4wd spicer hub color

[1970cstblazer]

Originally Posted by 72ironmike

JoesJunk had an original low mile 1971 with red dials. Our guess was they came from the factory that way.

That was a K20 IIRC...

[1970cstblazer]

Here is one of joesjunk 1971 K20's with the red hub dials

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...highlight=HUBS

[1970cstblazer]

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...ed#post8933060

Originally Posted by Joesjunk

Larry bought his truck from me. It’s a very early built 71. It has several left over parts on it. When I bought it in 2006 it had GM red knobs on it. I always knew that was technically wrong for 71, But I believe it actually came that way. I removed them and put blue ones on it. Here’s a picture of it when I bought it in 2006.

[72ironmike]

My bad ! 1971 3/4 Ton

[special-K]

Originally Posted by 1970cstblazer

GM info has been posted. Pretty compelling info that the 10/68 parts book contradicts your statement.

I find it laughable that all of those 1968 trucks I located were converted over after the fact with red knobs.

We will agree to disagree.

Incomplete GM info has been posted. Your book is a '68 book, therefore the plastic knob style are not listed. Only the all metal PNs are shown.

This info is from the May 1979 edition of the Chevrolet 1947-72 1/2 Thru 1 Ton Trucks Series 10-20-30 Chassis & Body parts Catalog

K Series 10 67-69 - PN 3936253

K Series 10 68-69 - PN 3937063
K5

K Series 10 70-72 - PN 3979550
K5

I don't find it laughable that you found all those restored trucks with incorrect locking hubs. To be honest, I didn't look thoroughly through them because they are too big for this site. You didn't say what you thought about the all original truck I showed.

[1970cstblazer]

Originally Posted by special-K

Incomplete GM info has been posted. Your book is a '68 book, therefore the plastic knob style are not listed. Only the all metal PNs are shown.

This info is from the May 1979 edition of the Chevrolet 1947-72 1/2 Thru 1 Ton Trucks Series 10-20-30 Chassis & Body parts Catalog

K Series 10 67-69 - PN 3936253

K Series 10 68-69 - PN 3937063
K5

K Series 10 70-72 - PN 3979550
K5

I don't find it laughable that you found all those restored trucks with incorrect locking hubs. To be honest, I didn't look thoroughly through them because they are too big for this site. You didn't say what you thought about the all original truck I showed.

Let's go over all of this again..



3936253 is listed as the Warren semi auto type in the June, 1971 parts book

3937063 (Dana Spicer 26133-1x) is the Dana/Spicer half ton locking hub assembly, with the red plastic knob. So, there is some overlap. Some 1968-69 trucks had the Warren semi lock style, some had the Spicer.


This kit is GM 3979550 (Dana Spicer 26133-3x), which has the blue knob. Otherwise the 1x kit is identical:



Some of those trucks I listed were not restored. I will say that the green 1968 Fleetside SWB was restored to a VERY high level, and I didn't see where the owner had substituted incorrect parts on it. Highly doubt that he would have used the wrong hubs on it.

Also, 3979551 (Dana Spicer 34916-3) is listed as fitting 1968-72 half tons/Blazers. They are the blue plastic version

[special-K]

You show the same thing I showed. I'm trying hard to see how you get out of that the 68/69 knobs are red plastic. It's the '70s that had red plastic and their part # is the same as the blue 71/72s. GM parts is not a restoration business, it's a replacement part business. They will supercede a part with one that works if the original design is depleted from stock. If the 68/69 hub assemblies listed are red plastic with chrome retainer rings, it could be that GM had Spicer make a batch so they could continue providing replacement parts to comply with the law that requires mfgrs to provide replacement parts for 10 years. And since Spicer changed the design, they would have made new assemblies to work with the closed knuckle Dana44s in that design. I do know, from my experience of dealing with and owning these 4wds, that from the factory the '69-back K/10s came from the factory with the metal Spicer hubs. I have never owned a '69 blazer and never been well acquainted with one, I can say that. I believe it could be possible that the Warn (GM misprint) semi auto hubs are what came on '69-only Blazers and those would be Warn's Loc-O-Matics. They would interchange with the K/10 hubs as a replacement. Those came bronze with red painted in the recessed area. The most original '69 Blazer pictures I have found show the knobs as yellowish, certainly not red, and they aren't the design as the plastic ones. My guess is those are the Warns with the red paint gone

As far as GM superceding a newer design part in place of the original design due to depletion of stock, Have had experienced that many times. I remember I got all excited, in the early-80s when I began ordering still available 67-72 parts, when the parts guy found the 69-72 steering wheels were still available but only in black. I ordered one, it came in, and it was a '73 style wheel. I've had it happen over and over again. I have bought front wheel bearings for a '71 K/20, way back then, that had "Made In Japan" stamped into the race rim. I am willing to accept that somehow I never saw or owned 68/69 that came from the factory with plastic hubs before if I see proof. But in my years of dealing with these 4wds parts I have had more guys than I can count asking if I had the original all metal Spicer hubs for their pre-70 K/10s

