Screwed on E-Bay

[StingRay]

Well guys it looks like I'm getting royally screwed on an e-bay deal. I paid serious dollars for what was advertised as a set of NOS black deluxe 72 door panels. They have large scratches and have a ding in the trim and get a look at the backs of these. Check out the nails bent the other way and the rust stains. Anybody think this looks NOS. Opinions welcome. The guy is saying it is shipping damage and he bought them new 15 years ago. No offer to make it right yet just a bunch of crap. In retrospect looking at the pics of the part #'s I should have figured it out but I just thought the back was a bit dusty. Buyer beware eh.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...405867777&rd=1

[Blue Beard]

Looks like 15 years ago, they may have been NOS.

But with that much rust they are not........

Contact ebay and give them all the info and pictures..........they will help alot.

[Classic Heartbeat]

NOS means just that.. New Old Stock. Whitch means it is unused and has never been installed on a truck. Damage can and does happen to NOS stuff over the years it is setting on a shelf or on someones bench. If there is any humidity in the air the little nails will rust. If it is shipping damage then you should be able to tell if the packaging is hurt. Even if so I think that the seller holds some responcability because of the poor packaging job. Just my opinion though.... Anyway the point is NOS means new old stock and not necessarily undamaged goods. WES www.ClassicHeartbeat.com

[da-burb]

The pictures look good @ the auction site. I wouldn't hold the rusty trim clips against him, that is easily 15+ years of sitting around. Determining if the scratch was there before or after it shipped can only be determined by how it was packed like WES said.

[StingRay]

Ok, But what are your opinions about the nails that are bent the other way and most of them are bent the opposite direction from the stains and indentations of the previous trim install and the horisontal rust stain nowhere near the nails that is obviously from being installed. All four door handle holes also show deformation and signs of being used.

[StingRay]

another

Still look NOS? I really want your opinions.

[StingRay]

Oh yes there was minor damage on the box but it was double boxed and wrapped in foam and no damage perforated both layers of the box and none of the foam. Also no holes in the boxes lined up so could only be assumed to be from some other previous use of the boxes. I understand that over the years small damage can occur and expect such but trust me the rust on the nails is not surface and not from sitting. If you look close at one of the pics of the arm rest holes you can see threads on one side of it.

[Dreaminator]

My old ones were in better shape than those shown in your pixs. but the give away is the condition of the nails themselves. It takes a while for nails to rust like those...dont you think?

[jeepbut]

My definition of new is undamaged. If it is damaged, it is no longer new old stock, but rather damaged old stock and should be advertized as such. In my opinion N.O.S does mean undamaged goods. Who would buy an N.O.S. fender that had been run over by a forklift? Oh, and yes you got screwed!

[Rod]

Whats the front look like?

[Classic Heartbeat]

StingRay, It does appear to be a bit fishy. Did you ask him about why the nails are turned? It is always possible that the trim loosened up somehow (probly through shrinkage of the plastic) and he may just have tried to tighten it up. I am not trying to defend the guy, rather giving you questions to ask him. As for the ware on the hole for the door handles, I just don't see it... If there was ware in the holes from use it would show on the front side.
jeepbut, I also agree with you about how NOS parts are discribed, but NOS does not mean New Undamaged Parts it is New Old Stock. A good example of what I mean is like 30 year old chrome parts... Chrome checks as it gets older, but that doesn't mean that it isn't NOS. Corvette guys especially pay big money for an unrestored NOS part, because it hold more value than either an origanal rechromed piece or rechromed NOS piece. I believe if you are selling something as NOS and it has damage, then you should disclose the damage. However not everyone believes as I do and will make the argument that it is a New Old Stock part that is unused and it is bound to have shelf ware over that period of time. WES www.ClassicHeartbeat.com

[StingRay]

Rod they don't look horrible on the front side. The pass is real clean and the drivers isn't terrible. If it didn't have a 10" " area that was all scratched up I wouldn't be as upset. I can replace the dinged trim on the one but these things cost me 300 bucks Canadian delivered with taxes and fee paid. Heres a photo of the scratches. The discoloration is strictly lighting. They are nice driver quality but 300 bucks should buy NOS when they are advertised NOS. Wes close ups of the thread marks on the arm rest holes to follow.

[StingRay]

Wes Close ups of thread marks

[StingRay]

another

[LudwigTheMad]

well call me crazy...oops bad expresion for me.....but if you feel you didn't get what you paid for, tell the seller directly that you feel he didn't represent the condition accurately. Then see if he offers you a compramise, if he doesn't pipe up immeadiatly with one, offer one of your own (It can be hard to think one up....).

If he doesn't or won't work with you, then report to ebay, and give him neg feedback...

This is the reason of course that I but NOTHING off of ebay....if I see something I like, I find the LARGE company that is selling it and deal with them directly.

Let the rest of us know your view, and the name of the seller (just in case we agree, we can avoid buying from him/her) but please don't try to get us to agree with you.


Just my $.20....($.02 x 10.....lol)

By the way I bought a pair of nos studebaker fenders.......one had a lot of surface rust, and no pre drilled trim holes, the other was in good shape with trim holes. I researched and found out that they both were NOS, just from different years (why trim holes on one and not the other....).

