a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

63 & 64 Bowties · 08-22-2009, 03:06 PM

I've got a 69 farm use dump truck.... this one:
(yea, I know. I'm gonna fix it up one of these days, honest)

And, I bought a 92 3500 a while back for the engine/trans for my 53 AD.
I was hoping to use the 92's wheels/tires for my 69 dump truck.
I started to do the swap yesterday, then I find out the 92 has bigger wheel studs than the 69. I would imagine the bolt pattern is the same (I haven't checked yet.) But, can I use the 69 lug nuts and bolt up the 92 wheels on the 69? Anyone done this?
I really want to get rid of those split ring rims.
My other dilemma is that I wanted to put 4 of the 69 rims on the 92 to make it a roller, but I guess the only way to do that is to drill out the 69 rims, they're junk anyway.
Any advise would be appreciated.

sailed2japan · 08-22-2009, 03:44 PM

This I know about duallies, at least the 92, the rims are hub centric, not lug centric. Meaning the hub keeps the wheel in the right place for rotaion and the lugs apply the going/stopping force. That being said, as long as the hub is the same size you shouldn't have any problems swapping the rims around and drilling larger holes in the 69's to make them fit the 92. The easiest way to tell wether or not the 69's rims are hub centric is to look at the lug nuts. If the side that goes against the wheel is flat, not conicle, then they are definately hub centric. If they are conicle, it may go either way, I dn't know the specifics for that year.

Livrat · 08-22-2009, 03:51 PM

Yes the bolt pattern is the same but 1967-70 used smaller studs than the 92, Yes you could bolt them on using the 69 lug nuts.
BUT.. DO NOT DO IT!
It is a dangerous thing, as the wheels will "rock" back and forth under braking eventually wearing through the studs till they break.. Ask me how I know...
The only way to safely use the 92 wheels is to change all of your studs on your 69 to the same diameter as the 92 wheels.. not a cheap way to go!!

Yes you can drill out the split rims to make them rollers..

63 & 64 Bowties · 08-22-2009, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Livrat

The only way to safely use the 92 wheels is to change all of your studs on your 69 to the same diameter as the 92 wheels.. not a cheap way to go!!

I guess I'd have to find drums with larger holes. There's no way larger studs are going thru those smaller holes, right?

sailed2japan · 08-22-2009, 04:41 PM

livrat- good point wish I had thought of that...

You may be able to drill the drums as well. I would think the problem would lye in the knurls of the studs themselves.

I have some dually stuff I'l pm you about.

BCOWANWHEELS · 08-22-2009, 04:55 PM

Why dont you just move the body over to the 92 frame. Then everything under the body will be 1992

**Joesjunk** · 08-22-2009, 05:19 PM

I drilled out the 1/2" lugs on my 68 1 ton and put in the 9/16" ones so I could use the newer wheels. Its not that hard to do, but takes some time

63 & 64 Bowties · 08-22-2009, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joesjunk

I drilled out the 1/2" lugs on my 68 1 ton and put in the 9/16" ones so I could use the newer wheels. Its not that hard to do, but takes some time

Yea, that's a thought.
I just wonder why they wouldn't work as they are. Think about it, even factory lugs are somewhat smaller than the holes in the wheels. I thought because they are beveled, they get centered as they are tightened. What difference would it make if the hole was a lot bigger than the lug? If the lugs are loose, they're gonna get wobbled out if they're factory or if they're a lot smaller than the hole, either way.

????

63 & 64 Bowties · 08-24-2009, 07:37 AM

any other ideas or comments?
thanks

**special-K** · 08-24-2009, 08:05 AM

The problem is the slop in the wheel hole.If the lugs are torqued down hard enough they could possibly keep the wheel from rocking on the studs.But,maybe not and you`ll be shearing the studs.I`d drill the hubs are press 9/16s studs in.I did it on a`70 to use chrome Budd wheels for `70s disc brake trucks.

63 & 64 Bowties · 11-19-2009, 05:02 PM

Dredging up an old post, but I haven't done anything yet and I have another idea.
What about wheel adapters/spacers? I see ones that are as thin as 1.5" and are 8 on 6.5" to 8 on 6.5" adapters with 9/16 lugs.
I'm just trying to do this the easiest way. It's just a farm truck that has dry rotted tires on split rims and I already have the newer wheels with decent tires.

