Brake pads too tight - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

71RULES! · 12-20-2009, 05:13 PM

My 71 K10 needed rotors. I was feeling pulsing in pedal. I bought steering stabilizer, and rotors, and new metalic pads (Autozone).
After putting on the new rotors, and assemblind the passenger side, I find that my pads are pretty tights to the rotor. It was pretty hard to get the caliper back on. I do believe the caliper is fully compressed. I know it's not the bearings because with the caliper removed, it spins ok. With the caliper installed, it is giving resistance to hand turning. I can turn it, but it's too tight IMO.

I road tested and it stops well and the pulsing is reduced because I only did the pass side so far. But with only a quick trip up and down my street, the rotors seemed to get a little hot.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

**57NAPCO** · 12-20-2009, 11:13 PM

just a note, warped brake rotors are caused by over tightening or improper tightening of the lug nuts...not all the time but most of the time.IMHO

72 CustomCamper · 12-20-2009, 11:51 PM

Open the bleeder and see if any brake fluid squirts out. If so try to turn the rotor. If it turns easy pump the brakes up and try to trun the rotor again. If after that it's still hard to turn you might have a cloged soft brake line. I just went through this with a friend's car a few days ago...

Chuck

71RULES! · 12-21-2009, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72 CustomCamper

Open the bleeder and see if any brake fluid squirts out. If so try to turn the rotor. If it turns easy pump the brakes up and try to trun the rotor again. If after that it's still hard to turn you might have a cloged soft brake line. I just went through this with a friend's car a few days ago...

Chuck

Great advice Chuck. I'll try that tomorrow and see what happens.

Thank You!

71RULES! · 12-23-2009, 11:04 AM

Well, yesterday I tried checking the flex line. It had no pressure in it, and opening the bleeder didn't provide any clearence. This seems to be a physical problem, not hydrolic. I'm saying either the pads are too thick, the rotors are too thick, or the calipers are too narrow.

So I went ahead and bought new calipers, hardware, and flex lines, and installed them. the problem did not change.

It's tight enough that the wheel does not spin freely, even with the weight of the 31-10.50s bolted up. I can turn the wheels, but they are not free spinning.

Today I'll get out the dial calipers and compare the old rotor width with the new rotors. they look identical, but something is amiss.

What I think is totally cool, is that I walked into the local Napa parts store, and they had ALL the parts in stock. Lets see a '71 Dodge or Ford owner do that.

I suppose they might, but I find it amazing anyway.

71RULES! · 12-31-2009, 12:18 AM

Very strange. The rotors are within a few thousandths of each other, so that's not it.
Also, I did the other side, and it is perfect. When I pulled the hub apart, I found that the driver's side had a part that the pass side didn't have. The Hub spring on the DS rides on a metal ring that separates the spring from the outer bearing. On the pass side (the tight side), that ring is missing, and the spring goes down to the bearing collar. That does not seem right. Anyone know where I might get one of these and what it is called? I don't think this could be the tight brake problem, but I think it needs to be in there anyway.

LONGHAIR · 12-31-2009, 03:58 PM

Pictures would be nice here.
What kind of hubs do you have?

As far as the brakes...Have you measured other pads? I suppose that it is possible that the pads you have are too thick? Maybe take your micrometer/calipers to the autoparts store and measure?

Are you sure that your bolts and bushings are ok? Nothing bent or rusted to the point where they are affecting the way that the caliper mounts to the bracket?

71RULES! · 12-31-2009, 09:40 PM

HAHAH I FIGURED IT OUT!!!!
It was the wheel bearings believe it or not. Someone has used the wrong inner bearing which had let the hub go on just a LITTLE bit further onto the spindle. This caused the rotor to be too close to the caliper cup. DAMIT!

I put new races and bearings in her and she works great now... well almost DOH!
The wheel now spins freely just like the driver's side, but.....
Now I'm having trouble bleeding the brakes. I think I have all the air out, but it won't pump up. I'm getting pressure on the pads, as I can see the caliper cup moving in and out and can't turn the wheels when the brakes are applied, but the pedel goes all the way to the floor, and it does not pump up like it does when you have air in the lines.

I have not opened up the rears, but tomorrow, I'm going to bleed all 4 points and see what happens. I have never seen one with air in the lines that won't pump up after 3 or 4 pumps.

Perhaps the proportioning valve is messed up. I don't have any experience with those.
Any advice on what I should look for with the valve?

71RULES! · 12-31-2009, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LONGHAIR

Pictures would be nice here.
What kind of hubs do you have?

Are you sure that your bolts and bushings are ok? Nothing bent or rusted to the point where they are affecting the way that the caliper mounts to the bracket?

Oh, and yes, it has all stock hubs on it and all new brake parts including bolts.

Thanks for the response.

