How much power is too much power for bags?

[IvelDesigns]

I'm still in the dream stage of my project. I've got a million ideas on what I plan to do, and then a few that I am 50/50 on.

One of those ideas is a 4/6 drop using coils and spindles. (69 lwb with trailing arms). If i don't have to c-notch, i'd rather not. And i think that bagging it will be a)more than i want to spend and b)lower than i need/want to go. However, it's an option.

But, one thing that I will be doing is having a 375-425hp motor built with about the same amount of torque. My question is, with your average bag setup, what is the most amount of HP you would realistically want to run? Keep in mind that this truck will be a DD (when there is no snow) and i enjoy my kidneys just as they are. I also want good traction when i take off for the occasional trip down the 1/4 mile.

[PBFAB.COM]

Air suspension would hold up to that much power no problem. It would also offer a better ride quality. We're using air suspension on a couple different rides that have twin turboed LS1 motors that are in the 800+hp range.

[SlammedDime]

An air spring as a much better spring rate (and an adjustable one at that) than coil or leaf springs, and because of that, and the ability to adjust the air pressure and volume in the spring to your desire, they can handle just about any amount of horsepower you can throw at them, that is, as long as the link setup used is properly installed. The key to allowing the air springs to work properly is to setup the link system so that the springs aren't loaded under acceleration (energy is transferred to chassis).

[Rokcrln]

Originally Posted by SlammedDime

The key to allowing the air springs to work properly is to setup the link system so that the springs aren't loaded under acceleration (energy is transferred to chassis).

I have found this to be 100% true. But keep in mind a little load will help put those tires to the ground better. But if you are running over 500 true hp you are not to worried about grip.

Kevin
LFD Inc.

[IvelDesigns]

ok, so with the to much power issue cleared up, what about feasablility of it?

Is a propery installed bag setup as reliable as coils/spindles? What about cost? I haven't done a ton of research into air kits, but what kind of range are we talking about here? again, i'm not looking to put my frame rails on the ground. Just a good 4/6 drop.

[PBFAB.COM]

www.ridetech.com

That will give you an idea of what products are available and pricing. Air Ride Technologies is the most expensive... but with them, you get what you pay for IMO.

[AesC10s]

Originally Posted by Rokcrln

But if you are running over 500 true hp you are not to worried about grip.

Kevin
LFD Inc.

What would happen if i had about 700 true HP and had slicks on at the dragstrip?

[Rokcrln]

Originally Posted by AesC10s

What would happen if i had about 700 true HP and had slicks on at the dragstrip?

With the wrong set up even with springs you will just spin. Now with the right set up and the right valving in your shocks you can run bags or springs with good results. Serious racers will not use bags since it is alot harder to get everything the same from run to run. With springs you can get the same results run after run and air temp or track temp will not affedt it like with bags.

Kevin
LFD Inc.

[bagged74]

you wont pass the tech inspection at some tracks with bags.

[AesC10s]

Originally Posted by bagged74

you wont pass the tech inspection at some tracks with bags.

Why?

[IvelDesigns]

ok, so i'm poking through the air ride site, and have come up with the following shopping cart:

Upper and lower STRONGARM set with CoolRide system includes control arms, cross shafts, bushings, airsprings, shocks and all hardware - $999
Here

1968-72 C10 and Suburban Lower Rear STRONGARM set with CoolRide system. Includes tubular arms, c-notches, panhard bar, upper crossmember, lower crossmember, airsprings, shocks and all mounting hardware. - $1699
Here

evelPro MAX system - includes (2) 327 Thomas compressors, (1) 5 gallon tank, LevelPro electronic control system, 4 LevelPro ride height sensors, ARV4000 airvalve, 1/4" airline and DOT fittings. Rise Time: approx. 3 seconds - $2195
Here

for a total of $4893.

That's a pretty penny for suspension IMO. Especailly since i plan to put that into the motor and tranny. What alternatives are there? If i were to do air, I would want it on all 4 corners and I'm not worried about a fast rise time. If i could find a good solution for under $2k, then i think it's an option. If not, i'll stick with my drop coils and c-notch.

Or, maybe i readjust my priorites and do bags this year, and engine/tranny next year.

[Bagd72Chevy]

I've never had a problem passing tech with my truck before it laid out. As long as you can drop it all the way down and everything is still safe.

As far as power, I have an LT1 right now, but soon to be a 397 ci LT1 with LT4 intake, normal stuff, plus some kind of power adder.

I'm looking to be in the 11's with a truck that will lay-out.
Ryan

[IvelDesigns]

Originally Posted by Bagd72Chevy

I've never had a problem passing tech with my truck before it laid out. As long as you can drop it all the way down and everything is still safe.

why would i air it out before tech? wouldn't i want it at ride height before tech?

[PBFAB.COM]

From what I understand Air Suspension is not "legal" as far as the NHRA rules are concerned. I do know, however, that the majority of tracks will still let you run at the Friday Night Drags... just not in competition.

[Mitchell_01]

I run at the track every weekend in my truck and never ever had a problem with tec. I run in the mid 9 and I run all air ride part and use their vari shocks with the duel ajusters and no traction problems. I fugure with Nitrous I run about 750-800 horses. Air ride is over priced but they are their for any Qs and their part are top qualty.

[IvelDesigns]

sounds like a non issue for me. I won't be taking it to the track for any competitions, just the random fri or sat night run.

thanks for the input guys!

[craig@ridetech.com]

Keep in mind that you said you only wanted to slightly drop your truck. Air Ride Tech makes a kit that is much less money and will give you the amount of drop you are looking for. The Strong Arm kits are for maximum amount of drop without major fabrication. If you stick with their CoolRide kits you can get a decent drop for for less money than the Strongarm kits you priced out.
The front for your truck goes for $524 and the Rear is $399 the compressor kit stays the same or if you don't mind a slower speed they offer one for as little as $995 that will still do all four corners separately.

[SlammedDime]

One piece of advice... don't buy ART products directly from ART. Go through Innovative Air Suspension (.com) (my favorite as well, Larry is a great guy) or SuicideDoors for their products. You'll get a better deal that way.

[cajundragger]

For whoever asked, they made my brother(bagd72chevy) drop his truck all the way in tech to make sure nothing hit the ground. In case a bag was to blow or something.

[IvelDesigns]

Originally Posted by cajundragger

For whoever asked, they made my brother(bagd72chevy) drop his truck all the way in tech to make sure nothing hit the ground. In case a bag was to blow or something.

ok, i can see why they would do that.

wonder if they should also make you let the air out of your tires to see what kinda of damage could be done to the track if you blew a tire

[Tony@AirRideTech]

good thread man..... First off, HP is not a factor when it comes to airsprings. On a properly designed suspension, the springs are only there to hold the vehicle up and control the suspension movement.... The ability to make it hook up is a fuction of suspension geometry first, and second choosing the right spring to make it all come together. An airspring lends itself extremely well to this inviroment because it is adjustable and tuneable unlike a spring that would have to be changed to get a different rate or jacked to change height.
As far as I know, NHRA and IHRA do not car what type of suspension you have or if it is air. The only thing I am aware of so far is that the driver can not have the ability to maipulate the system while on a run and that the vehicle does not violate scrub line in the event of a deflate. We have several guys that are running systems on bracket cars and diggers. I even have one guy that has his airsystem timed through his delay box....