[1970cstblazer]

Originally Posted by special-K

You show the same thing I showed. I'm trying hard to see how you get out of that the 68/69 knobs are red plastic. It's the '70s that had red plastic and their part # is the same as the blue 71/72s. GM parts is not a restoration business, it's a replacement part business. They will supercede a part with one that works if the original design is depleted from stock. If the 68/69 hub assemblies listed are red plastic with chrome retainer rings, it could be that GM had Spicer make a batch so they could continue providing replacement parts to comply with the law that requires mfgrs to provide replacement parts for 10 years. And since Spicer changed the design, they would have made new assemblies to work with the closed knuckle Dana44s in that design. I do know, from my experience of dealing with and owning these 4wds, that from the factory the '69-back K/10s came from the factory with the metal Spicer hubs. I have never owned a '69 blazer and never been well acquainted with one, I can say that. I believe it could be possible that the Warn (GM misprint) semi auto hubs are what came on '69-only Blazers and those would be Warn's Loc-O-Matics. They would interchange with the K/10 hubs as a replacement. Those came bronze with red painted in the recessed area. The most original '69 Blazer pictures I have found show the knobs as yellowish, certainly not red, and they aren't the design as the plastic ones. My guess is those are the Warns with the red paint gone

As far as GM superceding a newer design part in place of the original design due to depletion of stock, Have had experienced that many times. I remember I got all excited, in the early-80s when I began ordering still available 67-72 parts, when the parts guy found the 69-72 steering wheels were still available but only in black. I ordered one, it came in, and it was a '73 style wheel. I've had it happen over and over again. I have bought front wheel bearings for a '71 K/20, way back then, that had "Made In Japan" stamped into the race rim. I am willing to accept that somehow I never saw or owned 68/69 that came from the factory with plastic hubs before if I see proof. But in my years of dealing with these 4wds parts I have had more guys than I can count asking if I had the original all metal Spicer hubs for their pre-70 K/10s

SOME 1970 K10'S/K/5'S with F76 had the red knobs. ALL 1970 K20 with F76 had the red knobs.

The October, 1968 parts book which also covers 1969 models shows 3937068 red plastic knob, which was changed to 3979551 blue plastic knob in 1/1971 per the 1/73 parts history book. That's why you will see the later parts books specify 1968-72 using the 3979551 blue knob.

I have shown MANY examples of 1969 Blazers, which used the open knuckle drum brake Dana 44, with red knobs.

I have shown MANY 1968 AND 1969 K10'S with closed knuckle drum brake Dana 44's, also with the same red plastic knobs as the 1969 Blazers.

Many GM parts books show 1968 as the transition year to the K/10 Dana/Spicer locking hubs that utilize the plastic hub knobs. Many of the internal hub parts interchange from 1968-1972 and even later than that!

As was shown, 1968 and 1969 also used the "Warn" semi lock hubs, so it appears either was used.

See older thread:

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=251398

Also:

Originally Posted by MJN

The parts catalog shows #3979551 for 68-70 K10. 6259019 is the knob for 73 and up yellow K10/internal style lockout hub. The red actuating knob in my OP is for K20 (3/4 ton) hubs not 1/2 ton hubs. Based on the parts catalogs they used the all metal external type hub lok on '69 and older K20's and '70 was the first year for the red plastic dials for K20 external type Hub lok's.

Some additional digging I found the Dana part # 34916-3 (GM#3979551) was preceded by Dana 34916-1 (GM #3937068). GM 3937068 shows for '68-69 K10 & '69 Blazer with 350 only. No color is listed however. The only notes in the parts catalog related to the color of the actuator knob are for K20 series hubs. The later yellow K10 knob (6259019) was Dana # 34916-4.

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=809746

[Shortnwide4x4]

The ones on my 68 short fleet may have been painted red like the early red design but were made of what appeared to be brass. They never had any indication of ever having red on them in the past but were identical in appearance to the early red hubs posted in this thread so i dont think they were aftermarket. I ended up polishing the copper/brass.

[special-K]

Originally Posted by 1970cstblazer

SOME 1970 K10'S/K/5'S with F76 had the red knobs. ALL 1970 K20 with F76 had the red knobs.

The October, 1968 parts book which also covers 1969 models shows 3937068 red plastic knob, which was changed to 3979551 blue plastic knob in 1/1971 per the 1/73 parts history book. That's why you will see the later parts books specify 1968-72 using the 3979551 blue knob.

I have shown MANY examples of 1969 Blazers, which used the open knuckle drum brake Dana 44, with red knobs.

I have shown MANY 1968 AND 1969 K10'S with closed knuckle drum brake Dana 44's, also with the same red plastic knobs as the 1969 Blazers.