OrrieG · 12-31-2009, 10:47 PM

3-4 pumps??I always take a seat and give the brakes a good 40-50 making sure the pedal comes up all the way. Are the calipers mounted on the correct sides (bleeder on the top). They can be reversed. When I swapped my front end I had the same problem, turns out the guy before had the bleeder on the bottom and it is almost impossible to get the air out. I swapped the sides and everything bleed ok. I also got a set of speedbleeders from Russell, makes life easier too.

71RULES! · 12-31-2009, 11:32 PM

OMG WTH LOL@Me!!!
Yes, the bleeders are on the bottom. DOH!
I'll switch them tommorow and post back results.

I LOVE THIS SITE!
Thanks for your help.

**Getter-Done** · 01-01-2010, 01:00 AM

Hey 71 Rules

I have had trouble in the past with////
My front Rubber brake Hoses too Both front Calipers
Would Deteriorate inside and Block FULL Flow of brake fluid to
Front Calipers I replaced 1 and it pulled too 1 Side
so Quickly I went back too the Parts Store and Bought the Other side.
My problem Solved.

Not saying this is Your Problem
But if Your Brake Hoses are Looking bad???????
This is a Good Investment.

I Just seen Where You say you Replaced Them
Happy New Year and Hope you Get it Fixed
I know u Will.

LONGHAIR · 01-01-2010, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 71RULES!

Yes, the bleeders are on the bottom. DOH!

That'll do it...

71RULES! · 01-03-2010, 08:39 PM

Ok, she is a runner now!

My god, I have NEVER spent this much time on a brake job before. I probably have a good 40 hours into it.

Every other bolt was rusted and broke. This alone ate up a bunch of time. Bleeding was a nightmare. I swapped the calipers and that took care of the fronts. BUT....

For some reason, this truck has no adjuster holes on the rear backing plates. When I first put the rears on, I left them loose, figuring that the auto adjusters would have to do it. Although the pads were loose, the new wheel cyls would extend far enough to lock up the drums. So I thought I was good to bleed and drive to adjust the rears. THINK AGAIN.

Every time I pumped the pedal, the rear wheel cyls moved so far that the proportioning valve tripped, shutting off the rears. This took me a while to figure out. Once I did, I adjusted up the rears enough to just barely let the drums go on, and that did it. The bleeding went as expected from that point on.

I had to do a little wiring fix as many grounds were bad with rust on screws and what not. Got that cleared up and the lights all work now.

I'll be driving to work with it next week. It's an hour each way, so I'll get some good run time on the rig. It's been sitting so long that I feel that it really needs to get some miles on it to make the parts move again. The front end is pretty sloppy, but not bad enough to worry me. I took it on the freeway today and it was find and dandy.

Thanks a lot for all the good advice I got here, both in this thread and elsewhere. I did a lot of reading about proportioning valves.
I'm happy as Jiminy Cricket.

71RULES! · 01-03-2010, 08:49 PM

Here's a pic for those following this drama.

**Stocker** · 01-03-2010, 09:38 PM

Whew!! Glad to see you made some (hard-earned) progress! Good luck with your shake-down runs to work, hope it all goes well.

**Getter-Done** · 01-03-2010, 11:54 PM

Good Deal
Keep On Truck-ing

OrrieG · 01-04-2010, 12:02 AM

Glad it worked out, brakes can be aggrevating.

71RULES! · 01-04-2010, 12:55 AM

It would have been MUCH easier if I had just gone ahead and bought everything and installed it all at once. Instead. I bought one thing, installed it, then had problems, bought another thing, installed it which involved re-doing the previous step. And so on and so on.
Everything has been replaced except the rear drums because they were perfect, and the proportioning valve because I could not find one locally.

Oh well, all new now so I'm GTG.

71RULES! · 01-04-2010, 12:34 PM

What a great resource this site is.

84 400 · 01-05-2010, 05:10 AM

cool man always good to have another runner.

71RULES! · 01-13-2010, 12:14 PM

Just to put a final ALL FIXED post in here, I wanted to note that the original pulsing of the brake pedel was NOT coming from the front discs, but it was caused by a badly warped brake drum on the passenger side rear. I replaced that on Monday, and now the brakes are as smooth as silk, and work as new.

Again, thanks for all the help here. I appreciate it.

