Here's How I Left My Truck

[magwakeenercew2jh]

I've tried to talk quite a few folks "off of the ledge" when it comes to this hobby...Maybe it's my turn.

The background is that after three years of grease grit and money-pitting, I basically finished (no body work or paint)
RAT 1968 a couple of weeks ago. I was trying to get ready for the C/10 Gathering in Atw$#%r, but didn't make it.

That Saturday (last Saturday), I thought I ran out of gas. Stupid. But, I'd put four gallons in and went for a test-spin.
The gas gage is the big quandry on this one....More on that in a second....

Bogged and quit close to the house. My woman came with tools and gas. I primed the carb, added four more gallons.
Fired up and drove home (1 mile). Did a 6 mi. chore Sunday morning and put almost five more gallons in. Started for the dump.
Fuel delivery problems four miles from the house.

Came home on the back of a "tow truck".

Re-installed the filter up top by the carb, installed a nice one down at tank-spigot level under the cab. Fired some air up the open
vent tube with the sealed (non venting) cap and fuel came flooding out the supply line that I'd disconnected by the fuel pump.

Re-plumbed everything, then put a vented cap on and fired her up. No problem. Drove straight to the gas station and put in $80 of 91 octane (16 gals.).
Drove around the house ....about five miles....about four dollars worth of 91 blew all over the side of the truck. Nice cap, huh? I'm hoping the non-vented cap
wasn't the issue...But I'm going to have to try it again. It's the only one I can find that actually seals.....

My fuel gage is the problem that finally had me hang up the guns. For how long, I don't know. Maybe I'm done altogether.

I have three fuel gages. One installed, and two outside of the dash. I bought a brand new sending unit from Summit....Brass float. The gage in the dash
"tickles" by turning the key on, that is to say, the needle rises from about 5:30 to 3:00 and stops there. BTW, all this is this before I filled up with gas...
Who knows how much gas I had? Maybe six gallons. Maybe a little less.

So, with the new sending unit in place, I ran a new wire straight to the "Fuel" blade on the fuse block. No difference.

So, I made up a couple of leads, attached the left (variable ground - tan) to the back of one of the gages and put it on the floor. Another lead attached to
the 12v + side of the gage, out the window, and directly to the battery terminal. It read full. Swept to full. I know I might have had six gallons in there.
But it wasn't full. I fiddled around with the "tit" on the sending unit. Made sure it wasn't grounding out on the sending unit flange(s), then tried the other
gage the same way. Read full. Swept to full, no matter what. Suggesting 100% ground.

Couldn't be more pure. Clean, new wires of the proper gage Straight to 12v +, and straight to the "tit" on a brand-new sending unit.

Three different gages. Two read full, and the one in the dash swung to 3:00 (I'm guessing that needle is bogus). I tried grounding the two ancillary
gage bodies and no difference. They read "Full" no matter what.

Now, since I filled up to the brim, I can't do anything...so I'm covering up the pig and
calling it quits.

The "hobby" is now a nightmare. So, I'm gonna make it all better by forgetting I own that $%^&(&! Maybe forever. 17 grand in it before paint, ..
probably worth 3. I'd probably sell her for $0.32 tonight.

[Square_78]

That stuff can be so damn frustrating. I feel your pain. Just think about something else for a bit and you'll maybe think of a different plan of attack. Have u tried the gauges in another truck to make sure they are good?
Posted via Mobile Device

[Square_78]

Also pretty sure yOu need a vented cap. Mine is the style tank behind the seat and mine is vented. How's your fuel pump? Any leaks? I'm sure someone here can offer some solid suggestions. You're truck is really sweet. Hopefully it's not covered up for too long.
Posted via Mobile Device

[magwakeenercew2jh]

Originally Posted by Square_78

That stuff can be so damn frustrating. I feel your pain. Just think about something else for a bit and you'll maybe think of a different plan of attack. Have u tried the gauges in another truck to make sure they are good?
Posted via Mobile Device

Thanks, Square. That's a good point. I figured because the two gages stopped at EXACTLY full, and the one in the truck moved as well, that something other than the two gages was "fubarred". Maybe that new sending unit?