Many GM parts books show 1968 as the transition year to the K/10 Dana/Spicer locking hubs that utilize the plastic hub knobs. Many of the internal hub parts interchange from 1968-1972 and even later than that!

As was shown, 1968 and 1969 also used the "Warn" semi lock hubs, so it appears either was used.

See older thread:

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=251398

Also:




https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=809746

Where does the parts book say Red plastic hubs? Do we know that all these hubs don't interchange? Frankly, without intimate knowledge of these trucks you show the pictures mean nothing. If a vehicle needed the axle replaced due to accident or rough riding off road adventure GM would likely have supplied the open knuckle assembly.

I can buy that no Blazer ever had a closed axle, though I don't understand why. I do understand why only the K/5s had the NP205 available. That's only because in '69 only K/5s got the automatic transmission. I can accept that GM wanted to try the new design Dana 44 in the Blazers.

I still don't know about what you think about the original '68 K/10 I showed that has the old style Spicer lockouts. It either means that's what came on '68 K/10s or it means all these hubs interchange and all this talk is moot. From my experience, since 1973 with 4wds, has been the pte-70 trucks came with the all metal Spicers from factory. I have had K/5s, but only 70-72

Is there any way you could post your pictures so they fit the page? Like I said, I have not looked at your photos thoroughly and that's the reason, too big. Also, you do realize that white '68 K/10 is sitting on K/20 axles, right? Must be later small hubs

[1970cstblazer]

Here is a post regarding a 1967 K10 with the Warn hub on one side and the red knob Dana Spicer hub on the other side...

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=804582

I am searching hi and low for photographic evidence to support my statement that 3937068 is indeed the red plastic knob.

[1970cstblazer]

Per Chevrolet Truck Conversion List December 1973:

We know that 3979551 are the blue plastic knobs

We know that 6259019 are the yellow plastic knobs.

Pretty good chances 3937068 are the red plastic knobs.

[1970cstblazer]

Good info here:

https://wegotmud.com/forum/index.php?topic=36205.0

[special-K]

Originally Posted by 1970cstblazer

Good info here:

https://wegotmud.com/forum/index.php?topic=36205.0

That guy made no mention of the all metal and said GM started offering 1/2t lockouts in 68 or 69. He completely overlooked the 60-67 K/10 Spicer hubs. I have the most experience with K/20s. I've only had a few K/10s and K/5s but only one K/10 was a '69, which had all metal Spicers. I am still wondering if all these 1/2t lockouts interchange. The very original '68 K/10 I showed has the all metal Spicers and that '67 in the link had a plastic Spicer. I'm fine with being wrong on this but I haven't seen proof yet

[1970cstblazer]

1960-67 K10 is not in scope for this discussion. Focus here is 1968 and newer. From what I have researched is either hub was available from GM. Hub knob color transition is still up in the air. SOME 1970 K/5-K/10's had red. Many came with the blue, such as my 3/70 built Blazer.

K20 hub usage is very clear. 1970 was the initial year of the external Spicer locking hubs with red plastic knob with no Spicer lettering. SOME early 1971 K20's had the red, then transition to blue with Spicer lettering.

[1970cstblazer]

A 1968 K10 Suburban with the Warn hubs:

[1970cstblazer]

Unrestored 1968 K10 with red knob Spicer hubs and closed knuckle drum brake Dana 44.

[1970cstblazer]

Purported 26k mile 1968 K10:

[Chaparralman1974]

Here is a picture of the stock aluminum hub locks on my stock 1967 K20.

[Chaparralman1974]

I have replaced the original hub locks with a set of big hub spicers. These originally came off of a 1973 K20 and were the mustard yellow color, but I found some replacement blue knobs on eBay.

[Chaparralman1974]

And here is a picture of the SPID showing the line item for the original aluminum hub locks.

[1970cstblazer]

Per Torqueking:

Applications

Chevy and GMC:
K5, K10, K15, K1500 Blazer, Jimmy, Suburban, or Truck: 1968 (late), 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1974, 1975, 1976, 1977, 1978, 1979, 1980

https://torqueking.com/product/40047...unt-hub-locks/

[DeadheadNM]

FWIW, low mile "survivor" 1968 Broncos might lend some circumstantial evidence as Ford shared Spicer hubs. The F250 had regular and heavy duty front axles choices the former used the 1/2T hubs seen on a K10 the latter those on a K20.

[1970cstblazer]

Here is an excerpt from the 1968 Chevrolet factory service manual with a 1967 copyright date showing the Dana Spicer K10 hubs:

[1970cstblazer]

1st edition 1969 Chevrolet Truck owners manual dated August, 1968 shows both the K10 AND K20 Spicer hubs. What is messed up is that the K20 Spicer hubs weren't available until model year 1970..