**slomotion** · 11-19-2009, 05:28 PM

Joe'sjunk is right. Drill the drums to take the 9/16 lug and you won't have any problems, with the exception of having to buy a set of lug nuts too. The old ('69) lugs are a single piece nut that just tightens up against the wheel. The new lug nuts have a captured washer that allows the nut to turn even though the washer is against the wheel. This gives you a truer torque.
Wheel spacers aren't the best idea on this size wheel because as someone above mentioned the wheels are hub centered and the farther away from the hub you get the more room for error.
If you're going to fix this truck up, may as well do it right now, be safe, and on the plus side you've opened up your wheel choices dramatically.
BTW, these are not conical self-centering nuts. They are flat faced relying on the hub for centering.

68K30 · 11-20-2009, 01:21 PM

Not related to your wheel question but the dump bed looks just like the Aristocrat bed I have on my 68 K-30. What type of hoist does your bed have?

Thanks
Bill

factorystock · 11-21-2009, 01:49 PM

I would use pre 1970 19.5" one piece dual type wheels.A direct bolt on. It was used from the late 50's to late 60's. Tires are plentiful and they reduce freeway rpm's.They are harder to find than late model wheels, but they are out there.

sea chief · 11-21-2009, 03:56 PM

On my 1970 dumper, I found that I had to use the spit rims on the inside due to the fact that the drum was to big to allow the newer rims to bolt up.

63 & 64 Bowties · 11-21-2009, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by factorystock

I would use pre 1970 19.5" one piece dual type wheels.A direct bolt on. It was used from the late 50's to late 60's. Tires are plentiful and they reduce freeway rpm's.They are harder to find than late model wheels, but they are out there.

But, I've got FREE wheels and tires already.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sea chief

On my 1970 dumper, I found that I had to use the spit rims on the inside due to the fact that the drum was to big to allow the newer rims to bolt up.

The drum was too big where? Can you explain that please?

427 70c-30 · 12-25-2009, 11:02 PM

okay I am a LitTle late for this forum but all of you are drunk oneg nog or some thing!!!If YOU PUT ON 1973 OR NEWER RIMS,YES THE LUGS ARE SMALLER!iF YOU PUT ON THOSE RIMS,GO TO YOUR LOCAL AUTO PARTS OR TRUCK PARTS STORE AND BUY THE CAPTIVE WASHER LUGS(THE SAME ONES ON A NEW CHEVY OR GMC DUALLY) IN 1/2 SIZE,TORQUE THE RIM TO 75-90 FT/LBS AND THE RIM WILL NOT MOVE AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!THE RIMS ON A 1969-79 OR 80 ARE 4.55 OR SO HUB DIAMETER.THE EXACT SAME AS YOUR 1969!!WHEN YOU GO TO THE NEWER RIMS(1995-2009)THEN THE HUB IS 4.79 DIAMETER.ALL TRUCKS HAVE SLOP IN THE BOLT HOLES!IF THEY DID NOT HAVE SLOP THE RIMS WOULD NOT FIT ON THE TRUCK.THEY USUALLY HAVE A 1/8" MORE OR LESS.WE HAVE 2 1970 CHEVYS WITH FACTORY 19.5'S AND ONE 1969 WITH SPLIT RIM 18"S.THE 18 TRUCK HAS A 1/2" LUGS AND THAT TRUCK FROM THE FACTORY HAS A REAL SLOPPY FIT AREOUND THE LUGS.THE 19.5 TRUCKS HAVE 9/16 LUGS AND THOSE RIMS FIT OVER THE LUGS SLOPPY ALSO.AS LONG AS YOU RUN THE FACTORY TORQUE SPECS THEY WILL NOT MOVE.I HAVE A FRIEND WHO TOOK 1999 3500HD (19.5 RIMS) RE DRILLED THE HOLES TO A 8-6.5 PATTERN,USED THE FACTORY LUGS 1/2" AND RACES THIS TRUCK IN FIRE DEPT DRILL TEAMS COMPETTION AND NEVER HAD A PROBLEM.Look up on you tube......fire dept drill team and check out piston knockers or copaigue yellow birds and watch those guys.790horspower trucks and then tell me about the lugs!!

brianthelion02 · 12-28-2009, 12:08 AM

I put spacers with 14 mm lugs on my 69 c-30 so i could ose the late models lug nuts and center caps!! Wen i installed them i used 4 conical lug nuts to center the wheel then replaced them with the late model factory ones! It works great!!

68lwb292 · 12-28-2009, 01:12 AM

They use to make washers that were sightly cone shaped that were made fore this. The tire shop used them on my nissan when I put some after market wheels on it. When you torque the lug nuts the washer centers the hole on the studs and keeps them from slopping back and forth.