I think it's supposed to read 90 ohms somewhere... ...but I'm not sure how to do that properly. Resistance measured on the ohm meter between ground and variable ground on the "tit" of the sending unit? The old sending unit I pulled and threw away read 45 ohms between the body of the sending unit and the "tit" no matter what position the float lever was in.....
Then I took that cup on the old sending unit apart and ran the meter connection over the little circuit inside. No change. 45...maybe 46 ohms across the whole little ribbon circuit.

Maybe I'll buy a new, new, new aftermarket fuel gage tomorrow and check to see if.......wait a minute...I already covered the pig up. And If I DID do that, it'd read "Full" now for sure...if it was accurate. If it knew I just spent $80 on gas.

Boy, am I a sicko!

[magwakeenercew2jh]

Originally Posted by Square_78

Also pretty sure yOu need a vented cap. Mine is the style tank behind the seat and mine is vented. How's your fuel pump? Any leaks? I'm sure someone here can offer some solid suggestions. You're truck is really sweet. Hopefully it's not covered up for too long.
[size=1]

Thanks again. I'll try to run with the vented cap, as the biggest recent problem was riding in the cab of the tow truck after fuel starvation....If there's some sort of vacuum dynamics I'm missing,
I don't want to starve the pump. And if there's even a POSSIBILITY that the vented cap will keep the pressure in the right place, I'm going with it. It'd really be nice to find one that didn't spew gas
all over Northern California, though. The one I got from Brothers wasn't even close to a close fit...

As for the pump? Well, when things are screwed up, everything is suspect. It's new, mechanical, no leaks, and works fine... I think. Previously, when gas was flowing to it, I got a 3-5 pound reading at the
liquid filled PSI gage right before the carb.

Which is another bogus deal. This afternoon, while the truck was running ...first at idle, and then goosing it, that gage showed "0". I whacked it with the back side of a big screw driver and it started reading
2.5 lbs on idle and just under 4 with some throttle. One more crap-storm. A gage that was supposed to help diagnose a problem that needs its own diagnosis....

[mr48chev]

These trucks have to have a vented cap. If you are blowing fuel out when you undo the non vented cap it is because the sides of the tank are popping back into place when you relieve the vacuum that the fuel pump has created in the non vented tank. They don't "build pressure" they get a vacuum that causes the engine to stall when there is no more air in the tank to suck down. That is one reason the truck drove further before quitting with 4 gallons of gas in the tank then it did with a full tank.

I ran into the same thing with my 51 Mercury when I put it back together in the early 80's and bought a new "vented" cap from the parts house I did business with daily. The car quit after about 4 miles and fired right back up after I walked to a station and put gas in it. The next morning It quit in the same spot again but I was ready for it with gas in the gas can in the trunk. When I opened the cap air rushed into the tank and the bottom popped back out puking a bit of gas out the neck. It took three new caps before I actually got a vented cap that worked.

[LockDoc]

-
A couple more things... Are you running a quadrajet? If so have you tried changing the small filter in the carb where the fuel line connects?

Second, did your truck originally have an idiot light cluster that was changed over to a gauge cluster by chance?

Just a couple of things that could make a big difference.

LockDoc

[magwakeenercew2jh]

Hey, mr48.

My tank is vented. Do you think that the vent isn't big enough to keep up with the pressure being created by the fuel pump when I'm using a sealed cap? (The vent runs out of the top of the tank on the passenger's side, loops up into the side of the roof and then back down to the frame and forward to its opening near the fuel pump).

The spewing of gas I get is because the vented cap doesn't seal properly. It spews out while I'm driving. You know where I can get a decent vented cap like yours that'll keep the gas in the tank where it belongs?

[magwakeenercew2jh]

Originally Posted by LockDoc

-
A couple more things... Are you running a quadrajet? If so have you tried changing the small filter in the carb where the fuel line connects?

