Something new I learned today..

[bubba327]

Still learning new stuff..
So I started my 64 very early the other morning to head out for work. It was the first big frost of the year,and so I got out of the truck to let it warm up and started to scrape on the frost covering the windshield..
I heard an electrical arcing going on under the front end sounding like a bad spark plug wire.
I found the arc and it was coming from a inline oil filter located in the power steering return line.
Sparks was arcing around the filter and the corrugated cooling ribs of the filter itself in a rapid arc about 1 or 2 arcs arc per seconds and very visible in the dark and could be heard over the idling motor. Kinda looked like a mild Tesla coil as it was all around the filter case but not arcing to the frame or anything else. Just arcs from the rib to rib of the filter itself in a random pattern...

Really strange as the filter is located in totally rubber lines and hangs down by the radiator away from anything else in the area.
I have power steering , Hydroboost brakes and an in-line NAPA high micron filter designed as for use in power steering or transmission fluid applications .
Now I did a little research and found this site dealing with static electricity in hydraulic lines involving friction and filters.
http://www.machinerylubrication.com/...arge-hydraulic

I have never heard or seen anything like it..
Any body else run into this????

Picture is of the filter, Sparks will not show in a picture, it is too dark but I did try..
Bubba

[chevy_man5]

Do you need to ground the rubber hoses? LOL

[rcbildr]

Haven't experienced that on a car, but at work once or twice. A place I worked at bought a oil pump transfer cart, it had two filters on it and moved a lot of oil in a short period of time. When I first used it I was filling up the main hydraulic unit for the plant, takes about 150gal of oil, I had my arm resting on the plastic hose and noticed the hair on my arm was standing straight up....just to be safe we later grounded that thing as best as we could.

[Captainfab]

Huh! Interesting....I have never heard or seen anything like that.

I don't hear to many people mention the Tesla coil. Most people don't seem to know who he was.

[jjzepplin]

WOW. Wonder if that could start a fire???

[bk2life]

Originally Posted by jjzepplin

WOW. Wonder if that could start a fire???

if there is fuel around that spark sure would.

Originally Posted by Captainfab

I don't hear to many people mention the Tesla coil. Most people don't seem to know who he was.

only one of the most influential people of our time!!

[glos55]

Interesting!! Thanks for sharing!!

[chevy_man5]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

Huh! Interesting....I have never heard or seen anything like that.

I don't hear to many people mention the Tesla coil. Most people don't seem to know who he was.

I thought Tesla was a hair band from the late 80's.


Kidding!! My boss has a small Tesla coil in the office here, that we fire up once in a while and light some fluorescent tubes for people visiting the office.

[1963c-10]

Any chance its jumping form the frame to the hose clamps?

[oldtrux]

i'm thinking ground engine to frame

[bubba327]

Originally Posted by 1963c-10

Any chance its jumping form the frame to the hose clamps?

No the arc is jumping across the ribs in a random pattern usually from the middle to the downstream end but will work it way all around all the sides of the filter. Never seen it jump to ground . just stays on the filter housing.
When I reread the link for the dozenth time I know It is exactly what is happening..


To cut and paste from the article now ...

"Electrostatic discharge usually manifests itself as a clicking sound as charge repeatedly increases and discharges to surfaces of lower voltage (usually earth or ground) through sparking. The clicking frequency depends on the charging rate. Clearly, if the discharge occurs in a flammable atmosphere the effect can be serious, but these instances are rare. A discharge within the system is usually short-lived and extinguished by the hydraulic fluid. This can result in etching of the discharged surface, perhaps removing microscopic particles and leaving carbon deposits on the surface. There is also evidence that localized discharge can result from lubricated surfaces, especially in geared and bearing systems with a high air content. This can contribute to pitting of surfaces.

If the filter is made of nonconductive material, it will acquire a charge when the fluid charges. The charge will not be able to dissipate or relax into the filtration system due to the high resistivity of the material. The filter will act as a capacitor and charge until the voltage is great enough to overcome the gap and discharge to a lower potential. If the filter is charged with a high enough voltage, it can discharge to the metal parts of the filter assembly housing, causing surface damage to the housing, burn marks and other damage to the filter element. A clicking or rattling sound in the filter housing caused by sparking indicates this cycle of charging and discharging."

[bubba327]

Originally Posted by oldtrux

i'm thinking ground engine to frame

The engine is solidly grounded to frame now and to battery negative post also . The arcs stay on the filter housing which is completely isolated by rubber hoses.
Now the original lines have a steel section and a short rubber flexible section. Do they have a steel braid in the rubber which would ground out or relax the charge caused by the filter?? Maybe by having approx 36" of 3/8 rubber I may have too much ungrounded distance.
I wonder I can get a measureable reading with a meter either to frame ground or from filter to the metallic piping of the steering box or steering pump
So I will try a different filter with less of a micron rating first, This one may be partially clogged with contaminants from the used hydro booster and cooler that were installed.

[bubba327]

Originally Posted by chevy_man5

I thought Tesla was a hair band from the late 80's.

Jason I knew you were a old head banger-- I bet you had big hair too

[chevy_man5]

Originally Posted by bubba327

Jason I knew you were a old head banger-- I bet you had big hair too

"Were"?? No big hair here... but I rocked the mullet! LOL