Questions about driving stick shift- 4 speed on floor

[dzwestwindsor]

Hello,

I have a 71 C20 with a 4 speed on the floor. I have had this vehicle for only a short period of time, with no previous stick shift driving experience. But I managed to make it home from the seller and I've taken it around the block a few times. However, I have many questions about driving stick in this vehicle (Please bear with me if some of these questions are pathetic)

1. If I'm starting up in gear 2, how long does it usually take for the driver to completely release the clutch after the catch point? I'm finding myself depressing the clutch for at least a few seconds, otherwise I stall or jump forward. But then, I'm afraid that I'm on the clutch too long, damaging the clutch.

2. If I'm starting in 2nd, what should my RPMs be when the clutch comes in contact?

3. It's acceptable to start in 2nd gear, right?

4. From 2nd gear, at what RPM should I shift to 3rd gear? Also, what is the lowest RPM I can maintain in 2 or 3 before I need to downshift or put in the clutch?

5. When the vehicle is moving, it seems that it's not possible to put it in 1st, because it just makes a loud clicking noise. Why is this?

If anyone has any other tips or suggestions, I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you so much.

-David

[Wootdog]

googled it for you. This is one of many training articles on driving a manual.
Kerry

http://www.wikihow.com/Drive-Smoothl...l-Transmission

[Codez67Chevy]

All I have to say is just drive the truck as much as you can to get used to it. Every truck is different. Every manual tranny is different. I've drivin lots of manual trucks and everyone was completely different. One reason why 1st gear grinds is because its a very low gear so you need to be going really so to get it in that gear. Also depending on your gear ratio in your rear end. 1st gear might be so low you won't even use it. My truck is a 4spd and I don't even use it to start out with unless I'm pulling a load. So on that note just go out and drive it!!!! That is the only way my friend. Good luck with your new ride and please post some picks. We gotta see what it looks like!!

[Codez67Chevy]

Also just listen to the engine when your in gear you don't want to shift too early or at too high of a RPM. You'll find the sweet spots once you get used to it.

[Mike C]

First gear is unsynchronized in a granny 4 speed. You need to be at a dead stop to engage. Just like reverse. 2nd gear is perfect for starting off in on the road 99% of the time. It is a 3.5:1 ratio (my CJ-5 is 3.0:1 for comparison, 1st gear in its 3 speed.)

Practice, practice, practice, then practice some more. See how low you can let the clutch out without killing it. That's about the right amount. Slip the clutch as little as possible and it lasts the longest. I got 252,000 miles on the original clutch in my Jimmy.

[Bill Houghton]

About not being able to shift into first when the truck is moving: most older manual transmissions did not have synchronizers on first gear. You want to be completely stopped to shift into a non-synchro first (well, in theory, you can shift into a non-synchro gear by double-clutching and careful matching of rpm's, but the reality is you stand a good chance of chipping a gear; I know. And it's especially easy to chip a gear if the transmission uses helical rather than straight-cut gears; by the early 70s, helical gears [which are quieter and smoother] would have been common).

A high percentage of the older - 1960s and older - four-speed transmissions were "farm geared," with first gear low enough to pull the tractor out of the mud when it got stuck, or haul an overloaded livestock trailer*. Early 70s were kind of a transitional period for trucks; depending on your final drive, your truck may be farm geared or economy/sports-oriented.

Try it: stop the truck, put it in first gear, and start out. If you're hearing the tranny working really really hard and the motor's going fast just about right away, it's probably farm geared.

There's a lot of art to driving a manual transmission. I learned to drive at the time that it was becoming no longer standard to teach kids to drive a stick; but I grew up in a car family, and we were expected to know. You'll learn. Read about it, think about it, be aware that you mustn't ride the clutch, and that, if you're having to feather the clutch for a block to get the motor/truck comfortable, it's too high a gear. But don't overthink it; just learn to feel when it's right.
-------------
*Heck, even a lot of the three-speeds were farm geared. The 1947 Studebaker half-ton Dad had at the gas station was geared so low that you couldn't get across an intersection without having to shift out of first, and by 50 mph in third gear, that old truck was wrung out. Great truck, though.

[lap15]

Don't worry about formulas or RPM's....practice in an empty parking lot and listen to the engine, the engine sound will tell you when to shift. After you get the feel of your truck, you will LOVE the whine sound it makes. Having a stick is awesome!