They look great on the studebaker.....

[cheyenne10]

I'm glad I missed out!! I do see the wear on the regulator holes in pics. It also looks like stains where panels were up against controlers over time. Their ad did say these had the trim but not that trim was NOS. I assume these pieces are different part number therefore he added them to dress up waht he as was selling. Ebay ratings all good, this auction looked like a real deal, I would be very disapointed too. I wonder if you could have asked enough questions to find out answers before buying? Pics from so far away are suspicious. Blems in NOS or anytinng should be disclosed. To leave the obvious unsaid leads to disgruntled buyer most times.

[Classic Heartbeat]

Ya I see the thread marks now... How strange and I would wonder how they got there. I wouldn't be happy with them either and feel that the damage should have been disclosed in the auction.... I hope it turns out allright for you. WES www.ClassicHeartbeat.com

[72K10]

I think the seller meant to say "original" instead of NOS. Regardless of your own definition, I think all would agree that NOS means unused. These are definitely used. And I think if you ask the seller directly, he will admit that, because he's confused NOS with original.

Whether or not he admits that they are used, these panels are obviously (using the seller's terminology) grossly misrepresented. You should be entitled to a full refund, including shipping, or a return of at least 50% of your purchase price if you decide to keep the panels.

Hell I bought a set of used panels from CPNE a couple of years ago that were in better shape than that (CPNE is a super person to deal with, by the way).

[StingRay]

I e-mailed the guy as soon a I got them and have since asked all of the questions. His response is that he bought them new 15 years ago, they have never been installed and any problems must be shipping damage. How do you figure the US post office got the bolts through the holes perfectly to leave those thread marks.......... right through the box? LOL. You know I never thought about the trim part was not represented as NOS. His description of the panels says the trim was perfect before shipping and the rust is from sitting for 15 years not becasue the trim is not NOS. I could have have accepted that part of an explanation if he'd said that........but he didn't.

Heres some of the e-mails

Hi Mark,

I got the panels and they are in tact. They are not NOS. There is dirt and rust on the back sides that indicate installation and use. One has siginificant scratches not, anything that I would deem minor. The holes where the armrest bolts go through are deformed which also indicates installation and use. You represented them as NOS which means NEW OLD STOCK as in NEW stuff that is old stock that has been sitting. These are positively NOT NOS and clearly a misrepresentation of the item. I would have never paid the dollars I did for fairly good used panels. Please let me know your position on this matter.

Ray

Hello Ray, Sorry to hear your unhappy with the door panels. They may be a little dirty, and have some surface rust on the staples, BUT they were never installed. I bought them NEW about 15 years ago from a chevy dealership.They have been stored in a unairconditioned warehouse since. KEEP in mind these things were mass produced by G.M. by the thousands. In your second e-mail you referred to dented trim? When I shipped the panels the trim was flawless. What condition were the boxes in when you received the package? It sounds to me like the postal service strikes again..... Mark M.

A this point he wants to see pics of the box so I sent them. I said even if the scratches and the ding had happened in shipping (which they couldn't have) they still wouldn't be NOS and told him I want my money back. I also offered him the opportunity for a partial settlement to give me some of my money back and Ill keep the panels. I've e-mailed him a couple of times since with further pics of damage and evidence of installation and he has not responded back.

Plain and simple in my mind these are NOT NOS. Can I take it most of you would agree to that point. I am certainly convinced they are not.

Once again opinions please.

[jerry moss]

i'm with Wes and everyone else on this, you have tried contacting the seller to resolve the problem and he won't respond. now it's time to contact ebay directly and see if they can get some compensation for you. you paid very good money for NOS parts and got used/damaged parts and deserve to be treated fairly.
personally, i'd want a full refund and send him back his damaged goods--after i got the refund. i've seen used 72 door panels at swap meets that are in better shape than the ones he sent you, and nowhere near 300 bucks.
best of luck

[StingRay]

Well the guy offered me my auction bid amount back if I send him the panels first and pay the freight. That would put me out a hundred bucks if he ever actually sent the money. Not good enough for me. I am safer keeping them and having something to show for it. He will get bad feedback and be reported.

[Classic Heartbeat]

I would email him to that effect. Tell him if you return the panels that you are still out the shipping and Duty to the tune of $100.00 and that is unacceptable. Let him know you will not return the panels without him reimburcing you totally and that includes the shipping and Duty. Remind him that you wouldn't be out the money if he hadn't misrepresented the panels or at the very least disclosed the damage. Then tell him that a partial refund would make you happy, or a complete refund to include all shipping fees and any Duties you have incured. If he doesn't do one of the above things, then you will turn him into ebay and give him bad feedback also. I know this seems like a lot to do to try to get your funds back, but sometimes pointing out things to people in perfect clarity will make them think twice. You can also tell him if you want that once the panels are returned that he can start a claim with the post office for the damage that he claims that they did... Good Luck... WES www.ClassicHeartbeat.com

[StingRay]

He had already given me a take it or leave it and I've already tried all of that stuff. The guy is an A$$hole. This has gotten past the niceties.

Thanks for all of your input. It's feels better to be validated by you guys and to have somebody that understands to vent to.

You win some and you lose some.