Dyno results of my 454

[Burt4x4]

For thoes that don't know this is my new 454 board .30over about 9.3 compression, with 781 heads stuffed w/oversized stainless vavles, Thorley headers, Mallory ign., toped off with Edelbrocks MPFI setup for BBC. The engine was balanced from balancer to fly wheel/clutch assy.
So if you take the numbers at the bottom of the graph and account for the aprox 30% drivetrain loss, I have about 400HP & 550 ft-Lbs at the crank
Yes I am happy
BTW ~ My Air/Fuel was so bad the guy said I would have burnt up my engine in about 10K max...now it is good to go

[jkade]

Not to be nosey but what does it cost to build a motor like that?

[71RestoRod]

Steve,

Nice numbers!

Why do they think you would have burnt it up? Was it running way lean? Curious because I've got the Edlebrock EFI installed on mine too... and I keep wanting to lean it out more... How did they determine the A/F ratio?

[Captkaos]

Good Grief! The A/F about scared the heck out of me! Is that the smoothest you could get with the MPFI? How adjustable is it? Just curious? Never played with one...

We dyno'd my brothers stock block 5.3L this weekend with an STS Turbo system and methanol injection on 12lb of boost and it was 475hp and 606lb/ft

[Captkaos]

Optimumly 12.8:1 is about where you want the A/F ratio. His was at 16.5 average it appears. NOT good. They take the readings from the ECM for it. This is what the O2 is determining.

[70rs/ss]

I am just guessing, but the drop off there, is that because of the Thorley's? I have a built 496 and their tech guy told me those tri y's fall flat on their face at about 5krpm? I used the hooker super comps because 6500 rpm is normal territory for me. Nice numbers.

[71RestoRod]

Originally Posted by Captkaos

Optimumly 12.8:1 is about where you want the A/F ratio. His was at 16.5 average it appears. NOT good. They take the readings from the ECM for it. This is what the O2 is determining.

Yea I see it now... didn't even see the A/F chart before I made my last post.

The ECM on the Edlebrock system only knows when the system is north or south of stoichiometric but not by how much. I was just curious if they tapped into the O2 sensor or used some kind of sniffer.

I actually have both collectors on mine tapped for o2 sensors. It would be a litte pricy, byt I thought I would add another o2 sensor and a A/F ratio guage to help dial in the ECM.

[FRENCHBLUE72]

Nice power # glad to see someone finally has a dyno sheet to prove there # too congrats on such a healthy motor..

[Bowtie67]

Originally Posted by 71RestoRod

Yea I see it now... didn't even see the A/F chart before I made my last post.

The ECM on the Edlebrock system only knows when the system is north or south of stoichiometric but not by how much. I was just curious if they tapped into the O2 sensor or used some kind of sniffer.

I actually have both collectors on mine tapped for o2 sensors. It would be a litte pricy, byt I thought I would add another o2 sensor and a A/F ratio guage to help dial in the ECM.

On the Dyno the Air/Fuel is read from the Exhaust, If you want true accuracy from your air/fuel readings the need to get it from a wide band O2 Sensor setup, The LM1 is a little pricey but you will be able to tell if your running lean on the highway, city driving ro running wide open. There are lots of narrow band setups out for cheap money but the acuracy of them isnt there because of the slowness of getting and relaying of the info..


Burt, How are you getting a 30% driveline loss? Manual Trans setups are around 15 % Turbo 350/powerglides are about 20% which most claim is all automatics, and the Turbo 400/and 700R4 have about 25% loss

[71RestoRod]

Originally Posted by Bowtie67

On the Dyno the Air/Fuel is read from the Exhaust, If you want true accuracy from your air/fuel readings the need to get it from a wide band O2 Sensor setup, The LM1 is a little pricey but you will be able to tell if your running lean on the highway, city driving ro running wide open. There are lots of narrow band setups out for cheap money but the acuracy of them isnt there because of the slowness of getting and relaying of the info..

Bowtie67; My thoughts exactly...! The LM1 would be the hot setup, but initially I think I'm going to hook up a narrow band. It's just too frustrating working with the Edelbrock controller alone.

Originally Posted by Bowtie67

Burt, How are you getting a 30% driveline loss? Manual Trans setups are around 15 % Turbo 350/powerglides are about 20% which most claim is all automatics, and the Turbo 400/and 700R4 have about 25% loss

I think Steve is probably accounting for the NP205 losses as well. I know my losses are way huge w/ the 700R & NP205. I don't even want to mention the 8500' above sea level...

[Yukon Jack]

So the above numbers confirm your enthusiasm for being BBC powered I'm sure - very cool to get it dynoed. I would like to do that also.

[Burt4x4]

let me try and get to all the questions.

jkade, I have not offically added up the cost. Took me 1yr to do. I started with a $175 dollor 'running when pulled' complete 454. I had a friend in the biz do the long block for me. New pistons/rings, heads rebuilt w/new everything, Add the EFI($2200), heders,ignition,flywheel/clutch,engine mounts, etc.... I would guess I am around $5K & 1yr or so. My original plan was to spend about $3K and two months

71RestoRod, I am going off what the EFI tech told me. He said within 10kmiles at that A/F ratio I would have burnt the valves. After the first run on the Dyno he jumped out of my truck WOW it is running WAY TOO LEAN!
I can't say for sure how they hooked up to get the A/F reading..didn't even think to ask?

