removed?

[monte0185]

What about these with the extended shackle??

http://www.belltech.com/products/bel...er-kit-15.html