12-20-2009, 05:13 PM	#1
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Brake pads too tight My 71 K10 needed rotors. I was feeling pulsing in pedal. I bought steering stabilizer, and rotors, and new metalic pads (Autozone). After putting on the new rotors, and assemblind the passenger side, I find that my pads are pretty tights to the rotor. It was pretty hard to get the caliper back on. I do believe the caliper is fully compressed. I know it's not the bearings because with the caliper removed, it spins ok. With the caliper installed, it is giving resistance to hand turning. I can turn it, but it's too tight IMO. I road tested and it stops well and the pulsing is reduced because I only did the pass side so far. But with only a quick trip up and down my street, the rotors seemed to get a little hot. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

12-20-2009, 11:13 PM	#2
57NAPCO F’B’D guy Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Texas/Maine Posts: 2,217	Re: Brake pads too tight just a note, warped brake rotors are caused by over tightening or improper tightening of the lug nuts...not all the time but most of the time.IMHO

12-20-2009, 11:51 PM	#3
72 CustomCamper huh ??? Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Fredericksburg,Va. Posts: 3,369	Re: Brake pads too tight Open the bleeder and see if any brake fluid squirts out. If so try to turn the rotor. If it turns easy pump the brakes up and try to trun the rotor again. If after that it's still hard to turn you might have a cloged soft brake line. I just went through this with a friend's car a few days ago... Chuck __________________ 90 Blazer Silverado 350w/ 700R4 and 32" Kelly's "I am a bomb technician. If you see me running try to keep up!"

12-23-2009, 11:04 AM	#5
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Re: Brake pads too tight Well, yesterday I tried checking the flex line. It had no pressure in it, and opening the bleeder didn't provide any clearence. This seems to be a physical problem, not hydrolic. I'm saying either the pads are too thick, the rotors are too thick, or the calipers are too narrow. So I went ahead and bought new calipers, hardware, and flex lines, and installed them. the problem did not change. It's tight enough that the wheel does not spin freely, even with the weight of the 31-10.50s bolted up. I can turn the wheels, but they are not free spinning. Today I'll get out the dial calipers and compare the old rotor width with the new rotors. they look identical, but something is amiss. What I think is totally cool, is that I walked into the local Napa parts store, and they had ALL the parts in stock. Lets see a '71 Dodge or Ford owner do that. I suppose they might, but I find it amazing anyway. Last edited by 71RULES!; 12-24-2009 at 10:28 AM. Reason: spelling

12-31-2009, 12:18 AM	#6
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Re: Brake pads too tight Very strange. The rotors are within a few thousandths of each other, so that's not it. Also, I did the other side, and it is perfect. When I pulled the hub apart, I found that the driver's side had a part that the pass side didn't have. The Hub spring on the DS rides on a metal ring that separates the spring from the outer bearing. On the pass side (the tight side), that ring is missing, and the spring goes down to the bearing collar. That does not seem right. Anyone know where I might get one of these and what it is called? I don't think this could be the tight brake problem, but I think it needs to be in there anyway. Last edited by 71RULES!; 12-31-2009 at 12:19 AM.

12-31-2009, 09:40 PM	#8
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Re: Brake pads too tight HAHAH I FIGURED IT OUT!!!! It was the wheel bearings believe it or not. Someone has used the wrong inner bearing which had let the hub go on just a LITTLE bit further onto the spindle. This caused the rotor to be too close to the caliper cup. DAMIT! I put new races and bearings in her and she works great now... well almost DOH! The wheel now spins freely just like the driver's side, but..... Now I'm having trouble bleeding the brakes. I think I have all the air out, but it won't pump up. I'm getting pressure on the pads, as I can see the caliper cup moving in and out and can't turn the wheels when the brakes are applied, but the pedel goes all the way to the floor, and it does not pump up like it does when you have air in the lines. I have not opened up the rears, but tomorrow, I'm going to bleed all 4 points and see what happens. I have never seen one with air in the lines that won't pump up after 3 or 4 pumps. Perhaps the proportioning valve is messed up. I don't have any experience with those. Any advice on what I should look for with the valve?

12-31-2009, 10:47 PM	#10
OrrieG Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Idaho Posts: 8,800	Re: Brake pads too tight 3-4 pumps??I always take a seat and give the brakes a good 40-50 making sure the pedal comes up all the way. Are the calipers mounted on the correct sides (bleeder on the top). They can be reversed. When I swapped my front end I had the same problem, turns out the guy before had the bleeder on the bottom and it is almost impossible to get the air out. I swapped the sides and everything bleed ok. I also got a set of speedbleeders from Russell, makes life easier too. __________________ 1959 Chevy Short Fleetside w/ 74 4WD drive train (current project) OrrieG Build Thread 1964 Chevelle Malibu w/ 355-350TH (daily driver) Helpful AD and TF Manual Site Old Car Manual Project

12-31-2009, 11:32 PM	#11
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Re: Brake pads too tight OMG WTH LOL@Me!!! Yes, the bleeders are on the bottom. DOH! I'll switch them tommorow and post back results. I LOVE THIS SITE! Thanks for your help.