63 & 64 Bowties · 10-01-2010, 09:54 AM

Okay, diggin' up an old post here, but I'm just gettin' around to this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joesjunk

I drilled out the 1/2" lugs on my 68 1 ton and put in the 9/16" ones so I could use the newer wheels. Its not that hard to do, but takes some time

This is the way I was going to go. But one question; I popped a lug stud off the 92 to see how long it was and it's about 2 1/8" long. It looks to me that it's too long to insert it into the front hub. Probably about 1/2" too long. Did you use shorter studs?

Quote:

Originally Posted by 68K30

Not related to your wheel question but the dump bed looks just like the Aristocrat bed I have on my 68 K-30. What type of hoist does your bed have?

Thanks
Bill

Sorry, I have no idea. I don't see any tags anywhere.

Quote:

Originally Posted by brianthelion02

I put spacers with 14 mm lugs on my 69 c-30 so i could ose the late models lug nuts and center caps!! Wen i installed them i used 4 conical lug nuts to center the wheel then replaced them with the late model factory ones! It works great!!

Now that sounds like the easy way I was looking for. Happen to have any info on those spacers (supplier, part #?)

08-22-2009, 03:06 PM	#1
63 & 64 Bowties and a few others Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Blue Ridge Mountains of VA Posts: 5,638	a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners I've got a 69 farm use dump truck.... this one: (yea, I know. I'm gonna fix it up one of these days, honest) And, I bought a 92 3500 a while back for the engine/trans for my 53 AD. I was hoping to use the 92's wheels/tires for my 69 dump truck. I started to do the swap yesterday, then I find out the 92 has bigger wheel studs than the 69. I would imagine the bolt pattern is the same (I haven't checked yet.) But, can I use the 69 lug nuts and bolt up the 92 wheels on the 69? Anyone done this? I really want to get rid of those split ring rims. My other dilemma is that I wanted to put 4 of the 69 rims on the 92 to make it a roller, but I guess the only way to do that is to drill out the 69 rims, they're junk anyway. Any advise would be appreciated. __________________ Bill US Army Vet -193rd Infantry BlueRidgeMuscleCars.com “The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated” Gandhi

08-22-2009, 03:44 PM	#2
sailed2japan Jonny Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Outside the Box, Austin,TX Posts: 741	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners This I know about duallies, at least the 92, the rims are hub centric, not lug centric. Meaning the hub keeps the wheel in the right place for rotaion and the lugs apply the going/stopping force. That being said, as long as the hub is the same size you shouldn't have any problems swapping the rims around and drilling larger holes in the 69's to make them fit the 92. The easiest way to tell wether or not the 69's rims are hub centric is to look at the lug nuts. If the side that goes against the wheel is flat, not conicle, then they are definately hub centric. If they are conicle, it may go either way, I dn't know the specifics for that year. __________________ 1966 C30, Cummins, stacks, and a flat bed in progress... "Honor.....simply put, A veteran - whether active duty, retired, national guard or reserve is someone who, at one time in his life, wrote a blank check made payable to 'The United States of America', for an amount of 'up to and including his life.' That is Honor, and there are way too many people in this country who no longer understand it." -AEC Hundley USNR

08-22-2009, 03:51 PM	#3
Livrat Member #1049 Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Troy Montana Posts: 3,940	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners Yes the bolt pattern is the same but 1967-70 used smaller studs than the 92, Yes you could bolt them on using the 69 lug nuts. BUT.. DO NOT DO IT! It is a dangerous thing, as the wheels will "rock" back and forth under braking eventually wearing through the studs till they break.. Ask me how I know... The only way to safely use the 92 wheels is to change all of your studs on your 69 to the same diameter as the 92 wheels.. not a cheap way to go!! Yes you can drill out the split rims to make them rollers..

