Help!!! Starter won't fit..... - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

myersjeremy · 01-15-2007, 08:05 PM

Was just about to install the engine I have finished building and just by sheer chance tried bolting the starter up. It will not fit. The nose of the starter touches the flexplate with the bolt holes not even close to lining up. The engine I took out was thought to be a '85 model and I am sure the engine I am installing is a '85 model too. The only difference between the two engines is the location of the oil dipstick. The old one was on the passenger side and the rebuild is on the drivers side. I am using the same flexplate and the same starter from the previous engine. Any ideas???? Wrong starter? Thats what I am leaning towards because it is awfully close to the side of the block and to the oil dipstick. Thanks for any ideas...........
Jeremy

myersjeremy · 01-15-2007, 08:11 PM

Any chance that the flexplate could be backwards? I didnt take notice to how it come off the 1st engine so it is possible.

piecesparts · 01-15-2007, 09:00 PM

YEP YEP and YEP on that flexplate being wrong direction possibilty. Take a look at the bolt holes in the flexplate that are for the torque convertor connection and see if the indentions, where they are at, are going towards the tranny or away from it. That would be a hint of what direction you would want it to be. The indentions should be close to the torque convertor. Some flexplates are marked "Engine side", but many aren't.

The dipstick on the driver's side of the motor is a give away that it is NOT an 85 motor. The older model trucks (prior to 79) had the dipstick on the driver's side and the later ones had the dipstick on the passenger side. The early "TargetMaster" motors and the resulting "Crate Motors" from GM had both holes available with a steel plug that could be driven into the dipstick hole that is not used. Take a look at your block and see if there is a blind hole on the passenger side---Another Hint that the rebuilt motor is a GM crate motor.

Do you have three holes on your block, where your starter mounts? (this means that you can use either starter arragement; that I will talk about in the following sentence) What style of starter do you have? (one with an offset bolt pattern or one with the bolts in line with each other) The offset pattern is for a larger flexplate (168 tooth) and the straight is for the smaller flexplate (153 tooth). Are you absolutely sure that you have the right flexplate? Also if the starter is awful close to the block and oil dipstick, how can that be, if the dipstick is on the driver's side of the motor? The starter should bolt up to the block, as long as there are holes in the same pattern as the starter, because they are of the same design criteria.

myersjeremy · 01-15-2007, 09:09 PM

the flexplate is the 153 tooth one and the starter I have has the holes in line with each other. What I meant by being close to the dipstick is the fact that this block does have a hole for the dipstick on the passenger side. It is really confusing the heck out of me. There seems to be more than one set of holes where the starter mounts. What is the correct way to install the flexplate? I installed it with the indentions toward the block. There seemed to be a lip on the flexplate and thats the way I went with it.

Thanks for your help!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jeremy

myersjeremy · 01-15-2007, 10:07 PM

I promise this is the last time I will answer this post myself. Maybe this will help anyone else who has had this problem. I finally got in touch with my buddy at the machine shop that is working on the old block. I had him dig around and find the old flexplate. It's outside diameter was near 12 7/8" with 153 teeth. I measured the new flexplate and it measured 14 1/8" and also had 153 teeth. This new flexplate was ordered directly from LMC and is supposed to fit 73-85 trucks with auto trans. I think the old flexplate will eliminate the starter issue but I am still unsure of which side of the flexplate to turn towards the converter. Thanks for your help pieces n parts!!!!!!!!!!!

Jeremy

piecesparts · 01-15-2007, 11:58 PM

I think that you are wrong in your tooth count. If the one plate is an 1 1/4" bigger in diameter than the other, then it most certainly will have more teeth. I would count them again. I believe that you have a 168 tooth plate and that is part of your problem. The starter is for the smaller flexplate.

As for the direction of the mounting of the flexplate, If you go look at the original plate, it will become intuitively obvious what direction it should go. The bolt heads will have left shiney circles where they had been tightened onto the plate. I still say that the indentions should be installed so that they are closer to the torque convertor, so that the bolts don't have to go sor to engage in the holes on the converter. GO BACK TO THE MACHINE SHOP.