01-01-2010, 01:00 AM	#12
Getter-Done Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: TN. Posts: 7,861	Re: Brake pads too tight Hey 71 Rules I have had trouble in the past with//// My front Rubber brake Hoses too Both front Calipers Would Deteriorate inside and Block FULL Flow of brake fluid to Front Calipers I replaced 1 and it pulled too 1 Side so Quickly I went back too the Parts Store and Bought the Other side. My problem Solved. Not saying this is Your Problem But if Your Brake Hoses are Looking bad??????? This is a Good Investment. I Just seen Where You say you Replaced Them Happy New Year and Hope you Get it Fixed I know u Will. Last edited by Getter-Done; 01-01-2010 at 01:12 AM. Reason: re Read Post

01-03-2010, 08:39 PM	#14
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Re: Brake pads too tight Ok, she is a runner now! My god, I have NEVER spent this much time on a brake job before. I probably have a good 40 hours into it. Every other bolt was rusted and broke. This alone ate up a bunch of time. Bleeding was a nightmare. I swapped the calipers and that took care of the fronts. BUT.... For some reason, this truck has no adjuster holes on the rear backing plates. When I first put the rears on, I left them loose, figuring that the auto adjusters would have to do it. Although the pads were loose, the new wheel cyls would extend far enough to lock up the drums. So I thought I was good to bleed and drive to adjust the rears. THINK AGAIN. Every time I pumped the pedal, the rear wheel cyls moved so far that the proportioning valve tripped, shutting off the rears. This took me a while to figure out. Once I did, I adjusted up the rears enough to just barely let the drums go on, and that did it. The bleeding went as expected from that point on. I had to do a little wiring fix as many grounds were bad with rust on screws and what not. Got that cleared up and the lights all work now. I'll be driving to work with it next week. It's an hour each way, so I'll get some good run time on the rig. It's been sitting so long that I feel that it really needs to get some miles on it to make the parts move again. The front end is pretty sloppy, but not bad enough to worry me. I took it on the freeway today and it was find and dandy. Thanks a lot for all the good advice I got here, both in this thread and elsewhere. I did a lot of reading about proportioning valves. I'm happy as Jiminy Cricket.

01-03-2010, 08:49 PM	#15
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Re: Brake pads too tight Here's a pic for those following this drama. Attached Images

01-03-2010, 09:38 PM	#16
Stocker 20' Daredevil (Ret) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Jefferson State Posts: 13,547	Re: Brake pads too tight Whew!! Glad to see you made some (hard-earned) progress! Good luck with your shake-down runs to work, hope it all goes well. __________________ - Mike - 1972 K20 LWB 350/350/205 RIP El Jay

01-03-2010, 11:54 PM	#17
Getter-Done Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: TN. Posts: 7,861	Re: Brake pads too tight Good Deal Keep On Truck-ing

01-04-2010, 12:02 AM	#18
OrrieG Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Idaho Posts: 8,800	Re: Brake pads too tight Glad it worked out, brakes can be aggrevating. __________________ 1959 Chevy Short Fleetside w/ 74 4WD drive train (current project) OrrieG Build Thread 1964 Chevelle Malibu w/ 355-350TH (daily driver) Helpful AD and TF Manual Site Old Car Manual Project

01-04-2010, 12:55 AM	#19
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Re: Brake pads too tight It would have been MUCH easier if I had just gone ahead and bought everything and installed it all at once. Instead. I bought one thing, installed it, then had problems, bought another thing, installed it which involved re-doing the previous step. And so on and so on. Everything has been replaced except the rear drums because they were perfect, and the proportioning valve because I could not find one locally. Oh well, all new now so I'm GTG. Last edited by 71RULES!; 01-04-2010 at 12:55 AM. Reason: spelling



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01-04-2010, 12:34 PM	#20
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Who ya gonna call? What a great resource this site is. Attached Images

01-05-2010, 05:10 AM	#21
84 400 Sb 400 club Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: NH / MA Posts: 2,741	Re: Brake pads too tight cool man always good to have another runner. __________________ 1984 chevy c10, built 400sb,.(SOLD) 77 K10 Project / daily driver "The Grinch" http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=318363 1956 Willys Wagon (327 chevy) Project (Now Buick 225) 1980 Corvette L-48 4 speed 1992 Mustang GT built 5.0 5 speed 1985 C10 LWB Sold 1982 K10 SWB plow truck Parted out 1986 D30 M1028 fire brush truck Parted out

01-13-2010, 12:14 PM	#22
71RULES! Short Step 4X4 Cheyenne Club Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Folsom, Ca (near Sacramento) Posts: 73	Re: Brake pads too tight Just to put a final ALL FIXED post in here, I wanted to note that the original pulsing of the brake pedel was NOT coming from the front discs, but it was caused by a badly warped brake drum on the passenger side rear. I replaced that on Monday, and now the brakes are as smooth as silk, and work as new. Again, thanks for all the help here. I appreciate it.

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