Second, did your truck originally have an idiot light cluster that was changed over to a gauge cluster by chance?

Just a couple of things that could make a big difference.

LockDoc

Hey LocDoc.

I'm running a new carb. A Street Demon.

I had so many parts that all went together that were never before "married", that this cluster....well, at least the dash's new printed circuit might not be set up right.
Or, I guess more importantly, panel connector might be pinned wrong...However, all the other gages on the panel seem to be working correctly. Meaning, turn signals,
charging, the panel lights, etc. But I better check to see if the circuit goes to 12v on the right of the fuel gage (looking at it from the rear), and that the path from the
left screw goes to the "Fuel" blade on the fuse block.

But why do you think I'd get a loser reading with direct connections to + and to the sender - with those other "test" gages?

Am I checking the ohms of the sending unit properly by just using an ohm meter at a full ground and on the sender's "tit", and looking for 90 ohms?

Should I pull the sender out and test it for the proper ohms before I spend $$$ on another gage to gage the gage? ..
What should the ohms ratings be at the float lever's different levels?

Sorry for the questions...You guys are starting to make me think I should keep working on this beast. I love a puzzle......
There are just so many on this bas%^#d.

[808_67C10]

Keep working bro... Don't give up! Mean lookin truck, you will figure it out then it will be awesome,
Posted via Mobile Device

[LockDoc]

Originally Posted by magwakeenercew2jh

Hey LocDoc.

I'm running a new carb. A Street Demon.

I had so many parts that all went together that were never before "married", that this cluster....well, at least the dash's new printed circuit might not be set up right.
Or, I guess more importantly, panel connector might be pinned wrong...However, all the other gages on the panel seem to be working correctly. Meaning, turn signals,
charging, the panel lights, etc. But I better check to see if the circuit goes to 12v on the right of the fuel gage (looking at it from the rear), and that the path from the
left screw goes to the "Fuel" blade on the fuse block.

But why do you think I'd get a loser reading with direct connections to + and to the sender - with those other "test" gages?

Am I checking the ohms of the sending unit properly by just using an ohm meter at a full ground and on the sender's "tit", and looking for 90 ohms?

Should I pull the sender out and test it for the proper ohms before I spend $$$ on another gage to gage the gage? ..
What should the ohms ratings be at the float lever's different levels?

Sorry for the questions...You guys are starting to make me think I should keep working on this beast. I love a puzzle......
There are just so many on this bas%^#d.

I finally gave up on my Demon carb. I could never get it adjusted correctly.

To test the sender you take it out of the tank, put the red lead on the pin, black lead on the sender itself and move the float arm up and down. It should read anywhere from 0-90 ohms depending on where the float arm is as you move it. It helps to have two people to do this...

LockDoc

[magwakeenercew2jh]

Originally Posted by LockDoc

To test the sender you take it out of the tank, put the red lead on the pin, black lead on the sender itself and move the float arm up and down. It should read anywhere from 0-90 ohms depending on where the float arm is as you move it. It helps to have two people to do this...

Thanks. I'm gonna do it.....But maybe I should wait a few days until I stop being P.O.'d.

You guys all really helped. I appreciate your responses.

[oldschool18]

That bird wont stop staring at me......he looks very angry. Keep at it man the last truck I got done i had it painted and had it all back together went to take it out for its first trip in a few years and the new battery wasnt charging, it was a bad bulb in the battery dummy light that went bad and I had put brand new bulbs in everywhere before I put the dash back together so you never know if the new parts is working.....and I like that truck

[birdistheword]

I feel your pain. I bought my 72 K-10 while on leave from the Army and everytime I come home to the U.S. once a year there is always a leak from somewhere that turns into a leak from something else and so on. I come home to enjoy it but leave being pissed off at it cause I spent most of my vacation time fixing it.

[Square_78]

ive never had gas leak out the filler neck. Even with a vented cap, I dont think that should happen?