It is just my opinioin but, I would have ordered the flexplate from a parts house like Summit Racing and got a heavy duty one that is SFI rated, rather than gong to LMC.

piecesparts · 01-16-2007, 08:41 AM

Something that you have related to, has me concerned. You stated that the oil dipstick on the old motor is on the passenger side of the motor and the replacement motor has the dipstick on the driver's side. Are you using the same dipstick from your old motor on the replacement? If that is the case, I vaguely remember that the dipsticks are different in length. I would verify that the oil level is reading right, before I put the motor into use. Just a thought, that I had.

lurch115 · 01-22-2007, 12:45 AM

okay, to make the fly wheel thing a little easier...the side that faces AWAY from the crank shaft will be the side that when you look at the large center hole has a lip on it, and you want the indentations for the torque converter bolts to be bumped out towards the tranny...if you have the right starter and the right fly wheel.....the fly wheel will only bolt on one way and still line up with the starter...otherwise if you have the fly wheel on backwards it will hit the bendix housing about an 1/8 to a 1/4 inch in from the ned of the starter shaft....and as far as the dipstick...i agree with piecesparts.... the 2 sticks are different...use the one that the motor came with....

jimfulco · 01-23-2007, 01:37 AM

Look at the center hole in the flexplate. If it has a lip, it should be positioned away from the crankshaft flange.

01-15-2007, 08:05 PM	#1
myersjeremy Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: nc Posts: 118	Help!!! Starter won't fit..... Was just about to install the engine I have finished building and just by sheer chance tried bolting the starter up. It will not fit. The nose of the starter touches the flexplate with the bolt holes not even close to lining up. The engine I took out was thought to be a '85 model and I am sure the engine I am installing is a '85 model too. The only difference between the two engines is the location of the oil dipstick. The old one was on the passenger side and the rebuild is on the drivers side. I am using the same flexplate and the same starter from the previous engine. Any ideas???? Wrong starter? Thats what I am leaning towards because it is awfully close to the side of the block and to the oil dipstick. Thanks for any ideas........... Jeremy

01-15-2007, 08:11 PM	#2
myersjeremy Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: nc Posts: 118	Re: Help!!! Starter won't fit..... Any chance that the flexplate could be backwards? I didnt take notice to how it come off the 1st engine so it is possible.

01-15-2007, 09:00 PM	#3
piecesparts Parts and more parts Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Lebo, Kansas (middle of nowhere Posts: 6,821	Re: Help!!! Starter won't fit..... YEP YEP and YEP on that flexplate being wrong direction possibilty. Take a look at the bolt holes in the flexplate that are for the torque convertor connection and see if the indentions, where they are at, are going towards the tranny or away from it. That would be a hint of what direction you would want it to be. The indentions should be close to the torque convertor. Some flexplates are marked "Engine side", but many aren't. The dipstick on the driver's side of the motor is a give away that it is NOT an 85 motor. The older model trucks (prior to 79) had the dipstick on the driver's side and the later ones had the dipstick on the passenger side. The early "TargetMaster" motors and the resulting "Crate Motors" from GM had both holes available with a steel plug that could be driven into the dipstick hole that is not used. Take a look at your block and see if there is a blind hole on the passenger side---Another Hint that the rebuilt motor is a GM crate motor. Do you have three holes on your block, where your starter mounts? (this means that you can use either starter arragement; that I will talk about in the following sentence) What style of starter do you have? (one with an offset bolt pattern or one with the bolts in line with each other) The offset pattern is for a larger flexplate (168 tooth) and the straight is for the smaller flexplate (153 tooth). Are you absolutely sure that you have the right flexplate? Also if the starter is awful close to the block and oil dipstick, how can that be, if the dipstick is on the driver's side of the motor? The starter should bolt up to the block, as long as there are holes in the same pattern as the starter, because they are of the same design criteria. Last edited by piecesparts; 01-15-2007 at 09:03 PM.