Captkos, for the time I had, that is what I ended up with. The Edelbrock MPFI computer, according to the EFI tech, is 'old school' and not that easy to adjust. He said the Holly Comander 950 MPFI computer is way easier and way less time consuming to get EVERYTHING adjusted perfect.
The Edelbrock A/F is displayed by a L.E.D. on the handheld 'brick' computer. Green/Orange/Red are the colors the LED changes...so not as great as an actual A/F guage...kinda like an idiot light for A/F ratio hahahaa. So it takes alot of time to get the Edelbrock to be perfect. Hell my 454 runs like a champ so I'll just leaveit like it is.

70rs/ss, could be? Duno for sure. The Tri-Y design is only for low RPM applications and this may very well be the reason why! Good point. For me I am cool with that cuse I don't spend much time pass 3500rpm anyway. The nice and flat torque curve is what I was after when I started this build up. About 340Ft/Lbs just off idel

FrenchBlue72, Thanks

Bowtie67, The EFI Tech recomended I put a second bung in my exhaust and add a A/F guage. He showed me a digitail one that has a LED swing or fan type guage on it with a ratio read out..Very nice...VERY Pricey like $400bucks I may add one down the road but I be broke fer now...
The 30% was a guess, some of my 4x4 buddies suggested 30% (most common % I guess)...I have no clue how to accuretly figure out the loss %age? I have a SM465 w/NP205 (both stock). I did put in a big 30lbs flywheel.

The Holly computer for EFI is suppost to be way better for tuning. Edelbrock wirks great too just takes more time to tune and learn..once you are past that then yer good togo
I just wanted to use this smily hahaha

Yukon Jack, Yes sir I am lovin it. Wouldn't hurt, have it tuned while your there too...assuming you have a place nearby you can take your truck to.

Thanks for all the comments and good vibes!
RockOn
Burt

[LUV2XCLR8]

[Bowtie67]

I originally didnt count on the transfer cases losses but just the same I think you did an excellant job at tuning it. I know the earlier Edle setups used chips to tune them are they still that way or are you now somewhat able to tune them with a computer. I ran the early Holley MPFI setup and it was fairly easy to tune, but it also wasnt all that radical more for drivability and cruising, then I want radical and went with the Holley StealthRam with the Comander 950 when I got it tuned it was awsum but I couldnt stop the oil leaks because of the raised runner heads and ended pulling it.

[Burt4x4]

Ya Edlebrock burns your cam specs onto a chip to give you a base tune to run the engine on so you can fine tune from there...well sounds all fine and dandy but for me when I started my 454 the first time it sounded like my dad's harley....Blub.......blub.......blub hahaha barely running at all. I added fuel thru the Fuel Modifier section on the handheld and BBBUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr it smothed right out. Took me several minutes to figure out my 'base tune' wasen't worth crap. Actually ALL the settings were sitting at zero so I assumed the 'base tune' was in the chip...not..just the cam specs I guess?? Who knows..

Now that it is tuned I plan to just drive it and have fun.
I have been talking with Edelbrock via email and I am begining to understand the control modual and how to adjust it...time will tell
Burt

[RAB38]

Sounds like you got things under control with the dyno. How did you think it was running before you went, did you know it was that lean?

I have the edelbrock pro flow system on my 383 and just got it running last month. I have a wide band o2 set up as well so that I can make sure I am in the right AFR. I am finding the computer programmer a little tricky myself. I am thinking of getting a LM1 datalogger to record as I drive at different speeds so I can go in and adjust the fuel tables after I have recorded and not while I am driving. I don't have the truck street legal yet so I am just making blasts up the neighborhood street right now. Once I get it driveable we are going to put it on the dyno to fine tune it for Power.

My desktop dyno program is telling me that my set up should be near 500hp and 560 ft lbs. We'll see how close that is. Did you take into account your tire size in to your % drive train loss? My Blazer also has the T350 and nP205 and I am running 38.5 swampers so I am thinking I have about a 60% loss, but I don't know. THE DYNO WILL TELL THE TRUTH.

[K5KRAZIE]

DAMN! Nice bro! BBC MPFI!!!

[Burt4x4]

RAB38
Before the Dyno the engine seamed to run fine, awsome throttle responce and everything. But I knew I didn't have the tune-up done right. I messed with it on my own but I had no clue how to doit. I now have a better idea.
I now can visulize the setting menu items in the hand held computer (drop down menus). It is like a graph using RPM and Vacuum. But now I know a Air/Fuel Ratio guage is gonna be the best way to adjust for the tuning while driving. Now that I have a good set of base numbers to work with I can play around with the settings once I install a AFR guage. Autometer makes one that will match my other guages I stuffed into my guage cluster.
Ya the LM1 is sweet! I didn't even know about it utill this week. Almost 500 bones too so....
I will probly try just the AFR guage first and see if I can tune that way..
I run 35" SSR swampers. The 30% loss was suggested to me by other friends so I don't know how to acuratly come up with a % loss.
Is there a formula we can use to figure % loss?

K5KRAZIE ~ Thanks

Later
Burt