[no moa]

Gas gauges SUCK! I deal with them dang near everyday in boats, Take a break for a couple days, and jump back in with both feet. You'll find it when you least expect it.
Truck looks awesome. Love those wheels.

[big_al_71]

Many great suggestions thus far. this is what I would do i would leave it covered for a few days and dont even think about it go back at it and start from the basics if you can even ask someone to help you (this is what I do) you will be surprised how quickly you can solve some of these problems by just steppeing away and letting someone else do it.

good luck!!! and dont give up!!

[ubtripn]

Whatever you do, don't make any rash choices, just walk away for a while until you can consider things in a calmer light. I always have to.

[HotRod C/10]

Originally Posted by magwakeenercew2jh

I've tried to talk quite a few folks "off of the ledge" when it comes to this hobby...Maybe it's my turn.

The background is that after three years of grease grit and money-pitting, I basically finished (no body work or paint)
RAT 1968 a couple of weeks ago. I was trying to get ready for the C/10 Gathering in Atw$#%r, but didn't make it.

That Saturday (last Saturday), I thought I ran out of gas. Stupid. But, I'd put four gallons in and went for a test-spin.
The gas gage is the big quandry on this one....More on that in a second....

Bogged and quit close to the house. My woman came with tools and gas. I primed the carb, added four more gallons.
Fired up and drove home (1 mile). Did a 6 mi. chore Sunday morning and put almost five more gallons in. Started for the dump.
Fuel delivery problems four miles from the house.

Came home on the back of a "tow truck".

Re-installed the filter up top by the carb, installed a nice one down at tank-spigot level under the cab. Fired some air up the open
vent tube with the sealed (non venting) cap and fuel came flooding out the supply line that I'd disconnected by the fuel pump.

Re-plumbed everything, then put a vented cap on and fired her up. No problem. Drove straight to the gas station and put in $80 of 91 octane (16 gals.).
Drove around the house ....about five miles....about four dollars worth of 91 blew all over the side of the truck. Nice cap, huh? I'm hoping the non-vented cap
wasn't the issue...But I'm going to have to try it again. It's the only one I can find that actually seals.....

My fuel gage is the problem that finally had me hang up the guns. For how long, I don't know. Maybe I'm done altogether.

I have three fuel gages. One installed, and two outside of the dash. I bought a brand new sending unit from Summit....Brass float. The gage in the dash
"tickles" by turning the key on, that is to say, the needle rises from about 5:30 to 3:00 and stops there. BTW, all this is this before I filled up with gas...
Who knows how much gas I had? Maybe six gallons. Maybe a little less.

So, with the new sending unit in place, I ran a new wire straight to the "Fuel" blade on the fuse block. No difference.

So, I made up a couple of leads, attached the left (variable ground - tan) to the back of one of the gages and put it on the floor. Another lead attached to
the 12v + side of the gage, out the window, and directly to the battery terminal. It read full. Swept to full. I know I might have had six gallons in there.
But it wasn't full. I fiddled around with the "tit" on the sending unit. Made sure it wasn't grounding out on the sending unit flange(s), then tried the other
gage the same way. Read full. Swept to full, no matter what. Suggesting 100% ground.

Couldn't be more pure. Clean, new wires of the proper gage Straight to 12v +, and straight to the "tit" on a brand-new sending unit.

Three different gages. Two read full, and the one in the dash swung to 3:00 (I'm guessing that needle is bogus). I tried grounding the two ancillary
gage bodies and no difference. They read "Full" no matter what.

Now, since I filled up to the brim, I can't do anything...so I'm covering up the pig and
calling it quits.

The "hobby" is now a nightmare. So, I'm gonna make it all better by forgetting I own that $%^&(&! Maybe forever. 17 grand in it before paint, ..
probably worth 3. I'd probably sell her for $0.32 tonight.

Using two filters lowers your fuel pressure. I had this same issue on a quadrajet setup years ago. Pull one and try it.