01-15-2007, 09:09 PM	#4
myersjeremy Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: nc Posts: 118	Re: Help!!! Starter won't fit..... the flexplate is the 153 tooth one and the starter I have has the holes in line with each other. What I meant by being close to the dipstick is the fact that this block does have a hole for the dipstick on the passenger side. It is really confusing the heck out of me. There seems to be more than one set of holes where the starter mounts. What is the correct way to install the flexplate? I installed it with the indentions toward the block. There seemed to be a lip on the flexplate and thats the way I went with it. Thanks for your help!!!!!!!!!!!! Jeremy

01-15-2007, 10:07 PM	#5
myersjeremy Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: nc Posts: 118	Re: Help!!! Starter won't fit..... I promise this is the last time I will answer this post myself. Maybe this will help anyone else who has had this problem. I finally got in touch with my buddy at the machine shop that is working on the old block. I had him dig around and find the old flexplate. It's outside diameter was near 12 7/8" with 153 teeth. I measured the new flexplate and it measured 14 1/8" and also had 153 teeth. This new flexplate was ordered directly from LMC and is supposed to fit 73-85 trucks with auto trans. I think the old flexplate will eliminate the starter issue but I am still unsure of which side of the flexplate to turn towards the converter. Thanks for your help pieces n parts!!!!!!!!!!! Jeremy

01-15-2007, 11:58 PM	#6
piecesparts Parts and more parts Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Lebo, Kansas (middle of nowhere Posts: 6,821	Re: Help!!! Starter won't fit..... I think that you are wrong in your tooth count. If the one plate is an 1 1/4" bigger in diameter than the other, then it most certainly will have more teeth. I would count them again. I believe that you have a 168 tooth plate and that is part of your problem. The starter is for the smaller flexplate. As for the direction of the mounting of the flexplate, If you go look at the original plate, it will become intuitively obvious what direction it should go. The bolt heads will have left shiney circles where they had been tightened onto the plate. I still say that the indentions should be installed so that they are closer to the torque convertor, so that the bolts don't have to go sor to engage in the holes on the converter. GO BACK TO THE MACHINE SHOP. It is just my opinioin but, I would have ordered the flexplate from a parts house like Summit Racing and got a heavy duty one that is SFI rated, rather than gong to LMC.

01-16-2007, 08:41 AM	#7
piecesparts Parts and more parts Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Lebo, Kansas (middle of nowhere Posts: 6,821	Re: Help!!! Starter won't fit..... Something that you have related to, has me concerned. You stated that the oil dipstick on the old motor is on the passenger side of the motor and the replacement motor has the dipstick on the driver's side. Are you using the same dipstick from your old motor on the replacement? If that is the case, I vaguely remember that the dipsticks are different in length. I would verify that the oil level is reading right, before I put the motor into use. Just a thought, that I had.

01-22-2007, 12:45 AM	#8
lurch115 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: iowa Posts: 722	Re: Help!!! Starter won't fit..... okay, to make the fly wheel thing a little easier...the side that faces AWAY from the crank shaft will be the side that when you look at the large center hole has a lip on it, and you want the indentations for the torque converter bolts to be bumped out towards the tranny...if you have the right starter and the right fly wheel.....the fly wheel will only bolt on one way and still line up with the starter...otherwise if you have the fly wheel on backwards it will hit the bendix housing about an 1/8 to a 1/4 inch in from the ned of the starter shaft....and as far as the dipstick...i agree with piecesparts.... the 2 sticks are different...use the one that the motor came with.... __________________ "Horsepower is how fast you hit the wall, torque is how far you carry the wall with you." '84 chevy half ton short box 2wd, 67,000 actual miles '03 chevy 1500 HD crew cab 4x4 standard box, 6.0L Last edited by lurch115; 01-22-2007 at 12:47 AM.

01-23-2007, 01:37 AM	#9
jimfulco Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Shreveport LA Posts: 3,170	Re: Help!!! Starter won't fit..... Look at the center hole in the flexplate. If it has a lip, it should be positioned away from the crankshaft flange.



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