08-22-2009, 04:41 PM	#5
sailed2japan Jonny Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Outside the Box, Austin,TX Posts: 741	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners livrat- good point wish I had thought of that... You may be able to drill the drums as well. I would think the problem would lye in the knurls of the studs themselves. I have some dually stuff I'l pm you about. __________________ 1966 C30, Cummins, stacks, and a flat bed in progress... "Honor.....simply put, A veteran - whether active duty, retired, national guard or reserve is someone who, at one time in his life, wrote a blank check made payable to 'The United States of America', for an amount of 'up to and including his life.' That is Honor, and there are way too many people in this country who no longer understand it." -AEC Hundley USNR

08-22-2009, 04:55 PM	#6
BCOWANWHEELS Registered User Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: KINGSPORT,TN. Posts: 3,035	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners Why dont you just move the body over to the 92 frame. Then everything under the body will be 1992 __________________ I BELIEVE IN JOHN 3:16

08-22-2009, 05:19 PM	#7
Joesjunk Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Independence MO. Posts: 7,709	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners I drilled out the 1/2" lugs on my 68 1 ton and put in the 9/16" ones so I could use the newer wheels. Its not that hard to do, but takes some time __________________ 72 3/4t Custom Deluxe 402/auto 66k Original paint 71 3/4t 4x4 Custom Deluxe 10k original miles Original paint 71 3/4t Cheyenne 402 70k original paint 72 3/4t 4x4 Custom deluxe 72 3/4t 4x4 Custom deluxe 91k original paint 72 Cheyenne/30 Dually 69 Camaro SS396 4-speed 13 GMC 2500HD Duramax I bought new 05 Jeep Wrangler "Willys Edition" 12k miles (I bought new) 85 3/4 ton 4x4 Scottsdale 33k miles original paint 86 1 ton 4x4 SRW Silverado 454 restored 80 1 ton 4x4 SRW Silverado 9,434 original miles!! original paint 95 GMC 1 ton dually 4x4 my dad bought new 95 GMC 3/4 ton 4x4, regular cab 454, 31k original miles 2002 2500HD 4x4 regular cab 6.0L 67k miles 2002 2500HD 4x4 regular cab 8.1L 28k miles 2003 GMC 2500HD 4x4 regular cab Diesel 93k miles 67-72 Parts for sale

08-24-2009, 07:37 AM	#9
63 & 64 Bowties and a few others Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Blue Ridge Mountains of VA Posts: 5,638	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners any other ideas or comments? thanks __________________ Bill US Army Vet -193rd Infantry BlueRidgeMuscleCars.com “The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated” Gandhi

08-24-2009, 08:05 AM	#10
special-K Special Order Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Mt Airy, MD Posts: 85,851	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners The problem is the slop in the wheel hole.If the lugs are torqued down hard enough they could possibly keep the wheel from rocking on the studs.But,maybe not and you`ll be shearing the studs.I`d drill the hubs are press 9/16s studs in.I did it on a`70 to use chrome Budd wheels for `70s disc brake trucks. __________________ "BUILDING A BETTER WAY TO SERVE THE USA"......67/72......"The New Breed" GMC '67 C1500 Wideside Super Custom SWB: 327/M22/3.42 posi.........."The '67" (project) GMC '72 K2500 Wideside Sierra Custom Camper: 350/TH350/4.10 Power-Lok..."The '72" (rolling) Tim "Don't call me a redneck. I'm a rough cut country gentleman" R.I.P. ~ East Side Low Life ~ El Jay ~ 72BLUZ ~ Fasteddie69 ~ Ron586 ~ 67ChevyRedneck ~ Grumpy Old Man ~

11-19-2009, 05:02 PM	#11
63 & 64 Bowties and a few others Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Blue Ridge Mountains of VA Posts: 5,638	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners Dredging up an old post, but I haven't done anything yet and I have another idea. What about wheel adapters/spacers? I see ones that are as thin as 1.5" and are 8 on 6.5" to 8 on 6.5" adapters with 9/16 lugs. I'm just trying to do this the easiest way. It's just a farm truck that has dry rotted tires on split rims and I already have the newer wheels with decent tires. __________________ Bill US Army Vet -193rd Infantry BlueRidgeMuscleCars.com “The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated” Gandhi

11-19-2009, 05:28 PM	#12
slomotion Old Duffer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Maine Posts: 1,822	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners Joe'sjunk is right. Drill the drums to take the 9/16 lug and you won't have any problems, with the exception of having to buy a set of lug nuts too. The old ('69) lugs are a single piece nut that just tightens up against the wheel. The new lug nuts have a captured washer that allows the nut to turn even though the washer is against the wheel. This gives you a truer torque. Wheel spacers aren't the best idea on this size wheel because as someone above mentioned the wheels are hub centered and the farther away from the hub you get the more room for error. If you're going to fix this truck up, may as well do it right now, be safe, and on the plus side you've opened up your wheel choices dramatically. BTW, these are not conical self-centering nuts. They are flat faced relying on the hub for centering. __________________ '68 Short C20 Flatbed Dually w/ 292 4bbl, Langdon cast headers, and WC T5 trans. '81 G10 Shorty Van "Good judgement comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgement." Will Rogers "Under promise, then over achieve." Last edited by slomotion; 11-19-2009 at 05:33 PM. Reason: More info