[Alex V.]

Agree with everything said above. From the sound of it your transmission has an unsynchronized 1st gear (i.e., it isn't designed to be shifted into 1st while the truck is moving - pretty much a standing-start or uphill-takeoff pulling gear). (Note: This type of transmission is commonly referred to as a "granny low" 4-speed.) I know on my Suburban's tranny, the gap between 2nd and 3rd is much wider than between 3rd and 4th so it's necessary to stay in second longer than what feels natural to make the shift. I don't judge my shift points by RPM and never have, so just drive it and get a feel for the comfortable shift points; you don't have to keep it wound like a 3-day clock, but if the engine is lugging (RPM's are too low to generate any power and the engine struggles to accelerate) after letting the clutch out just move your shift speed up a bit. It should come rather quickly and after that it'll stay with you from now on.

Good luck and have fun with it!

[JointTech]

you just have to feel it. like was said every engine/transmission/clutch is different. Drive it. Get used to it. Practice taking off from a steep hill without rolling back!!
I used to have to set the hand brake on an old dump truck to take off from a hill without running over the idiot behind me.

A lot of transmissions that grind going into first if you just put it in second and then to first it sometimes helps syncronize and slip in.

[mikey531]

When my son was learning I took him to a cemetery, I had hills, intersections and no traffic. Starting on a hill takes practice and finding the sweet spot to hold you.

[special-K]

There's actually just a bit of clutch slipping necessary to get the truck going smoothly. Listen to the engine. If it's revving and not pulling you need to move it out a bit faster.On a flat surface you can practice letting the clutch out without using any throttle. Just practice how that works and the rest will come to you

[camrycurt]

Agree with everything said above. In the SM465, granny 1st and reverse are unsynchronised so you have to be at a dead stop to shift into either one of those. Both of those gears are so low that I just lift my foot off the clutch at idle and the truck starts to move. If I give it any gas at all starting in 1st or reverse my truck will buck and jump.

For normal street driving you can start out in 2nd. Granny low is only for towing, big loads, real tough work, etc. Some guys even start in 3rd, but I find that a little trickier. Alot of times you can start in 2nd and jump right over to 4th.

And if you have any forward momentum at all and need to downshift (for going around a turn, etc.) don't even try going into 2nd - you'll never get it engaged unless you slow almost to a stop - third gear is all you need to drop into. Unless I'm just creeping along I only use 3rd and 4th.

The SM465 is a great truck transmission and is a lot of fun. It's a tough transmission too, so just get out and drive and enjoy your truck.

Hope that helps! Have fun!

[RHGuyettejr]

Just a few tips that helped me out when I was learning...

Park the truck on a hill. (You'll want to be in first for this one) keep the clutch held down, and foot on the brake. Slowly let the brake out, you should start to roll back. Play around until you have the clutch let out enough that when your foot comes off the brake the truck doesn't roll back, but doesn't stall either. Typically the vehicle wont roll back at this point until you start to press the gas in, but by that time you can let out the clutch a bit more and be on your way. This helped me get a feel for the clutch a lot. I learned when my boss handed me the keys to a WRX and told me to gas it up... (used to work for subaru), not the best experience, but ever since I have found that by doing this I could feel out the sweet spot in the clutch.

Another tip, if your trans is a little sloppy, On these I have found that if it won't go into first at a dead stop, pop it in reverse, then go to first. Usually lines up the gears well. I always start in first gear, but it is unnecessary on flat ground, second is a low enough ratio that you won't wreck anything, just dont try to pull a boat out of the lake starting in 3rd.... long story. haha.

Hope that helps a bit.

[54belair]

Driving a stick is nearly a lost art. All suggestions above are good and accurate. Maaany years ago I taught my wife to drive. I had a mustang 4 speed, after our first trip out---I brought her home and bought two large sponges. I told her that when one sponge was fully depressed, the other had to be full size----and your feet have to work together--left down slowly as right comes up (off the gas)---then as left comes up--ease slowly down with right again. Everything should be fluid movements and not jerky.

Practice, practice, practice-------it never came easy---just training your reflexes.

Im building my project truck now with a car 4 speed----mainly to be able to teach my grandson how to drive a stick. By the time he gets the truck, for sure a stick will be something of the past.