11-20-2009, 01:21 PM	#13
68K30 Registered User Join Date: May 2007 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 99	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners Not related to your wheel question but the dump bed looks just like the Aristocrat bed I have on my 68 K-30. What type of hoist does your bed have? Thanks Bill

11-21-2009, 01:49 PM	#14
factorystock Registered User Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: west coast Posts: 3,396	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners I would use pre 1970 19.5" one piece dual type wheels.A direct bolt on. It was used from the late 50's to late 60's. Tires are plentiful and they reduce freeway rpm's.They are harder to find than late model wheels, but they are out there.

11-21-2009, 03:56 PM	#15
sea chief Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: vermont Posts: 27	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners On my 1970 dumper, I found that I had to use the spit rims on the inside due to the fact that the drum was to big to allow the newer rims to bolt up. __________________ 1967 K-20, 1969 K-20, 1970 C-30 dump,1971 K-20 1972 K-20, 1972 C-10, 1968 Grandprix John Deere 350c Dozer, 3414 International backhoe 1972 International 1600 Flatbed

12-25-2009, 11:02 PM	#17
427 70c-30 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: bellmore,long island Posts: 19	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners okay I am a LitTle late for this forum but all of you are drunk oneg nog or some thing!!!If YOU PUT ON 1973 OR NEWER RIMS,YES THE LUGS ARE SMALLER!iF YOU PUT ON THOSE RIMS,GO TO YOUR LOCAL AUTO PARTS OR TRUCK PARTS STORE AND BUY THE CAPTIVE WASHER LUGS(THE SAME ONES ON A NEW CHEVY OR GMC DUALLY) IN 1/2 SIZE,TORQUE THE RIM TO 75-90 FT/LBS AND THE RIM WILL NOT MOVE AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!THE RIMS ON A 1969-79 OR 80 ARE 4.55 OR SO HUB DIAMETER.THE EXACT SAME AS YOUR 1969!!WHEN YOU GO TO THE NEWER RIMS(1995-2009)THEN THE HUB IS 4.79 DIAMETER.ALL TRUCKS HAVE SLOP IN THE BOLT HOLES!IF THEY DID NOT HAVE SLOP THE RIMS WOULD NOT FIT ON THE TRUCK.THEY USUALLY HAVE A 1/8" MORE OR LESS.WE HAVE 2 1970 CHEVYS WITH FACTORY 19.5'S AND ONE 1969 WITH SPLIT RIM 18"S.THE 18 TRUCK HAS A 1/2" LUGS AND THAT TRUCK FROM THE FACTORY HAS A REAL SLOPPY FIT AREOUND THE LUGS.THE 19.5 TRUCKS HAVE 9/16 LUGS AND THOSE RIMS FIT OVER THE LUGS SLOPPY ALSO.AS LONG AS YOU RUN THE FACTORY TORQUE SPECS THEY WILL NOT MOVE.I HAVE A FRIEND WHO TOOK 1999 3500HD (19.5 RIMS) RE DRILLED THE HOLES TO A 8-6.5 PATTERN,USED THE FACTORY LUGS 1/2" AND RACES THIS TRUCK IN FIRE DEPT DRILL TEAMS COMPETTION AND NEVER HAD A PROBLEM.Look up on you tube......fire dept drill team and check out piston knockers or copaigue yellow birds and watch those guys.790horspower trucks and then tell me about the lugs!!

12-28-2009, 12:08 AM	#18
brianthelion02 Overdrive club Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: apache junction, arizona Posts: 819	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners I put spacers with 14 mm lugs on my 69 c-30 so i could ose the late models lug nuts and center caps!! Wen i installed them i used 4 conical lug nuts to center the wheel then replaced them with the late model factory ones! It works great!! __________________ 1971 c-10 1951 3100 chevy 1970 chevy c-30 Sold!



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12-28-2009, 01:12 AM	#19
68lwb292 Ex-Minitrucker Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Bushnell, FL Posts: 301	Re: a wheel question for 1 ton dually owners They use to make washers that were sightly cone shaped that were made fore this. The tire shop used them on my nissan when I put some after market wheels on it. When you torque the lug nuts the washer centers the hole on the studs and keeps them from slopping back and forth. Last edited by 68lwb292; 12-28-2009 at 01:12 AM.

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